Wilder promising big overhaul - some development on Monday

TurnbullsCans said:
It would be very harsh to bin Payero on the grounds of attitude so early in his Boto life. He’s a young lad, moved half way around the world and is playing for a local club in the Champo. Plus he was starting to show some metal then got injured. He should at least be given some allowance for all of that and a run of games in the side. It would be premature to just him him off, imo.
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Wilder is absolutely right to weed out players with either bad attitude, poor application, or weak character.
He is also right to move on players who have market value who he doesn't rate as highly as that market value, or who just don't fit his system.

Whether I trust the recruitment after a disastrous January I'm not so sure of.
Whether I can pretend Wilder doesn't deserve criticism when we were 5th on New Year's Day, I'm also not so sure of.

Yesterday's insulting show made me stop making excuses for people.

I'd chase Connolly, Balogun and Siliki on monday, and tell Sporar and Taylor they can leave now too.
I'd pay off Ameobi - a disastrous signing - and look to move on Akpom, Lumley, Hall, Ikpeazu, Fisher, Olusanya and Coulson. They are all just not good enough.
None of those 13 players are an asset to our 2022-23 first team squad. We will not miss any of these players, though many obviously need replacing with better.
They will generate literally no profit on sales. Some will cost money to bin, though I believe Akpom has already been impaired off the books..

I'd proactively sell:
Spence because there is no way back and he will generate a massive fee.
Fry if I could get the big fee he is allegedly worth. The lad is so soft and lumbering I can't believe it. Horror show yesterday. He is regressing. A fit Bamba is a miles better player.
Tavernier for a big fee, simply because I don't think he is worth the contract he would want to stay, or that we will get a bigger fee for him in the future. At least he seems to care and I wish him well.
McNair for a good fee. He is not good enough to oust Dijksteel on the right, strong enough to play centre back, or balanced enough to play that left side role. He is too slow to play in midfield.
If we don't sell Tav or McNair for decent fees, then I'd be happy enough to retain them both.
There are 4 players there who you would expect to be first teamers, but we could generate over £40m profit by selling them now. That would be terrific business and provide the funds needed to rebuild.

I would give Peltier and Bamba another season each as cover, as much for their attitude as anything else. But they can provide adequate cover.
I'd give Howson a year on same terms, or 2 years on reduced terms and leave the ball in his court. I'd like him to stay, but he's not the messiah.
I'd keep Daniels who hasn't done a lot wrong at all, at least as back up.

I would retain the excellent Dijksteel, and Crooks, Watmore, Coburn.
I would personally keep Payero, (but realise he may not be in Wilder's plans).
Young Boyd Munce deserves every chance to be worth a place in the squad.
I'd retain Bola as I think he is a good left back, but can he play in this awful wing back/overlapping centre backs system? (Why play a system we don't have the players for/why keep the players who can't play the system).
Similarly I'd keep Fisher as cover at right back, but again can he play RWB???
McGree was so bad yesterday it was literally unbelievable. He is a strange player and I haven't made up my mind yet. Jesus he was horrendous yesterday.
Jones needs a rocket fixing permanently just beneath his ****. In the first half yesterday he was scandalous. He needs to sort himself out, though has obvious talent/ability.

That means a lot of quality recruitment, hence the need to generate a budget.

2xCF, LCB, CB, LWB, 2xCM, GK all to start in the first team if those mentioned above do leave and the others stay.
Plus RWB cover, CF cover.
We need to bring in 10 very good footballers.
There will be some good Frees, some Loans.
But with a large budget, I expect to see some big money being spent and without jeopardising FFP.
I think this is going to be a hectic summer window and it absolutely needs to be.
 
Warwickboro said:
OK, I've been fiercely critical since the Burnley debacle, but that was as good an interview as I've heard from a manager. I'll still say he needs to get things going very quickly next year or the pressure will hit very quickly, but that was very good indeed.
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If there is one thing to take from this season is don't panic too soon, if we are sure Wilder is the man then time is required. Look at Forest and their start and where they are now, plus we took 6 points off them
 
indeedido said:
Wilder is absolutely right to weed out players with either bad attitude, poor application, or weak character.
He is also right to move on players who have market value who he doesn't rate as highly as that market value, or who just don't fit his system.

