Starmer - Britain's Trump
- Thread starter redrobbo
- Start date
sherlock
Well-known member
Nobody can get a GP appointment so it's no surprise that less people are being referred on.
newyddion
Well-known member
Starmer would have made a good Conservative leader.. possibly more at home with the Lib Dems than Labour but would have been wasted with them
Corbyn would have made a good Labour leader.. and in fact he did.. possibly more at home with the Green Party where he would have been wasted.
We are well into third way politics now with no hope of returning back. The American model of right or further right seems deeply embedded now with folks not even understanding the difference between left and right only parroting what they have been told by American media outlets.. indeed some British media outlets have now adopted the language of leftists and patriots.. utter nonsense.
SmallTown
Well-known member
I guess you'll always have a counter argument to the facts. Cool, cool cool. And of course this one is untrue
sherlock
Well-known member
Labour did well to end the strikes so quickly, but that it literally the only thing they have done that has had any impact (however small) on the waiting lists.
This very small amount of progress will be undone by activity caps as described earlier in this thread, so I'm not exactly sure what you are celebrating.
SmallTown
Well-known member
I'm celebrating waiting lists coming down. I think this is a good thing.
Didn't get it twisted I'm not celebrating as in throwing a party and pooping champagne corks. But celebrating as in being pleased the direction of travel is correct
sherlock
Well-known member
But that's like saying you're celebrating driving at 2mph instead of 1mph knowing that there is a road block around the corner.
Do you not understand the implications of the activity caps and recruitment freezes from April?
SmallTown
Well-known member
You also have to know that NHS planning is an annual process so anything happening from April last year to now was already in place under the previous government. Nothing has changed operationally since Labour have been in charge. The only changes have been the ending of the strikes (we were already planning for 0 strikes), which was obviously a good thing , but they are the reason that waiting list were going up in the first place because a lot of elective procedures were cancelled during the strikes. Claiming credit for it is the similar to the Tories claiming credit for inflation coming down last year when global prices of energy reducing meant it was inevitable anyway.
Governments have to balance between what s best for patients/society and what is the lowest cost. I had always assumed that the Tories were the lowest cost option. Spend as little as they can get away with, doesn't really matter if outcomes, waiting times etc were getting worse because the only thing being tracked is spending. I had assumed that Labour were the opposite and focusing on patient outcomes and those sort of metrics instead of the costs was how they would improve the NHS but the planning guidance for the coming year is all about reducing cost and targets around activity and outcomes are absent which is disappointing. There is obviously waste in the system. It would be impossible to have £185bn of spending and some of it not be wasted but there are different options for improving things and austerity isn't one that has worked in the past.
sherlock
Well-known member
You're just trolling now (again).
There is no possible scenario where activity caps and recruitment freezes have a positive impact on waiting list numbers.
SmallTown
Well-known member
I'm not. I'm wondering what you're so annoyed about. And I agree but I also think the NHS is bloated and full of too many people who don't fulfil healthcare roles
sherlock
Well-known member
As has been pointed out to you many times, lots of those roles are essential to the running of the service. You can't have a health service with just doctors and nurses in the same way you can't have a football club with just players.
There is, but it involves the Grim Reaper working overtime. Perhaps that's the plan.
SmallTown
Well-known member
It hasn't been "pointed out to me many times" no need to be so confrontational.
I also know you can't run a health service without doctors. Please moderate your language and also stop speaking in extremes. Reducing management levels in the NHS does Not mean removing all Non doctors.
sherlock
Well-known member
What language?
Billy Horner
Well-known member
Edit - wrong thread!
Keir Starmer is having his chainsaw moment – but all he will slash is democracy | Simon Jenkins
The PM sounds like Elon Musk when promising to fight the ‘blockers’, but his government’s plans will weaken the link between peoples and politics, says Guardian columnist Simon Jenkins
www.theguardian.com
Boro.Fur
Well-known member
From a journalist with absolutely no credibility whatsoever.Keir Starmer is having his chainsaw moment – but all he will slash is democracy | Simon Jenkins
The PM sounds like Elon Musk when promising to fight the ‘blockers’, but his government’s plans will weaken the link between peoples and politics, says Guardian columnist Simon Jenkins
Zoophonic
Well-known member
Its all very well Jenkins carping on about stuff like this but would he rather they don't do anything about a bloated Health service mid management. I suspect no but then again it it gives him ammunition for his opinion piece. All he says is "it remains to be seen if it works". Er yes Simon thanks for that wisdom.Keir Starmer is having his chainsaw moment – but all he will slash is democracy | Simon Jenkins
The PM sounds like Elon Musk when promising to fight the ‘blockers’, but his government’s plans will weaken the link between peoples and politics, says Guardian columnist Simon Jenkins
sherlock
Well-known member
It's interesting this thread.
First, let me be explicit, I don't think Starmer is Britain's Trump. Not even close.
However I can see similarities in people's responses to what they are doing, in that they are giving messages that some people are then just accepting as fact, with little knowledge or evidence to back up their own beliefs.
The number of people that are now using the word 'bloated' about the Health Service (and the public sector in general) without any actual knowledge of those sectors is incredible. It's become truth to them. Not because they have evidence to back up what they say, but because they have been told it by someone in power.
It's not MAGA levels, but it's fascinating nonetheless.
First, let me be explicit, I don't think Starmer is Britain's Trump. Not even close.
However I can see similarities in people's responses to what they are doing, in that they are giving messages that some people are then just accepting as fact, with little knowledge or evidence to back up their own beliefs.
The number of people that are now using the word 'bloated' about the Health Service (and the public sector in general) without any actual knowledge of those sectors is incredible. It's become truth to them. Not because they have evidence to back up what they say, but because they have been told it by someone in power.
It's not MAGA levels, but it's fascinating nonetheless.