BlindBoyGrunt
Well-known member
This isn't the media though, it's a football forum.
Going from bad to worse for the Labour Party
- Thread starter Youngie
- Start date
Chris_Boro
Well-known member
If only it was just in this forum.
Support from his client journalists. Agreed.
When there's no journo in the country with the cojones to criticise the government, maybe the leader of the opposition shouldn't be going on Marr and pledging his unconditional support to the government?
This thread. FFS. Come onnnnn.Brown and Miliband were treated very unfairly by the press. The bacon sarnie incident, the time the DM wrote that Ralph Miliband was the "man who hated britain", I remember Brown getting grief for his hand written letters to Iraq war soldiers families not being neat enough.
Corbyn got something else entirely. A character assassination beyond what any other MPs had in my lifetime. Maybe older board members can say whether it was as vicious for Foot.
Starmer's had it easy. Journalists falling over themselves to say he's forensic.
Alvez_48
Well-known member
In that case my apologies you didn't call him unelectable.
Pak_Doo_Ik
Well-known member
The Tories are just getting a bounce from the vaccine roll-out and the next GE is another 3 years away yet.
What Starmer needs to do is make sure he is at the forefront of any inquiry in to the way the government have handled the whole pandemic, from the initial Cobra meetings that were missed, through the PPE debacle, Track and Trace, care homes and border controls, then lets see where the Labour party sits in the polls
Johnson will step down before too long and knowing the Tories they will manage to elect Reece-Mogg as PM and then things will get interesting (although I do fear for Labour if the Tories manage to use common sense and elect Rishi as I think the public do kind of like him and whether us oldies like it or not personalities now play a massive part in politics).
What Starmer needs to do is make sure he is at the forefront of any inquiry in to the way the government have handled the whole pandemic, from the initial Cobra meetings that were missed, through the PPE debacle, Track and Trace, care homes and border controls, then lets see where the Labour party sits in the polls
Johnson will step down before too long and knowing the Tories they will manage to elect Reece-Mogg as PM and then things will get interesting (although I do fear for Labour if the Tories manage to use common sense and elect Rishi as I think the public do kind of like him and whether us oldies like it or not personalities now play a massive part in politics).
newyddion
Well-known member
The guy that scuppered the last two elections is supporting his fellow traitors and at the same time attacking the core support.
Quickly turning the Labour Party into the lid dems ie untrusted and unpopular
TBH their bounce probably hasn't happened yet. The gap will get bigger as we start to emerge from lockdown and the pubs open.
Been hearing this since last year. It's based on nothing but wishful thinking. Johnson did 8 years as London Mayor and being PM was his life's ambition. Anyone thinking he's going to gracefully bow out early doors is kidding themselves.
And now his personal poll ratings are back to being positive I can't see the tory party chasing him either. Think about it: he won them an 80 seat majority. They haven't had a strong winning election like that since 1987. Why would they gamble that on getting rid of him?
Labour could do with learning lessons from the tories. We had a leader who doubled the membership and added 2 million votes. And yet the party's MPs were briefing against him in the press, swearing at him in the House of Commons, refusing to be in his shadow cabinet, threatening to stab him in the front, playing stupid tricks with leaked voicemails to tory press officer mates.
Chris_Boro
Well-known member
Support from his client journalists. Agreed.
When there's no journo in the country with the cojones to criticise the government, maybe the leader of the opposition shouldn't be going on Marr and pledging his unconditional support to the government?
Brown and Miliband were treated very unfairly by the press. The bacon sarnie incident, the time the DM wrote that Ralph Miliband was the "man who hated britain", I remember Brown getting grief for his hand written letters to Iraq war soldiers families not being neat enough.
Corbyn got something else entirely. A character assassination beyond what any other MPs had in my lifetime. Maybe older board members can say whether it was as vicious for Foot.
Starmer's had it easy. Journalists falling over themselves to say he's forensic.
Yet Starmer gets attacked for not being more vocal in the media.
If you think I meant that he only ever got grief from this thread on a football message board then you shouldn't go near social media.
Corbyn got unbelievable character assassination, which was awful and untrue. Something that will be ramped up on Starmer closer to the election, especially if its close, though I doubt to the same level.