Whether I trust the recruitment after a disastrous January I'm not so sure of.
Whether I can pretend Wilder doesn't deserve criticism when we were 5th on New Year's Day, I'm also not so sure of.

Yesterday's insulting show made me stop making excuses for people.

I'd chase Connolly, Balogun and Siliki on monday, and tell Sporar and Taylor they can leave now too.
I'd pay off Ameobi - a disastrous signing - and look to move on Akpom, Lumley, Hall, Ikpeazu, Fisher, Olusanya and Coulson. They are all just not good enough.
None of those 13 players are an asset to our 2022-23 first team squad. We will not miss any of these players, though many obviously need replacing with better.
They will generate literally no profit on sales. Some will cost money to bin, though I believe Akpom has already been impaired off the books..

I'd proactively sell:
Spence because there is no way back and he will generate a massive fee.
Fry if I could get the big fee he is allegedly worth. The lad is so soft and lumbering I can't believe it. Horror show yesterday. He is regressing. A fit Bamba is a miles better player.
Tavernier for a big fee, simply because I don't think he is worth the contract he would want to stay, or that we will get a bigger fee for him in the future. At least he seems to care and I wish him well.
McNair for a good fee. He is not good enough to oust Dijksteel on the right, strong enough to play centre back, or balanced enough to play that left side role. He is too slow to play in midfield.
If we don't sell Tav or McNair for decent fees, then I'd be happy enough to retain them both.
There are 4 players there who you would expect to be first teamers, but we could generate over £40m profit by selling them now. That would be terrific business and provide the funds needed to rebuild.

I would give Peltier and Bamba another season each as cover, as much for their attitude as anything else. But they can provide adequate cover.
I'd give Howson a year on same terms, or 2 years on reduced terms and leave the ball in his court. I'd like him to stay, but he's not the messiah.
I'd keep Daniels who hasn't done a lot wrong at all, at least as back up.

I would retain the excellent Dijksteel, and Crooks, Watmore, Coburn.
I would personally keep Payero, (but realise he may not be in Wilder's plans).
Young Boyd Munce deserves every chance to be worth a place in the squad.
I'd retain Bola as I think he is a good left back, but can he play in this awful wing back/overlapping centre backs system? (Why play a system we don't have the players for/why keep the players who can't play the system).
Similarly I'd keep Fisher as cover at right back, but again can he play RWB???
McGree was so bad yesterday it was literally unbelievable. He is a strange player and I haven't made up my mind yet. Jesus he was horrendous yesterday.
Jones needs a rocket fixing permanently just beneath his ****. In the first half yesterday he was scandalous. He needs to sort himself out, though has obvious talent/ability.

That means a lot of quality recruitment, hence the need to generate a budget.

2xCF, LCB, CB, LWB, 2xCM, GK all to start in the first team if those mentioned above do leave and the others stay.
Plus RWB cover, CF cover.
We need to bring in 10 very good footballers.
There will be some good Frees, some Loans.
But with a large budget, I expect to see some big money being spent and without jeopardising FFP.
I think this is going to be a hectic summer window and it absolutely needs to be.
Click to expand...
I think If Tav doesn’t sign a new deal will definetly be sold but I do think alongside Crooks he is better than McGree. McGree seems to be a good cover player not sure I would be Comfortable with him being the main man. I think you could be right on Fry too, I think at times we have actually looked better with Bamba playing. We neee a dominant centre half and it could be time to cash in on Dael. He also picks up little injuries which are frustrating.

Dijksteel
Jones
Crooks
Watmore
And Tav if he signs a deal are players I would most like to keep.

Also Howson too, think he will be happy to stay
 
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indeedido said:
Wilder is absolutely right to weed out players with either bad attitude, poor application, or weak character.
He is also right to move on players who have market value who he doesn't rate as highly as that market value, or who just don't fit his system.

Whether I trust the recruitment after a disastrous January I'm not so sure of.
Whether I can pretend Wilder doesn't deserve criticism when we were 5th on New Year's Day, I'm also not so sure of.

Yesterday's insulting show made me stop making excuses for people.

I'd chase Connolly, Balogun and Siliki on monday, and tell Sporar and Taylor they can leave now too.
I'd pay off Ameobi - a disastrous signing - and look to move on Akpom, Lumley, Hall, Ikpeazu, Fisher, Olusanya and Coulson. They are all just not good enough.
None of those 13 players are an asset to our 2022-23 first team squad. We will not miss any of these players, though many obviously need replacing with better.
They will generate literally no profit on sales. Some will cost money to bin, though I believe Akpom has already been impaired off the books..

