Fuel shortage

Andy_W said:
Yeah they do handle a bit differently mind, as the fluid can slosh about a bit too, we've got big tanks on one of our vehicles for water and that can be bad sometimes.

They don't want any liquid getting out, even water, as anything going into the gulleys/ surface water drains can get in the streams and rivers and cause a big problem. We have to be careful with fresh/ tap water pipes near rivers, as they can pollute watercourses, which seems odd, but maybe due to the chemicals in the water/ the PH of it etc. The rivers are used to oily/fuely rainwater runoff, but not tap water....weird.
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The sliding around may be one of the big reasons for that. I suspect the weight shifting about makes them handle oddly.

As I say I don't know. I only looked into it because a mate who works for BP told me they have plenty of drivers and panic buying was the cause of forecourts closing.

We have had queues at our BP for days but getting back to normal now as everyone who wants to fill up has managed to.
 
Laughing said:
I don't know, only what I have read, but I looked into this a couple of days ago, because I thought fuel shortages were manufactured, to be honest. You need an ADR accord dangerous routier to drive a tanker, not just to empty it. Oddly enough even if the tanker is nly carrying milk! I think its to do with carrying fluids, which can be dangerous in an accident, even if it is semi-skimmed.
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Milk is a terrible polluter of Waterways if spills get into the system, it makes a high Chemical oxygen demand which maybe why you need to be licensed.
 
Are people filling up and symphoning off in their garage and re filling the next day?

I do wonder where the extra demand is coming from? say compared with Pre Covid days

We have been told on here that Electric vehicles sales represent a big chunk of car sales which surely reduces demand for petrol/diesel. Additionally there must be at least 50,000 lorries parked up not being used if we are supposedly short of 100,000 lorry drivers.

I feel sorry for ordinary business users who are affected by what appears a lot of panic buying and hoarding egged on by the media.
 
S7DiscoDown said:
The issue isn't drivers as such. It's the fact they are ADR drivers who drive tankers.

They are often more experienced drivers for obvious reasons. The fact is we have as many ADR drivers as we had last week.... That's not brexit or covid.

It's the fact fuel purchasing has gone up 700% due to papers saying we have none (despite only 6 out of 120 BP garages due to close).

I would be worried if I was in army retention. I mean why deliver fuel to forecourts for the army on 20k a year when you can make 40k as an ADR driver 😂.
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I don't want to scaremonger, and I hope I'm not, and I hope I'm wrong but that's still 5%, and 5% from one of the big guns, my bet is it is worse for small er suppliers and distributers?

What drivers we had last week wasn't enough to supply the demand we had, so we were going to trickle down, but now this mess has emptied what we have and will snowball until everyone's tanks are full. There might not be enough in storage to fill everyone's tanks, and loads of businesses have the capability to store 10's of thousands of litres if they wish.

We aren't going to gain ADR drivers anytime soon, on mass, but we could quite easily lose more and more to the EU. People moving over to be ADR drivers (if even possible) is just kicking the can down the road, or from one road to another, when the other roads are screwed already.
 
zzzzz said:
Drove out of Manchester this morning and passed 3 garages with no fuel.
Got back and the local Shell garage is also out and didn't know when they'll get the next delivery of any kind.
Shambles.
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The crisis is definitely not over. Hard to get petrol in Herts. still long queues. Sounds like the North East is one of the better areas.
 
Ok close to Wales - about 33% of pumps out from local media reports.

My guess is the South East carries less spare capacity. I know it has over 55% of the UK's population in quite a small area.
 
I went to my local garage yesterday. Fuel in the tanks and pumps open with no queue's. I spoke to the shop assistant at the till about the rush for fuel and she said yes there has been one but everyone around here has now filled up.
 
Andy_W said:
Don't you live/ work in Great Ayton? So the Richmond constituency, and voted independent? I'm in the same constituency, and the only independent in that constituency was Nick Jardine a very hard brexiter (who was going to stand for the brexit party), and who wanted a "clean break" from the EU? If so, you (and the country) got exactly the carnage what you voted for, albeit not the party doing it. You certainly don't seem to argue from a remain/ least damaging or even soft brexit point of view, and didn't vote labour which would have tried better to protect everything you mention there.

People can vote tory (or a local MP) for other policies or reasons as a priority and maybe brexit was second fiddle, or they believed one of the 12 versions which wasn't hard/ worst version ever brexit? The latter might have been a bit naive, but at least he's admitting it's a ****-up (or that brexit is), and he might not vote that way again.

Some people can vote one way for one reason (for themselves or their family), and yet argue for their friends to vote for other parties (contradictory to their own vote) which would be better for their friends.

Some people don't have a clue and vote for parties that are worse for themselves, worse for those worse off, worse for the NHS etc, through nievity. I know loads who did this, and employ a few of them too, albeit I probably wouldn't going forward.

I possibly could vote tory (and have years ago), and argue for that side, as it might make me better off personally (and I'm fine either way), but for the last few I've voted labour to help the rest of my family, friends who aren't as comfortable.
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I voted independent as a personal stand against Tory and Labour as I didn't and still don't believe in any of those parties.
 
Laughing said:
Our petrol station is pretty much back to normal now, queues gone as people have filled up and I got in as normal this morning to fill up.

One could be forgiven for thinking that there is no shortage of adr qualified tanker drivers, given that the moment panic buying stops, there is no shortage. manufactured so Johnson can reverse one of brexits stupid consequences, without the electorate who voted for him, turning on him? Who knows.
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What Johnno hoodwinking the British public and they fell felt it, no way.

