Muzzy Carayol on playing for Aitor Karanka

coluka said:
I appreciate this had nothing to do with race. My comment was to suggest it had nothing to do with race. Maybe I could have worded it better. This board has people who are quick to highlight racial issues and I was trying to stop that happening plus some people do think Karanka was a toxic manager, I was trying to say that there were issues with various players and to stop anyone on the board from maybe thinking it was about skin colour. Karanka was a manager that split the fans. I am a huge fan of his. MC clearly disliked him, Clayton and Friend are 2 players that seemingly have a very different opinion to MC.

MC has done a job on him, Anyone who has managed people will understand it is very difficult when you come across an employee who does not buy into the way you run things. Equally if a manager is a bad manager, you tend to find most staff feel that not just one or two in a group. AK was reinstated by Gibson after 4 senior players stood up for him. MC should have kept his thoughts to himself.
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TBF Col no one mentioned race except you;)

I don't really agree with your last sentence though, I mean what's he got to lose by talking about it? Unless he's after a contract at Birmingham which seems unlikely. I don't think Aitor being a bit of a prickly character is news to anyone. He'll always be remembered by Boro fans as delivering two great seasons after nearly a decade of real mediocrity.
 
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atypical_boro said:
TBF Col no one mentioned race except you;)

I don't really agree with your last sentence though, I mean what's he got to lose by talking about it? Unless he's after a contract at Birmingham which seems unlikely.
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And my post was to prevent that from happening for the reasons I stated. AK is disliked by many a Boro fan despite being the best head coach since 2006. It would have been all to easy for some to try to go there even though there was nothing to see. Karanka is still in management and just gone to a new club. MC‘s comments could influence one or two Birmingham players judgements, he was wrong to go public like that. IMHO it says more about him than AK.
 
coluka said:
And my post was to prevent that from happening for the reasons I stated. AK is disliked by many a Boro fan despite being the best head coach since 2006. It would have been all to easy for some to try to go there even though there was nothing to see. Karanka is still in management and just gone to a new club. MC‘s comments could influence one or two Birmingham players judgements, he was wrong to go public like that. IMHO it says more about him than AK.
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Well fair enough.

Can I also just say that MC’s comments were in no way homophobic either.
 
coluka said:
And my post was to prevent that from happening for the reasons I stated. AK is disliked by many a Boro fan despite being the best head coach since 2006. It would have been all to easy for some to try to go there even though there was nothing to see. Karanka is still in management and just gone to a new club. MC‘s comments could influence one or two Birmingham players judgements, he was wrong to go public like that. IMHO it says more about him than AK.
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If your post was prevent that from happening it's actually almost caused the opposite. I don't think anyone was even thinking about race until you mentioned it. Sneaky.
 
atypical_boro said:
Well fair enough.

Can I also just say that MC’s comments were in no way homophobic either.
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You can, but you are just trying to be snide by saying that imho, at least Abel Tasman also acknowledged he could also see why some people might read into his comments that some racism might be interpreted as being at play. You are generally a good poster atypical, no need for that last line, totally unnecessary, like MC’s comments on AK were.
 
Rofesleg said:
If your post was prevent that from happening it's actually almost caused the opposite. I don't think anyone was even thinking about race until you mentioned it. Sneaky.
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Not sneaky at all, poorly worded maybe yes. I have clarified, but clearly that is not acceptable to you. I will live with it, I am sure you scrutinise every word you say or write and never leave anything to doubt, well done you.
 
coluka said:
You can, but you are just trying to be snide by saying that imho, at least Abel Tasman also acknowledged he could also see why some people might read into his comments that some racism might be interpreted as being at play. You are generally a good poster atypical, no need for that last line, totally unnecessary, like MC’s comments on AK were.
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'Oway man I wasn't being totally serious.(y)
 
atypical_boro said:
'Oway man I wasn't being totally serious.(y)
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I appreciate you were not being ‘totally’ serious atypical. Maybe I am being too defensive, I admit I was irked by it. Following on from your comment though, Rofesleg then calls me sneaky, yeah. I wonder how some Birmingham players might interpret MC’s comments if things don’t go their way :unsure: Words often have unintended consequences on others thoughts thats all.
 
coluka said:
I appreciate you were not being ‘totally’ serious atypical. Maybe I am being too defensive, I admit I was irked by it. Following on from your comment though, Rofesleg then calls me sneaky, yeah. I wonder how some Birmingham players might interpret MC’s comments if things don’t go their way :unsure: Words often have unintended consequences on others thoughts thats all.
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All part of the game though isn't it? Muzzy is only giving his own thoughts about how he felt, he hasn't said anything defamatory. Its up to other people whether they care about those thoughts or not.
 