I'd proactively sell:
Spence because there is no way back and he will generate a massive fee.
Fry if I could get the big fee he is allegedly worth. The lad is so soft and lumbering I can't believe it. Horror show yesterday. He is regressing. A fit Bamba is a miles better player.
Tavernier for a big fee, simply because I don't think he is worth the contract he would want to stay, or that we will get a bigger fee for him in the future. At least he seems to care and I wish him well.
McNair for a good fee. He is not good enough to oust Dijksteel on the right, strong enough to play centre back, or balanced enough to play that left side role. He is too slow to play in midfield.
If we don't sell Tav or McNair for decent fees, then I'd be happy enough to retain them both.
There are 4 players there who you would expect to be first teamers, but we could generate over £40m profit by selling them now. That would be terrific business and provide the funds needed to rebuild.

I would give Peltier and Bamba another season each as cover, as much for their attitude as anything else. But they can provide adequate cover.
I'd give Howson a year on same terms, or 2 years on reduced terms and leave the ball in his court. I'd like him to stay, but he's not the messiah.
I'd keep Daniels who hasn't done a lot wrong at all, at least as back up.

I would retain the excellent Dijksteel, and Crooks, Watmore, Coburn.
I would personally keep Payero, (but realise he may not be in Wilder's plans).
Young Boyd Munce deserves every chance to be worth a place in the squad.
I'd retain Bola as I think he is a good left back, but can he play in this awful wing back/overlapping centre backs system? (Why play a system we don't have the players for/why keep the players who can't play the system).
Similarly I'd keep Fisher as cover at right back, but again can he play RWB???
McGree was so bad yesterday it was literally unbelievable. He is a strange player and I haven't made up my mind yet. Jesus he was horrendous yesterday.
Jones needs a rocket fixing permanently just beneath his ****. In the first half yesterday he was scandalous. He needs to sort himself out, though has obvious talent/ability.

That means a lot of quality recruitment, hence the need to generate a budget.

2xCF, LCB, CB, LWB, 2xCM, GK all to start in the first team if those mentioned above do leave and the others stay.
Plus RWB cover, CF cover.
We need to bring in 10 very good footballers.
There will be some good Frees, some Loans.
But with a large budget, I expect to see some big money being spent and without jeopardising FFP.
I think this is going to be a hectic summer window and it absolutely needs to be.
Click to expand...

That is basically just ripping everything up and starting again, is it really that bad?

Creating virtually a new starting 11 might take half a season to gel and get up and running, then it becomes a 2 year project and what happens if we don't get that right?

The problem at the club since McClaren left is that every new manager comes up and wants to rip everything up and start from scratch. Then we get another new manager who doesn't want those players.

At some point we need to evolve as a club rather than this huge overhaul every couple of years.

I know we need changes but what happened to a manager improving the players he has. If Dael Fry has limitations for example then coach him and make him better.

Changing 10-15 players would be a mistake in my opinion, this team looked a match for anyone in the division until about a month ago.
 
indeedido said:
Wilder is absolutely right to weed out players with either bad attitude, poor application, or weak character.
He is also right to move on players who have market value who he doesn't rate as highly as that market value, or who just don't fit his system.

Whether I trust the recruitment after a disastrous January I'm not so sure of.
Whether I can pretend Wilder doesn't deserve criticism when we were 5th on New Year's Day, I'm also not so sure of.

Yesterday's insulting show made me stop making excuses for people.

I'd chase Connolly, Balogun and Siliki on monday, and tell Sporar and Taylor they can leave now too.
I'd pay off Ameobi - a disastrous signing - and look to move on Akpom, Lumley, Hall, Ikpeazu, Fisher, Olusanya and Coulson. They are all just not good enough.
None of those 13 players are an asset to our 2022-23 first team squad. We will not miss any of these players, though many obviously need replacing with better.
They will generate literally no profit on sales. Some will cost money to bin, though I believe Akpom has already been impaired off the books..

