Sheff Utd Forum

[newyddion]

Think there is a chance we will do it.

Like yourself, I was one of the few saying we still had a decent chance after the Huddersfield game, when many others were saying it was over, and we were right.

Ultimately though, I have a feeling we may just miss out, but I'm still buzzing about the fact we were right and we've taken it to the final day.

We might just do it.

We might be hitting peak form at the perfect time ‘a crème brûlée’ of a football season.

Luton might have over egged the pudding.. leaving them flat.

Sheffield have Mitrovic starred rested round.. they may look quite stodgy and unappealing in comparison.

 

[parmoboy]

Yeah I get that. All we could from the Cardiff game onwards was take it to final day and we have managed to do that. Now we just to win our game and get lucky. If we miss out then so be it but I really want to beat Preston

I guess I'm just trying to stay consistent with my predictions. I remember before the Cardiff game I said that I believed 7 points would be enough, as I thought Sheff Utd would possibly slip up at QPR. I was hoping two home wins and a draw at Preston would be enough.

No reason to think we can't beat Preston but I fear we'll be in for a tougher game than our previous two.

 

[Cardiffdaffs]

"We’ve had our purple patch with Wilder and now It is hard to see where the next win will come from"

"We do not have the balls to win tomorrow."

"The fat lady has cleared her voice, it's over for another season."

"Clutching, clutching and even more clutching.... let it go. It's over"

"The clutching of straws is very apparent on this thread. Roll on next season, new season new hope"

Etc.
That's all I could be bothered finding.

As soon as we failed to beat Swansea, the play-offs were out of our hands and we needed help to have a chance, but there's a difference between thinking it'll be difficult and telling others it won't happen and they're clutching to even think it's possible.

The most likely outcome is still that we miss out on the play-offs, but there's nothing rose-tinted or straw clutching about thinking a possible 2 point gap could be overturned.

Three of those 5 comments were from one poster - won’t bother naming him but you should add him to your ignore list. The first sounds like Mwelomo and the final one is Nosmo King who also have form for being negative. Nobby will confirm.

 

[coluka]

You've completely changed your tune in the last 4 days, I don't understand it.

It's nothing to do with age, and it's getting quite condescending to keep saying it is.

On Wednesday, I was saying that if we didn't beat Cardiff, it was over, and you were telling me that we could lose to Cardiff and still have a good chance and reason to hope.

I don't understand how one result which actually favours us has completely changed your way of thinking, especially when we'd won the 2 matches before the said match.

I haven’t changed my tune, I ‘ve reacted to developments - because Fulham won, they have nothing to play for but pride. Yes if Bournemouth were not to win tonight it would be irrelevant anyway, but if they win Fulham would have had the desire to get a point on Saturday had they lost. I have already explained why I think individual and collective desire is vital to success. Even if my scenario played out, there is still no guarantee Fulham would at least draw. I know that. We think differently.

If you do not think you change with age and react and use judgement differently through lifes passage as you age, then you are in for a shock. I am a very different person to my 25 and even 40 year old self in how i think and act. If you think I was being condescending (which i wasn’t), then I can’t help how you take it, I am merely passing on my experience of life, you think differently, that’s fine, no need to go down rabbit holes that aren’t there though.

 

[wilkos_perm]

I hope you are right. History tells me otherwise. I like teams to have something to play for more than personal pride.

Having something to play for can work both ways. it can make teams, nervous, edgy, desperate etc.

There's no point in trying to guess really, unfortunbately we just have to see what unfolds. I'm struggling with the "realism" arguments because experience tells us that anything can and does happen in football, especially in the championship which is notoriously unpredictable.

 

[Diego]

I just th

I haven’t changed my tune, I ‘ve reacted to developments - because Fulham won, they have nothing to play for but pride. Yes if Bournemouth were not to win tonight it would be irrelevant anyway, but if they win Fulham would have had the desire to get a point on Saturday had they lost. I have already explained why I think individual and collective desire is vital to success. Even if my scenario played out, there is still no guarantee Fulham would at least draw. I know that. We think differently.