There in lays the point, we are not near an election and the Tories with their media backers are quite happy to let Labour fight amongst itself.
It's like saying if we sneak in to the playoffs and get promoted this season the club are bound to sack Warnock and give George Friend the managers job to lead us to Premier League glory. It's just obviously not the case. Nobody would do this.
NYboro
Well-known member
I would like to think so. Sadly, I don't see it happening.
HolgateCorner
Well-known member
It should not be a surprise if the Tories are showing a lead with all the money that has been thrown about by Sunak so far.
If anything I would think the Tories will be disappointed the lead isn’t bigger.
If anything I would think the Tories will be disappointed the lead isn’t bigger.
newyddion
Well-known member
Yup, that’s the one
I voted in Corbyn as leader hoping that just having him in for even a year would pull the party left of the centrist stand it had been stuck in. There were far too many Blairites still around.
As it happens, the Corbyn leadership was a total disaster. I was totally wrong about him. I did vote for Owen Smith when he challenged but he was slapped.
The divisions in the labour party are the same as those in the tory party. This political system of ours is so outdated.
We really need PR so that we can modernise and have a proper democratic representation in Parliament instead of party whip forcing votes - look what happened to HoC during the brexit votes. All leaders care more about their public perception and power than doing the right thing. Career politicians dominate in both parties.
We are constantly lied to. The whole Cummings thing showed just how arrogant the Government can be these days. Looking down a camera lens and telling us that white was black, insulting the intelligence of the entire country. We had the same thing from Labour with Blair and the Iraq war crimes.
As it happens, the Corbyn leadership was a total disaster. I was totally wrong about him. I did vote for Owen Smith when he challenged but he was slapped.
The divisions in the labour party are the same as those in the tory party. This political system of ours is so outdated.
We really need PR so that we can modernise and have a proper democratic representation in Parliament instead of party whip forcing votes - look what happened to HoC during the brexit votes. All leaders care more about their public perception and power than doing the right thing. Career politicians dominate in both parties.
We are constantly lied to. The whole Cummings thing showed just how arrogant the Government can be these days. Looking down a camera lens and telling us that white was black, insulting the intelligence of the entire country. We had the same thing from Labour with Blair and the Iraq war crimes.
Piccadilly Day Tripper
Well-known member
People act like the Labour party hasn't just had the biggest drubbing since the 1930's, isn't in financial disrepair, doesn't need to find a more solid long term revenue generator than the unions, and isn't shattered into stupid warring factions based on which way you interpreted politics books at sixth form eating each other alive on twitter every day. No, it's just Starmer being boring and a cuck to the government.
I've said it before - these are the Tony Mowbray years for the Labour party. It's two elections away from being even close to power. That there could by then have been 20 years of Conservative government makes me shudder.
I've said it before - these are the Tony Mowbray years for the Labour party. It's two elections away from being even close to power. That there could by then have been 20 years of Conservative government makes me shudder.
viv_andersons_nana
Well-known member
Remember the PPE scandal? Or when Dominic Cummings did a press conference in the garden? FFS. How about Boris Johnson not bothering to show up for the first few COBRA meetings? Or when he boasted of shaking hands with people in hospital? What about when he was slow to lock the country down not once or twice but three times? Do you remember when he hid in a fridge to avoid a journalist? No? How about the time he stole a journalists phone and hid it in his pocket so said journalist couldn't embarrass him ON CAMERA? Does anyone remember the time they let people go straight from hospital into care homes without testing them first? The 'world beating' track and trace system? Remember Jennifer Acuri? Of course you don't. How about the chaos around quarantining and allowing people to fly out of the UK only to change the rules at the drop of a hat? Do you remember when they put £18bn worth of PPE contracts out without competitive tender? Amazing isn't it, all this stuff. How about when they downgraded GCSE and A Level results and then had to back-track? That was a good one. Do you remember the queues at Dover and the lorry parks? What about when they were forced to scrap forcing non-EU NHS staff to pay to use the NHS? We haven't even got onto the repeated lying in Parliament yet, or at PMQs. Or the £130m spent on PR? Anyone remember that or find it interesting? This is all since about a week before the election, by the way. We haven't even touched what he got up to before became Prime Minister, back when he was sacked for lying and threatening to have journalists beaten up and cheating on his wives and smashing up restaurants and being racist and homophobic. Do you remember when he talked about making model buses? What about the Westferry Printworks stuff with Richard Desmond? It was worth about £120m apparently, back when he was mayor of London. Amazing. It only came out last summer as well, you'd think people on the news would be really trying their knackers off to get to the bottom of it wouldn't you? Do you remember when he said police money was being "spaffed up the wall" when asked about historic child abuse? Funny that, isn't it. Class from Boris that.
