Middlesbrough Supporters Forum - Monday

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Scrug said:
I would absolutely love to go along with MSF and see exactly what they get up to.
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I heard at the last meeting a little doll with Pontiac Bandit written on the back was thrown on to the firepit they all sit around. There was a chant to accompany this, but I couldn't quite make it out
 
RedcarRed said:
I heard at the last meeting a little doll with Pontiac Bandit written on the back was thrown on to the firepit they all sit around. There was a chant to accompany this, but I couldn't quite make it out
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Did the doll look like SG? If so, are you sure that wasn’t Red Factions AGM?
 
I asked ChatGPT to do the minutes instead. This feels scarily accurate:




Middlesbrough Supporters Forum
Minutes of the Meeting
Date: Thursday, 23rd November 2024
Time: 7:00 PM
Venue: The Riverside Suite, Middlesbrough Football Club

1. Attendance and Apologies​

Present:

  • Chair: Norman Hardwick
  • Vice-Chair: Felicity Bowler
  • Secretary: Geoffrey Snibson
  • Treasurer: Margaret Pringle
  • Members: Nigel Wotherspoon, Cynthia Durlow, Frank Weatherby, Sarah Pilkington
Apologies:

  • Clive Bannerman (on holiday in the Algarve)
  • Patricia Jones (conflict with her Bridge Club schedule)
The meeting was quorate.

2. Approval of Previous Minutes​

The Chair reviewed the minutes from the previous meeting held on 9th October 2024. Sarah Pilkington noted that her name had been misspelled as "Sara." Geoffrey Snibson apologized and confirmed the correction would be made.

The minutes were approved by the majority, with one abstention (Nigel Wotherspoon, who stated he had not read them).

3. Matters Arising​

  • Fan Representation in Club Decisions:
    Felicity Bowler noted that the club had still not responded to the forum’s proposed 18-page questionnaire regarding the price of pies at the stadium. She expressed dismay that this lack of engagement demonstrated "a worrying disregard for democracy in catering matters."
    Action: Geoffrey Snibson to follow up with the club's Catering Manager.
  • Away Travel Subsidy:
    Norman Hardwick emphasized that this initiative "must be approached with the utmost procedural integrity." The forum resolved to form a subcommittee to discuss potential routes, ticket price brackets, and seating arrangements for fans.
    Subcommittee members: Margaret Pringle, Frank Weatherby, and Cynthia Durlow.

4. Treasurer’s Report​

Margaret Pringle presented the financial report. The forum's funds currently stand at £137.92 after deducting costs for last month’s raffle prizes. Margaret reminded members that the raffle proceeds were earmarked for forum stationery and not to be used for “frivolous ventures like banners or flags for general fan use.”

Nigel Wotherspoon queried whether the balance could be better utilized to improve fan experience. This suggestion was dismissed as "unrealistic" by the Chair.

5. New Business​

  • Fan Chants Policy:
    Cynthia Durlow proposed drafting a "Code of Conduct" for chants to ensure they reflect the values of the forum. She expressed concern about “overly exuberant language” in some sections of the stadium.
    After a 15-minute debate, it was agreed that the forum would survey members on their opinions regarding chant content.
    Action: Geoffrey Snibson to draft a survey for review at the next meeting.
  • Forum Badge Design:
    Sarah Pilkington suggested the forum design and distribute lapel pins to raise the profile of the group. Frank Weatherby countered that such expenditure was "frivolous" and suggested members could simply wear club merchandise to show allegiance.
    No resolution was reached, and the matter was deferred.

6. Correspondence​

Geoffrey Snibson read out a letter from a concerned fan regarding ticket pricing for children. Norman Hardwick advised that while the concern was valid, the tone of the letter was "too informal" for the forum to take action.

7. Any Other Business​

  • Felicity Bowler announced she would be unavailable for the January meeting due to a prior commitment (a yoga retreat).
  • Sarah Pilkington proposed arranging a Christmas social event for forum members. After much discussion, it was decided that the forum could not justify the expense this year.

8. Date of Next Meeting​

The next meeting will take place on Thursday, 11th January 2025, at 7:00 PM in the Riverside Suite.

Meeting Adjourned: 8:45 PM

Minutes prepared by Geoffrey Snibson, Secretary
 
Scrug said:
So they want to avoid being held to their word.
That’s life, be open and honest. If fans like it, great, if they don’t, then at least you get an honest discourse. Without that, there’s always going to be a divide.

That says it all really.

No interest in transparency, only carefully curated placation. MSF are apparently the vehicle for that.

