England 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁥󠁮󠁧󠁿 v 🇩🇪 Germany

SmallTown said:
I really hope not. Getting excited because it's Germany is a little embarrassing now. Especially as they don't really care about us, we aren't the Netherlands who are their real rivals. It makes us look small to be so obsessed with a team that don't really care about us.
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But they do care about us.

Maybe not as much as we care about them, but they definitely do care about us. It's a lot more than 'any other game' to them.

Obviously we're not their main rivals, but they definitely care more than normal when this fixture comes around.

It's a bit like when we play Sunderland. We obviously get excited more than them. But when the mackems say they don't care about us, then they're blatantly lying, because they talk about us more than any other club (apart from Newcastle).
 
Nero said:
The Athletic reporting that Saka is playing with Foden, Grealish and Mount all on the bench.
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It'll be too late to win the game when he brings all 3 of them on unfortunately if that's the case. Whilst Saka was great in the last game does he have the same quality as Foden and Grealish to unlock a resolute defence?
 
SmallTown said:
I really hope not. Getting excited because it's Germany is a little embarrassing now. Especially as they don't really care about us, we aren't the Netherlands who are their real rivals. It makes us look small to be so obsessed with a team that don't really care about us.
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Nah, this is nonsense.
They might see another team as a bigger rival, but they absolutely do see this as a rivalry.
We don't see Scotland as our main rivals, it doesn't mean it's not a rivalry, or that Scotland are small for viewing us as their main rival.
Liverpool don't see Everton as their main rival, it doesn't mean it's not a rivalry, or that Everton are small for viewing them as their main rival.

This was their manager yesterday:

"I think all the matches between England and Germany you talk about for years after," added Löw.

"This is a match which electrifies everybody. For both teams, it's in or out, it's now or never, the loser goes home. There is a lot at stake tomorrow, I can feel the players are highly motivated and we have analysed the English side."

That definitely sounds like they care.
Unless you think they're electrified by every game.
 
Randy said:
It'll be too late to win the game when he brings all 3 of them on unfortunately if that's the case. Whilst Saka was great in the last game does he have the same quality as Foden and Grealish to unlock a resolute defence?
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To be honest, I am gutted Foden, Mount & Grealish aren't playing because they offer a great deal going forward and creatively they're our best attackers. However, looking at rumours of Germany's defensive injuries and problems, it looks like they're going to line up with Sule & Hummels at the back. These two make Stephen McManus look fast.

Saka & Sterling have pace to burn and will leave both of these trailing easily, so I can kind of understand these tactics (assuming the rumours are right).
 
I definitely see why we would go with pace, Germany play a high line and balls in behind their defence is their main weakness.
They’d prefer players like Grealish and Foden picking the ball up deep and trying to run at them than in behind.
I hope if it is true he isn’t picking Saka over them for his ability to track back though.
 
France should have got more goals from simple diagonal balls behind the German defence. Germany are slow at the back and lack a cutting edge. They barely had a shot on target against France. Expect England to do the same to them
 
TeaCider said:
Nah, this is nonsense.
They might see another team as a bigger rival, but they absolutely do see this as a rivalry.
We don't see Scotland as our main rivals, it doesn't mean it's not a rivalry, or that Scotland are small for viewing us as their main rival.
Liverpool don't see Everton as their main rival, it doesn't mean it's not a rivalry, or that Everton are small for viewing them as their main rival.

This was their manager yesterday:

"I think all the matches between England and Germany you talk about for years after," added Löw.

"This is a match which electrifies everybody. For both teams, it's in or out, it's now or never, the loser goes home. There is a lot at stake tomorrow, I can feel the players are highly motivated and we have analysed the English side."

That definitely sounds like they care.
Unless you think they're electrified by every game.
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Knowing the Germans they probably are in major competitions. The fact is their rivals are Netherlands. I find it embarrassing that people get so excited about playing Germany. Especially those that use way references (someone on here has already used “Churchillian”) it’s just all a bit backward and cringey to me
 
SmallTown said:
Knowing the Germans they probably are in major competitions. The fact is their rivals are Netherlands. I find it embarrassing that people get so excited about playing Germany. Especially those that use way references (someone on here has already used “Churchillian”) it’s just all a bit backward and cringey to me
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That's literally the whole reason there's a rivalry between the Netherlands and Germany.
If the Dutch weren't upset about German treatment during the war for so long, it would just be another match.