I'd proactively sell:
Spence because there is no way back and he will generate a massive fee.
Fry if I could get the big fee he is allegedly worth. The lad is so soft and lumbering I can't believe it. Horror show yesterday. He is regressing. A fit Bamba is a miles better player.
Tavernier for a big fee, simply because I don't think he is worth the contract he would want to stay, or that we will get a bigger fee for him in the future. At least he seems to care and I wish him well.
McNair for a good fee. He is not good enough to oust Dijksteel on the right, strong enough to play centre back, or balanced enough to play that left side role. He is too slow to play in midfield.
If we don't sell Tav or McNair for decent fees, then I'd be happy enough to retain them both.
There are 4 players there who you would expect to be first teamers, but we could generate over £40m profit by selling them now. That would be terrific business and provide the funds needed to rebuild.

I would give Peltier and Bamba another season each as cover, as much for their attitude as anything else. But they can provide adequate cover.
I'd give Howson a year on same terms, or 2 years on reduced terms and leave the ball in his court. I'd like him to stay, but he's not the messiah.
I'd keep Daniels who hasn't done a lot wrong at all, at least as back up.

I would retain the excellent Dijksteel, and Crooks, Watmore, Coburn.
I would personally keep Payero, (but realise he may not be in Wilder's plans).
Young Boyd Munce deserves every chance to be worth a place in the squad.
I'd retain Bola as I think he is a good left back, but can he play in this awful wing back/overlapping centre backs system? (Why play a system we don't have the players for/why keep the players who can't play the system).
Similarly I'd keep Fisher as cover at right back, but again can he play RWB???
McGree was so bad yesterday it was literally unbelievable. He is a strange player and I haven't made up my mind yet. Jesus he was horrendous yesterday.
Jones needs a rocket fixing permanently just beneath his ****. In the first half yesterday he was scandalous. He needs to sort himself out, though has obvious talent/ability.

That means a lot of quality recruitment, hence the need to generate a budget.

2xCF, LCB, CB, LWB, 2xCM, GK all to start in the first team if those mentioned above do leave and the others stay.
Plus RWB cover, CF cover.
We need to bring in 10 very good footballers.
There will be some good Frees, some Loans.
But with a large budget, I expect to see some big money being spent and without jeopardising FFP.
I think this is going to be a hectic summer window and it absolutely needs to be.
Click to expand...
Everything I think but could not articulate any where near as well as that. Great post, indeedido
 
truck said:
I don't doubt Gibson will back Wilder and the club, and I have seen reported Gibson has stated he would not call in the clubs debt, BUT as Bolton found out things can change if something happened to Steve Gibson what then?
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depends what's in his will. Does he give Bulkhaul and the club to his daughter? If so, carry on as is.

Agreed we do not the debt under control, I don't ever see Gibson calling it in, but he has to have an 'exit plan'. MAybe it's get us up and steady in the prem then sell us off to a foreign investor?
 
To me a promotion side could be built around

Fry
Tav
Dijksteel
McCree
Howson (next season)
Crooks
Jones
Bola (of earlier in the season)

Daniels, Peltier, Samba, Coburn, Fisher, Watmore, Taylor are useful squad players

I would give Payero another year to develop. I would possibly take Balogun back on loan but not with any conditions and only on the cheap and use him as a squad player - if he improves his goalscoring start him.

Release/(sell) Lumley, Hall, Akpom, Ikpeazu

Sell: Spence and McNair

Claim insurance on Ameobi


That leaves at least one keeper, one centre half, two forwards all good enough to regulars in a promotion winning side - topped up with 2 to 3 decent loan signings.
 
indeedido said:
Wilder is absolutely right to weed out players with either bad attitude, poor application, or weak character.
He is also right to move on players who have market value who he doesn't rate as highly as that market value, or who just don't fit his system.

Whether I trust the recruitment after a disastrous January I'm not so sure of.
Whether I can pretend Wilder doesn't deserve criticism when we were 5th on New Year's Day, I'm also not so sure of.

Yesterday's insulting show made me stop making excuses for people.

I'd chase Connolly, Balogun and Siliki on monday, and tell Sporar and Taylor they can leave now too.
I'd pay off Ameobi - a disastrous signing - and look to move on Akpom, Lumley, Hall, Ikpeazu, Fisher, Olusanya and Coulson. They are all just not good enough.
None of those 13 players are an asset to our 2022-23 first team squad. We will not miss any of these players, though many obviously need replacing with better.
They will generate literally no profit on sales. Some will cost money to bin, though I believe Akpom has already been impaired off the books..