If you do not think you change with age and react and use judgement differently through lifes passage as you age, then you are in for a shock. I am a very different person to my 25 and even 40 year old self in how i think and act. If you think I was being condescending (which i wasn’t), then I can’t help how you take it, I am merely passing on my experience of life, you think differently, that’s fine, no need to go down rabbit holes that aren’t there though.

I just think you have a different opinion. It’s not because of age, there will be plenty of people of similar age to you who think like us and there will be similar people of age to me who think like you. It’s probably best not to bring age into a discussion based on personal opinion in my opinion. I don’t think it particularly helps on this subject.

 

[TeaCider]

Bored, so I thought I'd check the number of teams that dropped out of the play-offs on the final day in the Championship:

19/20 - Nottingham Forest in 6th dropped out after having a 3 point and 6 goal difference advantage on 7th.

14/15 - Derby in 6th dropped out after having a 2 point and 16 goal difference advantage on 7th.

13/14 - Reading in 6th dropped out after having a 1 point advantage on 7th.

12/13 - Bolton in 6th dropped out after having a 3 difference advantage on 7th, they were actually replaced by 8th place who were 2 points behind with a better goal difference.

08/09 - Cardiff in 5th dropped out after having a 3 point and 2 goal difference advantage on 7th.

So in 17 seasons, it's happened 5 times, and in most of those other seasons the play-offs were already confirmed before the final day.

 

[Diego]

Bored, so I thought I'd check the number of teams that dropped out of the play-offs on the final day in the Championship:

19/20 - Nottingham Forest in 6th dropped out after having a 3 point and 6 goal difference advantage.

14/15 - Derby in 6th dropped out after having a 2 point and 16 goal difference advantage.

13/14 - Reading in 6th dropped out after having a 1 point advantage.

12/13 - Bolton in 6th dropped out after having a 3 difference advantage on 7th, they were actually replaced by 8th place who were 2 points behind with a better goal difference.

08/09 - Cardiff in 5th dropped out after having a 3 point and 2 goal difference advantage on 7th.

So in 17 seasons, it's happened 5 times, and in most of those other seasons the play-offs were already confirmed before the final day.

Nearly 1 in 3. And we have a chance to overtake 2 teams. We’re in a hopeful position.

 

[newyddion]

Bored, so I thought I'd check the number of teams that dropped out of the play-offs on the final day in the Championship:

19/20 - Nottingham Forest in 6th dropped out after having a 3 point and 6 goal difference advantage on 7th.

14/15 - Derby in 6th dropped out after having a 2 point and 16 goal difference advantage on 7th.

13/14 - Reading in 6th dropped out after having a 1 point advantage on 7th.

12/13 - Bolton in 6th dropped out after having a 3 difference advantage on 7th, they were actually replaced by 8th place who were 2 points behind with a better goal difference.

08/09 - Cardiff in 5th dropped out after having a 3 point and 2 goal difference advantage on 7th.

So in 17 seasons, it's happened 5 times, and in most of those other seasons the play-offs were already confirmed before the final day.

5 in 17 is quite significant. So many other factors to consider.

How many times in 17 seasons have the champions lost on the final day?

 

[coluka]

Pointless all these what if Bournemouth win tonight comments.

What if Luton had won last night, but they lose on Saturday while Boro and Sheff Utd both win? Then we'd be saying drat, wish Fulham had beaten them. Who knows how it'll all shake out.

@Col how certain are you of a Boro win on Saturday then, given PNE have nothing to play for? 100%? I know I'm not, but then again that may be my wisdom and experience talking.

I stated I was sure we would win our last 3, I am confident we will beat Preston. I am confident Luton will beat Reading. I am reasonably confident Sheffield will beat Fulham now. As Fulham and Reading have nothing riding on the game and both teams are crucially away from home too it is there desire levels that concern me.

I think we will beat Preston, but I don’t expect it to be a walk in the park as crucially Preston are at home and that should give them some desire and fight against us to sign off in front of their fans.

We don’t have a crystal ball, we may yet make it, lady luck may or may not shine on us. I do think our best hope is on Fulham rather than Reading. I just wish one of them had something to play for other than pride which is where my struggle to be hopeful is running on low.

 

[Cardiffdaffs]

Bored, so I thought I'd check the number of teams that dropped out of the play-offs on the final day in the Championship:

19/20 - Nottingham Forest in 6th dropped out after having a 3 point and 6 goal difference advantage on 7th.

