The 9am figures not disclosed yet?

[bear66]

No it isn't the same treatment as flu FFS man .. In covid death certification, no test is required, no gp has had to have seen the patient within 28 days and no post mortem occurs.

It explains why we are seeing really low death numbers 'with test' but high numbers without and YET our excess deaths are lower than the 5 year average again.

Jesus can you not accept a single piece of valid information.

Very few people who die of the flu are tested. Most flu deaths estimated in the yearly report are just part of the excess death numbers. At least there are significantly more Covid-19 tests to give a better view of the severity of the virus than the seasonal flu estimate.

 

[Alvez_48]

Very few people who die of the flu are tested. Most flu deaths estimated in the yearly report are just part of the excess death numbers. At least there are significantly more Covid-19 tests to give a better view of the severity of the virus than the seasonal flu estimate.

Influenza is not a notifiable disease.
It's like talking to a brick wall.

 

[bear66]

Influenza is not a notifiable disease.
It's like talking to a brick wall.

The influenza virus is a notifiable organism.
Link

 

[Alvez_48]

The influenza virus is a notifiable organism.
Link

 

[Randy]

No it isn't the same treatment as flu FFS man .. In covid death certification, no test is required, no gp has had to have seen the patient within 28 days and no post mortem occurs.

It explains why we are seeing really low death numbers 'with test' but high numbers without and YET our excess deaths are lower than the 5 year average again.

Jesus can you not accept a single piece of valid information.

It's all in the coronavirus bill legislation. In black and white. Spot on.

 

[Billy Horner]

Well no.. that's why we have post mortems.. you ignore the main point of what I'm saying, covid has special treatment when it comes to death certification.

About 15% of deaths result in a post-mortem, meaning that we accept the clinical judgement of doctors for 85% of deaths. In fact, as one of the main reasons for post-mortem is the reporting doctor stating they are unable to determine a cause of death, our reliance on their clinical judgement is even higher than that.

Because doctors never get anything wrong do they?

I'm sure they do. However, what I find surprising is that some people seem perfectly happy to rely on the clinical judgement of doctors when it comes to other illnesses/diseases, but have a problem accepting the clinical judgement of the same doctors when it comes to Covid-19.

 

[Alvez_48]

About 15% of deaths result in a post-mortem, meaning that we accept the clinical judgement of doctors for 85% of deaths. In fact, as one of the main reasons for post-mortem is the reporting doctor stating they are unable to determine a cause of death, our reliance on their clinical judgement is even higher than that.



I'm sure they do. However, what I find surprising is that some people seem perfectly happy to rely on the clinical judgement of doctors when it comes to other illnesses/diseases, but have a problem accepting the clinical judgement of the same doctors when it comes to Covid-19.

I think it's fair to say when a specific virus gets special treatment by government it's fair to question it's methods more closely (despite this not happening in the media).
With a virus that is brand new, shouldn't we try to do more post mortems to try to understand it's impact further rather than none?

Furthermore when excess deaths are below 5 year average and yet for the same time period we have hundreds of untested covid deaths it's fair to ask why.. would you not agree? The same way it's fair to ask why we have more excess deaths than covid notified several months ago (again it's interesting that the media were asking then but not now.)

 

[bear66]

I think it's fair to say when a specific virus gets special treatment by government it's fair to question it's methods more closely (despite this not happening in the media).
With a virus that is brand new, shouldn't we try to do more post mortems to try to understand it's impact further rather than none?

Furthermore when excess deaths are below 5 year average and yet for the same time period we have hundreds of untested covid deaths it's fair to ask why.. would you not agree? The same way it's fair to ask why we have more excess deaths than covid notified several months ago (again it's interesting that the media were asking then but not now.)

How many of those recorded Covid-19 deaths are untested?

 

[Billy Horner]

With a virus that is brand new, shouldn't we try to do more post mortems to try to understand it's impact further rather than none?

I don't know why you've got it in your head that there are zero post-mortems taking place?

Post-mortems are still being carried out for exactly that reason. Not just in the UK but worldwide (as can be seen in the link below).

https://www.rcpath.org/profession/coronavirus-resource-hub/covid-19-post-mortem-portal.html

 

[Alvez_48]

How many of those recorded Covid-19 deaths are untested?

Read a few posts up 23 rolling average with test.. 85 total.

Also interestingly looking at excess death data from October last year do the attached figures not raise eyebrows?

 

[bear66]

As of 5pm on 13 July, of those tested positive for coronavirus in the UK, 44,968 have died across all settings.

138 deaths in all settings announced today.

398 positive tests with 119 Pillar 1.

 

[Alvez_48]

I don't know why you've got it in your head that there are zero post-mortems taking place?

Post-mortems are still being carried out for exactly that reason. Not just in the UK but worldwide (as can be seen in the link below).

https://www.rcpath.org/profession/coronavirus-resource-hub/covid-19-post-mortem-portal.html

I'm not going to go out of my way to find it yet again, it's in the bill.

 

[Billy Horner]

I'm not going to go out of my way to find it yet again, it's in the bill.

I think you're confusing the requirement to report certain deaths to the coroner with the ability to carry out a post mortem.

 

[Alvez_48]

Quite possibly Billy, the Boro have put me in too good a mood to go back and reference it all so sure why not I could be wrong.

I think you're confusing the requirement to report certain deaths to the coroner with the ability to carry out a post mortem.

 

[kuepper]

we're still winning https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/data/mortality

 

[SmallTown]

we're still winning https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/data/mortality

World leading!

 

[hewielewie]

World leading!

How can this Government survive this?

 

[SmallTown]

How can this Government survive this?

There are a lot of people uninterested in politics who don’t really see what’s going on. If they ever do see Johnson it’s probably when he’s banging a despatch box or saying a ridiculous lie. They won’t verify the lie so assume he’s doing ok.
It’s really sad that the ignorance of others is causing so many deaths.

 

[Randy]

How can this Government survive this?

Because some people voted for them even after all the things they have done to destroy the country and its people over the past decade.

 

[Billy Horner]

Today's headline analysis:

• 398 new cases reported in 24-hour period, down from yesterday's 530
• 7-day average for new cases decreases by 4.2% to 597 per day, following 4.3% increase yesterday
• 7-day average for new cases is 4.0% higher than one week ago (from 5.7% higher yesterday) and 31.1% lower than two weeks ago (from 30.2% lower yesterday and 49.9% lower 7 days ago)
• 138 new deaths in all settings reported in 24-hour period, up from 11 yesterday
• 7-day average for new deaths in all settings decreases by 2.9% to 82 per day, following 0.8% decrease yesterday (and 6th decrease in 7 days)
• 7-day average for new deaths in all settings is 12.8% lower than one week ago (from 10.3% lower yesterday) and 28.1% lower than two weeks ago (from 27.5% lower yesterday and 22.0% lower 7 days ago)