I'd proactively sell:
Spence because there is no way back and he will generate a massive fee.
Fry if I could get the big fee he is allegedly worth. The lad is so soft and lumbering I can't believe it. Horror show yesterday. He is regressing. A fit Bamba is a miles better player.
Tavernier for a big fee, simply because I don't think he is worth the contract he would want to stay, or that we will get a bigger fee for him in the future. At least he seems to care and I wish him well.
McNair for a good fee. He is not good enough to oust Dijksteel on the right, strong enough to play centre back, or balanced enough to play that left side role. He is too slow to play in midfield.
If we don't sell Tav or McNair for decent fees, then I'd be happy enough to retain them both.
There are 4 players there who you would expect to be first teamers, but we could generate over £40m profit by selling them now. That would be terrific business and provide the funds needed to rebuild.

I would give Peltier and Bamba another season each as cover, as much for their attitude as anything else. But they can provide adequate cover.
I'd give Howson a year on same terms, or 2 years on reduced terms and leave the ball in his court. I'd like him to stay, but he's not the messiah.
I'd keep Daniels who hasn't done a lot wrong at all, at least as back up.

I would retain the excellent Dijksteel, and Crooks, Watmore, Coburn.
I would personally keep Payero, (but realise he may not be in Wilder's plans).
Young Boyd Munce deserves every chance to be worth a place in the squad.
I'd retain Bola as I think he is a good left back, but can he play in this awful wing back/overlapping centre backs system? (Why play a system we don't have the players for/why keep the players who can't play the system).
Similarly I'd keep Fisher as cover at right back, but again can he play RWB???
McGree was so bad yesterday it was literally unbelievable. He is a strange player and I haven't made up my mind yet. Jesus he was horrendous yesterday.
Jones needs a rocket fixing permanently just beneath his ****. In the first half yesterday he was scandalous. He needs to sort himself out, though has obvious talent/ability.

That means a lot of quality recruitment, hence the need to generate a budget.

2xCF, LCB, CB, LWB, 2xCM, GK all to start in the first team if those mentioned above do leave and the others stay.
Plus RWB cover, CF cover.
We need to bring in 10 very good footballers.
There will be some good Frees, some Loans.
But with a large budget, I expect to see some big money being spent and without jeopardising FFP.
I think this is going to be a hectic summer window and it absolutely needs to be.
Click to expand...
Easy to say get rid of most of the squad but they have to be replaced....where are you going to find all these new and better players..????.
If you're not careful you will be getting us relegated Indeedido.....
 
Uwefuchs said:
That is basically just ripping everything up and starting again, is it really that bad?

Creating virtually a new starting 11 might take half a season to gel and get up and running, then it becomes a 2 year project and what happens if we don't get that right?

The problem at the club since McClaren left is that every new manager comes up and wants to rip everything up and start from scratch. Then we get another new manager who doesn't want those players.

At some point we need to evolve as a club rather than this huge overhaul every couple of years.

I know we need changes but what happened to a manager improving the players he has. If Dael Fry has limitations for example then coach him and make him better.

Changing 10-15 players would be a mistake in my opinion, this team looked a match for anyone in the division until about a month ago.
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No need to rip it up. Two strikers who will get us 30+ goals between them, and a keeper who isn’t a flapper. If we had those the season just gone we’d at least be looking at the play offs.

There is a lot of dead wood though who do need replacing, but pretty much starting from scratch isn’t the answer, and not viable.
 
Jedi boro said:
Me neither but that’s what he said.

I guess we’ll soon find out.
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I think it's often a bit of a res herring to over anylise every word that a manager says after a game, more so after such a bad defeat and even more given he spoke so passionately.

My guess is that the changes start on Monday when he does his one-to-ones, but i thibk it will take the summer to discover who he's really told to move on, other than those out of contract obviously.
 
Uwefuchs said:
Not many fans were complaining about our lack of quality and fight a few months ago when we were flying.

The recent form is alarming but Wilder isn't separate from that, throwing the players under the bus sounds just like Pulis and Warnock.

He's right that changes need to be made but actions will speak louder than words, he had a brilliant start here but he's also been part of an awful finish.

Its not just the players, he needs to be better as well.
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Let’s judge him on his players
 
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