14/15 - Derby in 6th dropped out after having a 2 point and 16 goal difference advantage on 7th.

13/14 - Reading in 6th dropped out after having a 1 point advantage on 7th.

12/13 - Bolton in 6th dropped out after having a 3 difference advantage on 7th, they were actually replaced by 8th place who were 2 points behind with a better goal difference.

08/09 - Cardiff in 5th dropped out after having a 3 point and 2 goal difference advantage on 7th.

So in 17 seasons, it's happened 5 times, and in most of those other seasons the play-offs were already confirmed before the final day.

I remember Cardiff in 2008-9 well. I think with 4 or so games to go they were still in with a good chance of promotion. Then they lost 6-0 at fellow promotion hopefuls Preston and lost their last 2 games as well to drop out completely. A real blow up.

 

[ForssAwakens]

I just th


I just think you have a different opinion. It’s not because of age, there will be plenty of people of similar age to you who think like us and there will be similar people of age to me who think like you. It’s probably best not to bring age into a discussion based on personal opinion in my opinion. I don’t think it particularly helps on this subject.

My grandad would think we were going up if we had to win and they lose and there’s needs to a 10 goal swing

 

[Cardiffdaffs]

5 in 17 is quite significant. So many other factors to consider.

How many times in 17 seasons have the champions lost on the final day?

It’s happened twice in the last 10 years

Wolves lost 3-0 at Sunderland in 2018 having won the Champjonship.

Reading lost 2-0 at Birmingham in 2012 having already won the Championship


As an aside Cardiff went up as champions in 2013 despite winning only 1 of their last 7 games!

 

[Cuthbert]

Bored, so I thought I'd check the number of teams that dropped out of the play-offs on the final day in the Championship:

19/20 - Nottingham Forest in 6th dropped out after having a 3 point and 6 goal difference advantage on 7th.

14/15 - Derby in 6th dropped out after having a 2 point and 16 goal difference advantage on 7th.

13/14 - Reading in 6th dropped out after having a 1 point advantage on 7th.

12/13 - Bolton in 6th dropped out after having a 3 difference advantage on 7th, they were actually replaced by 8th place who were 2 points behind with a better goal difference.

08/09 - Cardiff in 5th dropped out after having a 3 point and 2 goal difference advantage on 7th.

So in 17 seasons, it's happened 5 times, and in most of those other seasons the play-offs were already confirmed before the final day.

Good research mate

How many of those times was it Boro trying to sneak in to the play-offs though

 

[coluka]

Having something to play for can work both ways. it can make teams, nervous, edgy, desperate etc.

There's no point in trying to guess really, unfortunbately we just have to see what unfolds. I'm struggling with the "realism" arguments because experience tells us that anything can and does happen in football, especially in the championship which is notoriously unpredictable.

Ok, perhaps balance of probabilities is a better term. Of course it is possible nerves might get to Luton. A 7-0 drubbing wont help their cause and the way they were flying into tackles showed they are feeling pressure. If that continues into the Reading game they may lose their heads. Jones looked rattled yesterday too. You are right, nobody knows for sure, crikey we all could lose as upsets happen as nothing in football is guaranteed or we’d all be millionaires, the odds are stacked against us though and all we can do is hope for an unlikely slip up or favour.

 

[TheYorkshireTerrier]

19/20 - Nottingham Forest in 6th dropped out after having a 3 point and 6 goal difference advantage on 7th.

That one should be enough to give any fan hope that we can do it.

They got beat 4-1 at home to Stoke who finished 16th that season as well, with nothing to play for.

 

[festa5]

I for one am not saying they will roll over, they wont. There is a difference between rolling over and not putting in the extra yard, the 50/50 challenge, the mental will and strength as you would in say November. Holidays booked, would you risk injury when you have zero gain. Stoke City put effort in but I would say that wasn’t the same Stoke City their fans were hoping to see and have seen. You can be professional but the desire will likely be missing from Fulham and Reading, neither are at home which also potentially takes the edge off.