That’s fine, but please don’t pretend that MSF is the voice of the fans anymore and just enjoy the inner circle. You’ve earned it.
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Exactly this. Not even trying to pretend there is any transparency or accountability. It's a total waste of time except for the benefits t brings to the people involved.
 
Nano said:
For MSF to actually be useful it has to have proper processes for admitting members. The current method of MSF selecting who to invite is obviously not ideal. Then you have the prices for selecting who represents the groups. Rob represents FMTTM but there's no process for selecting that other than Rob being in charge and picking himself.

For MSF to have a purpose it has to hold MFC accountable for the decisions it makes and to do that it has to be openly critical of those decisions when they are not in the interests of fans. I don't think there is any critique from MSF and they just blindly accept without challenge anything that MFC tells them.

There is no process for electing the FMTTM representative on the MSF so it is unsurprising that there are questions being asked.

From the outside it seems very much like the people that have appointed themselves as the MSF enjoy the idea of being close to the club, having connections, and receiving benefits from those connections and the club see it as an easy box ticking exercise with no consequences or accountability needed.
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Held accountable? They aren’t a government! I agree with most of the sentiment, but at the end of the day the club can and will do what it wants. Fair play to those involved for having a go.
 
Otto42 said:
Held accountable? They aren’t a government! I agree with most of the sentiment, but at the end of the day the club can and will do what it wants. Fair play to those involved for having a go.
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Yes, held accountable. The football club belongs to the fans. The people running the football club should do it properly and they should be able to justify why they make certain decisions and don't what is right for fans should be high on the agenda. The forum is there for that purpose, to hold the club accountable for their decisions.

The people on that forum are our representatives. They are self-appointed so to have any legitimacy they have to be held accountable otherwise it looks like they are only there out of self-interest.

If there was a possibility of the forum being useful it could save fans money, it could do things that means more fans can attend. Having a forum could be really useful but it seems that the several years it has been running it has achieved absolutely nothing and we still have all the same issues with being one of the worst clubs at our level in terms of prices, availablity of merchandise, cohorts of fans treated terribly and generally being horrendous value for money.
 
Will_Graham said:
I might be wrong, but I thought Rob's whole 'business plan' revolved around this message board, raising his profile and promoting relationships with MFC.
So attending those meetings is not really the same as someone working full time in retail, or whatever, giving up their time.
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Not at all.

I have run a fanzine since the 1990s.
I have run a message board for over 20 years.
I dont get privileges. I buy my own tickets home and away.
I ask questions on behalf of fans. We should hopefully get another Q and A with the chairman or Chief Exec this season where like last term you can ask your questions in person.
 
fmttmadmin said:
Not at all.

I have run a fanzine since the 1990s.
I have run a message board for over 20 years.
I dont get privileges. I buy my own tickets home and away.
I ask questions on behalf of fans. We should hopefully get another Q and A with the chairman or Chief Exec this season where like last term you can ask your questions in person.
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I didn't suggest you don't pay for tickets.
I was responding to the point made that you give up your free time to attend the meetings.
My understanding is that the fanzine and this website are effectively your businesses and sources of income. I would think any direct links to MFC can only benefit those interests.

Nothing wrong with that and fair play. But your time spent attending those meetings isn't the same as most other people's free time. Which was my only point.
 
Will_Graham said:
I didn't suggest you don't pay for tickets.
I was responding to the point made that you give up your free time to attend the meetings.
My understanding is that the fanzine and this website are effectively your businesses and sources of income. I would think any direct links to MFC can only benefit those interests.

Nothing wrong with that and fair play. But your time spent attending those meetings isn't the same as most other people's free time. Which was my only point.
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It is still time. Whichever way you want to put it.
But don't get wrong - it is privilege to go to these meetings.
 
Could having 'FMTTM' be a small committee of trusted forum members who attend meetings, rather than just Rob, be a possible solution to some of the issues mentioned on here?
 
newyddion said:
or maybe just do away with MSF and just allow normal fans to have their say.
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Problem with that is "normal fans" will probably be treated by the club in the same way that it appears non-ST holders are.

A forum is a good idea in theory I reckon. But the club need to be held to account on certain things, surely? (see shirts for starters).

It's December. Still no stock.
 
PensionerCorner said:
Problem with that is "normal fans" will probably be treated by the club in the same way that it appears non-ST holders are.

A forum is a good idea in theory I reckon. But the club need to be held to account on certain things, surely? (see shirts for starters).

It's December. Still no stock.
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if a supporters forum doesn’t pass stuff on from fans to the club and vice versa.. then there’s no point in having one.

the club is supposed to have a head of supporter services.. just have a better format for speaking to them and relaying feedback.
 
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