I hope all the idiots that have been filling up just in case are really pleased with their smug little selves, can I just ask them one thing though please do not bleat when these oil companies report massive profits again, you have all helped fuel them.

I have tried at times to defend this country when a lot of mud is thrown, but I now despair of the nation we have become. All Brexit and Covid has shown us is that we are selfish nation who hang on the word of a would be TV personality and media stations that just exist to sensationalise every little thing as viewer numbers are more important than news.

As Keith Lamb succinctly put it eventually wewill end up with the country we deserve.

RIP Great Britain 😞
 
Pak_Doo_Ik said:
What Johnno hoodwinking the British public and they fell felt it, no way.

I hope all the idiots that have been filling up just in case are really pleased with their smug little selves, can I just ask them one thing though please do not bleat when these oil companies report massive profits again, you have all helped fuel them.

I have tried at times to defend this country when a lot of mud is thrown, but I now despair of the nation we have become. All Brexit and Covid has shown us is that we are selfish nation who hang on the word of a would be TV personality and media stations that just exist to sensationalise every little thing as viewer numbers are more important than news.

As Keith Lamb succinctly put it eventually wewill end up with the country we deserve.

RIP Great Britain 😞
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I feel your pain my friend.
 
BaronSmoggie said:
View attachment 25170

I'm no keyboard warrior. You are the only person on this board who manages to wind me up. The rest of us can seem to have adult discussions without the insults being thrown around because we don't like someone having a different viewpoint. Wintergreen is showing the same frustration as I, yet still managing to be eloquent. And to try and shut you up as you promised, here is one benefit of Brexit ( a personal viewpoint, I grant you).

UK business are no longer able to rely on European immigrants to come over and do low paid jobs such as fruit picking and stay in appalling conditions, effectively slave labour. Here is a 10 year old article (slap bang inside our EU membership) talking about one of the UK's biggest fruit farm companies taking advantage of workers they brought over https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...l-of-britain-s-fruitfarm-workers-1740207.html. Yep, there is something to be proud of in the EU. Bringing people over, housing them in crappy conditions and taking away money they earned through 'charges'. I guess Brexit would put a stop to that through no more freedom of movement. These companies can't do the same with UK workers, because the supermarkets won't want to pay increased prices, and neither would consumers. So all of us, Leavers and Remainers were happy to let this go on as long as we got cheap fruit.

I'm kinda glad we aren't doing that now (although I'm under no illusions employee abuse isn't a thing anymore).

Do I pass your test for getting you to shut up about it now?
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This must be the biggest benefit of Brexit.
I know I'll enjoy my pint more because of it. (Is that 2 benefits?)
Crown on pint glasses
 
A local garage owner ot me said demand has gone up three times from the normal level. The direct problem is panic buying or buying ahead more than usual. Some might argue people are panicing because they think alot of tanker drivers have left the UK. I would expect the majority who have left to have left say before March 2020, so why was there no shortgages in February 2020?

We seem to be living in strange times. Reminds me of 1973/4.
 
Redwurzel said:
A local garage owner ot me said demand has gone up three times from the normal level. The direct problem is panic buying or buying ahead more than usual. Some might argue people are panicing because they think alot of tanker drivers have left the UK. I would expect the majority who have left to have left say before March 2020, so why was there no shortgages in February 2020?

We seem to be living in strange times. Reminds me of 1973/4.
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The majority left in Q2 2020.

Screenshot_20210929-140600.jpg
 
That makes fascinating reading Bear. I am going to assume they are calendar year quarters rather than financial year quarters. The total drop off from the maximums shown are 43% of UK drivers have left the industry without being replaced and 23% of EU based drivers have left without being replaced.

That in itself is not surprising as leaving the EU will push drivers back to their hoe countries. What does surprise me is there is a slight uptake from the EU in Q2 of 2021. A result of higher salaries is unlikely as they didnt start to kick in until Q3 really.

What is interesting is the total number of drivers in 2010 is less than 2020 before a large drop of in 2021. And that the drop off in 2021 is almost entirely UK based drivers, 60,000 of them.

Not sure what to conclude from that to be honest. Were Eu drivers leaving in droves at the prospect of being out of the EU, despite the increase after we left. It's possible, I suppose.

One thing htat can be gleaned from that table is that if no UK drivers had left the industry without being replaced we would have a similar driving pool to the peak in 2019.

@bear66 What do you make of the table?
 
Laughing said:
That makes fascinating reading Bear. I am going to assume they are calendar year quarters rather than financial year quarters. The total drop off from the maximums shown are 43% of UK drivers have left the industry without being replaced and 23% of EU based drivers have left without being replaced.

That in itself is not surprising as leaving the EU will push drivers back to their hoe countries. What does surprise me is there is a slight uptake from the EU in Q2 of 2021. A result of higher salaries is unlikely as they didnt start to kick in until Q3 really.

What is interesting is the total number of drivers in 2010 is less than 2020 before a large drop of in 2021. And that the drop off in 2021 is almost entirely UK based drivers, 60,000 of them.

Not sure what to conclude from that to be honest. Were Eu drivers leaving in droves at the prospect of being out of the EU, despite the increase after we left. It's possible, I suppose.

One thing htat can be gleaned from that table is that if no UK drivers had left the industry without being replaced we would have a similar driving pool to the peak in 2019.

@bear66 What do you make of the table?
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That was the gist of the article from which I got the table. It would be interesting to see how many HGV drivers are now driving parcel delivery vans.
 
bear66 said:
That was the gist of the article from which I got the table. It would be interesting to see how many HGV drivers are now driving parcel delivery vans.
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Thats possible I guess. Might be less money but you are seeping in your own bed on a night. It is a crap job with poor financial rewards.
 
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