I guess that's embarassing too.
 
TeaCider said:
That's literally the whole reason there's a rivalry between the Netherlands and Germany.
If the Dutch weren't upset about German treatment during the war for so long, it would just be another match.

I guess that's embarassing too.
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It’s a proper local rivalry though. When we do it it’s kind of pathetic. Seems backwards to me
 
SmallTown said:
It’s a proper local rivalry though. When we do it it’s kind of pathetic. Seems backwards to me
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Nah, it's just you holding countries to different standards.
If it's pathetic when we do it, it's pathetic when the Dutch do it.
Neither are pathetic though.

War era banter and chants need to be relegated to history, they're offensive and unnecessary, and they're bound to fade away as fewer and fewer people have a direct connection the wars, but there's absolutely nothing wrong with having a sporting rivalry, it's part of the game.

But I'm sure you've said before that you're not actually a football fan, so I'm not surprised that the only thing you take from it as another reason to cringe at your country.
 
I dislike all the references to the war, however 3 of the biggest games in England’s history (66,90 & 96) have all been against Germany.
Even if it doesn’t seem that way to Germany, I always see England V Germany as a big game and one to look forward to.
 
LowMoorBoro said:
I dislike all the references to the war, however 3 of the biggest games in England’s history (66,90 & 96) have all been against Germany.
Even if it doesn’t seem that way to Germany, I always see England V Germany as a big game and one to look forward to.
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Exactly, they're a huge part of England's footballing history, more so than any other country.
It's natural to see it as a special occasion.
 
TeaCider said:
Nah, it's just you holding countries to different standards.
If it's pathetic when we do it, it's pathetic when the Dutch do it.
Neither are pathetic though.

War era banter and chants need to be relegated to history, they're offensive and unnecessary, and they're bound to fade away as fewer and fewer people have a direct connection the wars, but there's absolutely nothing wrong with having a sporting rivalry, it's part of the game.

But I'm sure you've said before that you're not actually a football fan, so I'm not surprised that the only thing you take from it as another reason to cringe at your country.
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That last paragraph is beyond ridiculous. Borderline offensive. I just don’t see Germans as rivals at all and people who do tend to have a war reference nice and handy behind it. Which is sad
 
LowMoorBoro said:
I dislike all the references to the war, however 3 of the biggest games in England’s history (66,90 & 96) have all been against Germany.
Even if it doesn’t seem that way to Germany, I always see England V Germany as a big game and one to look forward to.
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As Hening Wehn once said: “it’s not that we germans don’t consider games against England important. It’s just that we tend to have more important games in the competition after we have played you!
 
SmallTown said:
That last paragraph is beyond ridiculous. Borderline offensive. I just don’t see Germans as rivals at all and people who do tend to have a war reference nice and handy behind it. Which is sad
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What's ridiculous or offensive about it?
You have said before that you're not a football fan, and that you prefer rugby.

You never comment on Middlesbrough, and the only thing you've commented on relating to football recently is how it's embarassing that England see Germany as a rival.
 
TeaCider said:
What's ridiculous or offensive about it?
You have said before that you're not a football fan, and that you prefer rugby.

You never comment on Middlesbrough, and the only thing you've commented on relating to football recently is how it's embarassing that England see Germany as a rival.
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Because of the false assumptions you are making about me.
 
SmallTown said:
Because of the false assumptions you are making about me.
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There's no false assumption.
You don't like football, and you think it's embarassing that England have a rivalry with a team that has a long and storied history of games against England.

It's no surprise to me from your history of posting on here that you can only see the WW2 chants when there's so much more to it than that.
 
I work with several Germans on my current project. They see the rivalry and celebrate it as it should be, as sporting rivalry.

The only way that makes anyone cringe is if there is an agenda.

War chants are a bit childish but lots of football chants are.
 
I see it as rivalry.

I don't know how accurate this is, but we seem to have played Germany far more often in major tournaments in my life than France, Spain or Italy. The ignores '66 and '70, but I don't doubt some remember them too.
Germany have had the upper hand, but we've had our moments too.

A sporting rivalry is bound to develop if you play often enough and it's not entirely one sided. That's healthy and proper.

It doesn't mean I have to hate Germany or Germans though. It's my preferred holiday destination and, by and large, the people are great.
 
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