I'd guess that Trump will tell Zelensky that US support will reduce and end by the end of Dec 2025. So negotiate something with Putin before then or you are on your own. Trump will tell Putin that sanctions on Russia will end if he agrees a settlement with Ukraine.
Russia/Ukraine
- Thread starter RenzoRosso
- Start date
I see an opportunity.
Time will tell if it comes to anything.
I don’t see anything else bringing this conflict to an end.
Ukrainians will decide when it’s over. They’ll decide if they want to sacrifice their land for a likely temporary peace with an autocratic, revanchist regime that has repeatedly broken international treaties and told us exactly what they stand for. The rest of the world can talk and theorise, but what will be is up to Ukrainians as they have their own agency, something that we all seem to talk is if they don’t.
RavsFan
Well-known member
The huge problem with any settlement and Putins regime remaining is it allows him time to rebuild, restock weaponry, troops etc to turn his economy around as the west opens up trade again then the regime to have another go once the world thinks he has settled and we’re all looking elsewhere. Putin himself may be in another dimension by then, but the regime will plunder on.
There are contenders in the wings. People who are/ were around Putin, some with more or less their own private armies of varying sizes. Could get very interesting.
They wouldn’t have a great deal of
agency without external support.
The level of support the US provides to Ukraine gives Trump very significant leverage with Zelensky.
I don’t buy, or at all relish,the idea of Europe propping up Ukraine if the US were to pull out.
If a deal is thrust on the Ukrainians that proves unpopular then many will want to fight on. It may change the style of warfare, but it’s the will of Ukrainians that counts. If the majority decide to stop fighting, then again that is their choice. Zelenskyy is only one factor.
If Ukraine falls to Russian aggression, then there’s a good chance we will be wishing we propped them up when we had the chance.
Half of Ukrainians Want Quick, Negotiated End to War
Ukrainians are growing increasingly weary of the war with Russia. Gallup's latest surveys of Ukraine show 52% would like to see the war end as soon as possible.
news.gallup.com
Ukrainian people are understandably becoming increasingly sick and tired of war.
I think we would also be wishing we had taken a different path if this conflict escalated horrifically.
Russia are not just going to give up and I genuinely believe they will do anything in their means if they feel sufficiently threatened.
SuedeDenimSecretPolice
Active member
So do you relish leaving the Ukrainians to their fate knowing that historically this will probably mean genocide? Do you relish the thought of Russia rearming and doing the same to Romania, Georgia, etc? After all, they will have proved there would be no consequences for their actions?
There may never be a better time to blunt Russia's aggressive and expansionistic tendencies that serves only the elite and non of the populace.
It is possible to achieve a deal and give Ukraine protection.
SuedeDenimSecretPolice
Active member
Not if people are advocating the ending of support. Why agree to protection for Ukraine when they can just wait for the support to end and get everything they want?
Hap
Well-known member
Who will guarantee Ukraine’s security?
Trump? No chance. The attitude towards Europe is to reallocate resources back to the US and step back from supporting NATO.
Putin? He cannot be trusted to stick to any agreement as demonstrated repeatedly.
The AXIS of resistance against the influence of West, and promoters of Autocracy? China, Iran and North Korea? Turkey even? Why would they safeguard Ukraine’s democratic society? It flies in the face of their own principles.
The EU? They doing what they can already. This is how they are guaranteeing Ukraine’s future. It’s not pretty, it’s uncertain and it will take time to erode Russia to the point that they can no longer threaten their neighbours. The money is starting to run out in Russia. Check the exchange rates, for one thing.
It’s not in Ukraines interest to negotiate now. It is definitely in Russia’s interest to pause hostilities and regroup for a fresh push at some future point.
I guess, but don’t know, somewhere over a million people have needlessly died for nothing more than Putin lust for mineral resources, power and legacy. This was never about protecting his borders against NATO.
Some of what has been submitted on this thread reads like it could almost have been written by our chatroom friends in St Petersburg.
Hap
Well-known member
Trump has it made it very clear he is unwilling to continue to fund their commitment to NATO at the current level. He is reducing their contribution and reallocating that money to internal needs.
The US are not going to be there to prop Ukraine up.
Hap
Well-known member
Trump has already told you.
Hap
Well-known member
He has been quoted probably thousands of times since 2017.
Here’s just one.
“Donald Trump said to Ursula, ’You need to understand that if Europe is under attack we will never come to help you and to support you,” Breton alleged Trump said at a meeting at the World Economic Forum in Davos, Switzerland.
“By the way, NATO is dead, and we will leave, we will quit NATO,” Trump also said, according to Breton.