This is just the tip of the iceberg, by the way. Anyone could find this on Google within five minutes and about 27 clicks.
If anyone thinks a Labour leader would be treated in the same way Johnson is if he or she had done even two of those ^^^ things then they're living on another planet.
This is just the tip of the iceberg, by the way. Anyone could find this on Google within five minutes and about 27 clicks.
If anyone thinks a Labour leader would be treated in the same way Johnson is if he or she had done even two of those ^^^ things then they're living on another planet.
Piccadilly Day Tripper
Well-known member
A pull to the left, fine, but I don't get the desire to purge the centrists (whatever that means, depending on who you speak to) and the 'Blairites'. Seems like an awful waste of energy.
Whenever Blair speaks now on Brexit, Northern Ireland, covid recovery he seems to crystalise the problem and offer a solution, whereas in the past five years under Corbyn it feels like the party was forever trying to twist 21st century problems (gig economy, public service v private sector, information as currency, social inequality gap) into 20th century understanding of social democracy.
Mountain Climber
Well-known member
I regard myself as apolitical mostly. This is borne out of a mistrust of most politicians because they seem self serving. Many make promises they rarely keep once elected. For me Labour lost the vote of the majority of working classes in the last election. They neglected the real needs and focused too much on fringe concerns, minority 'PC' issues, that the vast majority in this country has little time for. They became a Liberal elite. The party was run by Corbynites from trendy areas of London whose concerns mattered little to most peoples daily lives. London centric, and constant 'virtue signalling' annoyed the voters who were concerned about real issues like jobs, the NHS, rising crime, etc. The Tories exploited this and it worked. I see the Tories as mostly corrupt, an old boys network riddled with cronyism, broken promises and damn lies rolled out, day after day. Just my personal viewpoint. Not wanting to start an argument or discussion over this either. Stay safe everyone. Peace to all. UTB.
Well it wasn't. Having a mass membership sorted that issue right out. Their accounts are published each year so we got to see that.
Starmer's the bright spark who's based his leadership on appealing to tory voters who don't financially support the Labour party, and on chasing away left wing folk who do.
Again, Starmer's the one who decided to kick all that up. In his leadership campaign he said he'd unite the party. No bashing Blair's gov, no bashing Corbyn's 5 years. That was what he promised.
Then he covered up a report showing the party was full of saboteurs. Then he gave the saboteurs a massive out of court settlement. Then he kicked Long Bailey out of his shadow cabinet for naff all. Then he kicked Corbyn out the party. Then he kicked him out the party a second time after an "independent" panel let him back in. Then he started kicking out any Labour members who dare to question what's been going on at their CLP meetings.
Starmer, and Starmer fans can have no complaint about the warring factions.
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Got to say Mountain Climber I think this is entirely backwards.
The problem isn't that Corbyn's Labour were obsessed with representing "fringe concerns, minority 'PC' issues". It's that the section of the working class you're talking about have become obsessed with attacking "fringe concerns, minority 'PC' issues".
Corbyn's Labour throughout 2015-2019 were offering a pay rise for public sector workers, collective bargaining for trade unions, and 4 extra bank holidays for the home nation's saint days. What are those if not working class gains? It's 3 policies directly giving workers more money, more power, and more time.
Half the working class have stopped caring about any policy areas that'll actually affect their lives. All they're interested in is deporting immigrants, Meghan Markle and where trans people go to the toilet.
Edit: I may be overstating it to say the working class have stopped caring. But I do think a certain amount of knowledge or skills has been lost since Thatcher gutted the trade unions. I bet a lot of voters in their 20s or 30s wouldn't know what collective bargaining was or how it could help them.
In fact there's probably something in peoples understanding of politics reducing over the years, and these same people finding an elitist patritional government appealing.
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