I am saying that if Fulham or Reading had something tangible to fight for, (like Luton and Sheffield do) they would play with more intensity, passion and desire to win than they are likely to do. Of course it is possible some in the team will, but it only takes a couple of players to think about keeping injury free as their contract is up or a move is beckoning to derail performance levels of the team as a whole. I will be amazed and shocked were we to finish top 6, but delighted. If it doesn’t I will be disappointed on what could and should have been, but at least it wont be like some lows of the past and I will look to next season with greater hope and more expectation than I do of results going our way on Saturday.

I don't disagree that a team with more to play for is probably going to be more dangerous on balance. However sometimes teams can choke and sometimes teams with no pressure, particularly free scoring attacking teams, can be more dangerous. But yes, in a perfect world I'd want Fulham and Reading to be playing for something.

I think where we disagree is how much of a difference that makes. You think it makes that much of a difference you'd rather we only had one result that could possibly go our way as long as the team we need to win has something riding on the outcome.

I would rather have 2 chances to for results to go our way, even if the teams we need to win have nothing riding on it.

I don't think the opposition having extra motivation increases our chances as much as having 2 matches/2 chances for things to go in our favour.

Obviously fine to disagree though, it's all just opinions at the end of the day.

 

[TeaCider]

5 in 17 is quite significant. So many other factors to consider.

How many times in 17 seasons have the champions lost on the final day?

20/21 - Norwich, already confirmed as champions, drew 2-2.

19/20 - Leeds, already confirmed as champions, beat Charlton 4-0, relegating them in the process.

18/19 - Norwich beat Aston Villa 2-1 to confirm themselves as champions.

17/18 - Wolves, already confirmed as champions, lost 3-0 to already relegated Sunderland.

16/17 - Newcastle beat Barnsley 3-0 to comfirm themselves as champions after Brighton, who started the day in 1st conceded in the 89th minute to draw.

15/16 - Burnley beat already relegated Charlton 3-0 to confirm themselves as champions.

14/15 - Bournemouth beat Charlton 3-0 to confirm themselves as champions after 1st placed Watford conceded in the 90th minute to draw.

13/14 - Leicester, already confirmed as champions, beat Doncaster 1-0, relegating Doncaster who had started the day above the drop.

12/13 - Cardiff, already confirmed as champions, drew 2-2 with 2nd placed Hull.

11/12 - Reading, already confirmed as champions, lost 2-0 to 5th placed Birmingham who were already assured of a play-off spot.

10/11 - QPR, already confirmed as champions, lost 2-1 to 7th placed Leeds United.

09/10 - Newcastle, already confirmed as champions, beat 14th placed QPR 1-0.

08/09 - Wolves, already confirmed as champions, beat 13th placed Doncaster 1-0.

07/08 - West Brom confirmed themselves as champions by beating 14th placed QPR 2-0.

06/07 - Sunderland leapfrogged Birmingham on the last day to confirm themselves as champions by beating already relegated Luton 5-0.

05/06 - Reading, already confirmed as champions, beat 21st placed QPR 2-1.

04/05 - Sunderland, already confirmed as champions, beat 12th placed Stoke 1-0.

 

[TeaCider]

So in 17 Championship seasons, the champion was already confirmed on the last day in 11 of them.
They won in 8 of those 11 matches, despite having nothing to play for.
In the 2 the champion did lose, there was nothing to play for with either team.

In 3 of the 6 seasons where there was still something to play for on the last day, the team that started the day in 1st slipped up.

So history would indicate that Fulham already being champions has little baring on the result.

 

[newyddion]

20/21 - Norwich, already confirmed as champions, drew 2-2.

19/20 - Leeds, already confirmed as champions, beat Charlton 4-0, relegating them in the process.

13/14 - Leicester, already confirmed as champions, beat Doncaster 1-0, relegating Doncaster who had started the day above the drop.

12/13 - Cardiff, already confirmed as champions, drew 2-2 with 2nd placed Hull.

09/10 - Newcastle, already confirmed as champions, beat 14th placed QPR 1-0.

08/09 - Wolves, already confirmed as champions, beat 13th placed Doncaster 1-0..

05/06 - Reading, already confirmed as champions, beat 21st placed QPR 2-1.

04/05 - Sunderland, already confirmed as champions, beat 12th placed Stoke 1-0.

Quite often then..