I actually thought Carayol might of been about race when I watched it. He didn’t say that of course, but he was basically saying Karanka didn’t have a reason not to like him. So I get where Col is coming from to be honest. People interpret things differently
 
2 things I think ken omeruo had a brilliant first season with us. Far more consistent than muzzy. Other thing I recall is muzzy left boro for the bright lights he said middlesbrough was too green apparently...too much countryside!
 
I remember one of the players posting a picture on instagram (it was removed pretty quickly) of a step at the training ground with the tag "Muzzy Carayol naughty step"
 
atypical_boro said:
All part of the game though isn't it? Muzzy is only giving his own thoughts about how he felt, he hasn't said anything defamatory. Its up to other people whether they care about those thoughts or not.
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He did not give one single reason for his comments, not a one. He came across as a spoilt brat imho. There was nothing said to justify his feelings on AK. He even said he was the best player at the club :eek: He most certainly was not, he was a curates egg of a player. His career shows that. He must have a seriously inflated opinion of himself. He is bitter about AK, it was personal. If you are going to publicly slate someone, wrong as I believe it is to do that, at least justify why with his reasoning.
 
coluka said:
He did not give one single reason for his comments, not a one. He came across as a spoilt brat imho. There was nothing said to justify his feelings on AK. He even said he was the best player at the club :eek: He most certainly was not, he was a curates egg of a player. His career shows that. He must have a seriously inflated opinion of himself. He is bitter about AK, it was personal. If you are going to publicly slate someone, wrong as I believe it is to do that, at least justify why with his reasoning.
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Funny how people interpret things. Me I thought he was being refreshingly honest. Its not often you can say that about footballers in the media. Usually its monosyllabic answers or PR guff that they utter. Then when they say things that they actually feel people are quick to jump on them.
 
coluka said:
He did not give one single reason for his comments, not a one. He came across as a spoilt brat imho. There was nothing said to justify his feelings on AK. He even said he was the best player at the club :eek: He most certainly was not, he was a curates egg of a player. His career shows that. He must have a seriously inflated opinion of himself. He is bitter about AK, it was personal. If you are going to publicly slate someone, wrong as I believe it is to do that, at least justify why with his reasoning.
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I think part of his problem was that he didn't know the reason. Anyway, I'm not going to get into who is right and wrong, MC says he was 'the best player at the time' which people will scrutinise but I would guess he was talking about recent form rather than claiming he was the best player at the club per se. That's how I took it. Likewise, Karanka was well known for falling out with players so these comments don't seem particularly nuclear to me. As said above, Clayton and Friend must think he was alright though.
 
I think Karanka adopted a bit of the Mourinho-style from their time working together, very opinionated and strong-minded. I doubt either change their stance much, if ever and demand everything on and off the pitch from their players (rightly or wrongly). He was clearly very intelligent. I suppose all of these attributes have a tendency to cause friction. I do like a strong and fiery character though and it must be difficult to please all of the egos in the dressing room. I couldn't imagine Warnock mincing his words/opinions much either.
 
Zoophonic said:
Funny how people interpret things. Me I thought he was being refreshingly honest. Its not often you can say that about footballers in the media. Usually its monosyllabic answers or PR guff that they utter. Them when they say things that they actually feel people are quick to jump on them.
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Honest about what though? How do you know he was being honest rather than vindictive for example? As I said to Atypical, he never once gave an example to back up his feelings on AK.

I am a huge fan of AK, the best leader imho we have had since 2006 to 2020. MC may have cause to feel like he does, he had an opportunity to justify why and did not take it in the clip shown. Maybe more was said but not broadcast, but based on that clip, he just sounds like a bitter spoilt man with an over inflated opinion of himself imho. AK was an authoritarian manager, his style upset some, he wanted things done his way, as the guy in charge of team affairs, so he should. As with all teams in all workplace environments, some managers are loved and some hated. AK had higher standards than some were happy to meet or offer is my view.
 
coluka said:
Honest about what though? How do you know he was being honest rather than vindictive for example? As I said to Atypical, he never once gave an example to back up his feelings on AK.

I am a huge fan of AK, the best leader imho we have had since 2006 to 2020. MC may have cause to feel like he does, he had an opportunity to justify why and did not take it in the clip shown. Maybe more was said but not broadcast, but based on that clip, he just sounds like a bitter spoilt man with an over inflated opinion of himself imho. AK was an authoritarian manager, his style upset some, he wanted things done his way, as the guy in charge of team affairs, so he should. As with all teams in all workplace environments, some managers are loved and some hated. AK had higher standards than some were happy to meet or offer is my view.
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Honest about his feelings - which looked genuine to me. Now I don't know how he was set up with that conversation but it looked like something said during a longer conversation and not something specific he wanted to air. We don't know whether he was being "vindictive or not" to be sure but even if he was there must have been something that sparked it. BUT I don't get the feeling he was in my opinion.
 
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