Lucy letby

This whole affair is beyond a national disgrace. Negligence, dereliction of duty and cover ups beyond comprehension. As much as we all love the NHS, it isn’t fit for purpose any longer, it needs route and branch restructure, serious funding for recruitment, retention and urgent training. Failures, cover ups, mismanagement from the politicians down through years have all contributed, but non more so than the tories.

It doesn’t stop there sadly, C.E.O’s, Directors and Managers with no NHS experience, on huge salaries trying to run it as a private business and you can’t. They lose sight of what they are there to provide, patting themselves on the back for finding short cuts, savings, employing clerical staff to justify their own positions, when the need for investment in appropriately paid staff (dr’s nurses etc) across the service. We all need to pay more in taxes as it wont be fundable within current taxation. There are far too many people chasing their own tails currently that the Lucy Letby’s and Shipmans et al don’t get noticed quickly enough. There is also an element of fear in reporting within current structures from above that needs urgently addressing. Whistleblowers should be rewarded, not bullied or removed.

Whatever term she gets, I doubt she will survive prison. This is a case where those in favour of the death penalty will win support.
As someone who works in this industry, that doesn't describe my experience of how hospitals are run at all. The majority of CEOs and those at director level are vastly experienced within the NHS and have spent most of their career working their way up the ladder from clinical or operational roles. In the vast majority of situations it isn't a case of not enough money to spend on Drs and nurses but not enough Drs and nurses available to fill vacancies. We often have the money but there aren't the staff we need available so we end up paying a premium for agency and locum staff. Staff are also underpaid and overworked so are unhappy doing their jobs. Ever changing teams makes it harder to spot patterns in people's behaviour. Desperation to hold on to staff and not lose anyone means when staff were saying she should have been removed everyone is probably thinking incompetence, which can be improved with support and training, rather than presuming malice/murder.

I don't disagree that there is an issue with whistleblowing and bad behaviour. That's not just the fault of managers though. Doctors are often running departments and they were trained a certain way and expect juniors to experience the same things they did with regards to long shifts etc which is bad for patient safety.

In general though all of the problems are around not having enough trained staff and most of that can be corrected by paying more and making the jobs more desirable.

Don't forget that this is an extremely rare case. It's not like every hospital is failing to spot a serial killer within their midst.
 
It was noticed earlier and consultants wanted her moved and a police investigation.

Management later made the consultants sign a letter of apology to her and the outgoing senior person told his/her successor that the consultants should be reported to the GMC.
I'm hearing some real horror stories about the NHS at the moment, one very close to me. Hospital and ward management, backside covering and blatant lying.

Why are we letting the Tories do this to us?
 
As someone who works in this industry, that doesn't describe my experience of how hospitals are run at all. The majority of CEOs and those at director level are vastly experienced within the NHS and have spent most of their career working their way up the ladder from clinical or operational roles. In the vast majority of situations it isn't a case of not enough money to spend on Drs and nurses but not enough Drs and nurses available to fill vacancies. We often have the money but there aren't the staff we need available so we end up paying a premium for agency and locum staff. Staff are also underpaid and overworked so are unhappy doing their jobs. Ever changing teams makes it harder to spot patterns in people's behaviour. Desperation to hold on to staff and not lose anyone means when staff were saying she should have been removed everyone is probably thinking incompetence, which can be improved with support and training, rather than presuming malice/murder.

I don't disagree that there is an issue with whistleblowing and bad behaviour. That's not just the fault of managers though. Doctors are often running departments and they were trained a certain way and expect juniors to experience the same things they did with regards to long shifts etc which is bad for patient safety.

In general though all of the problems are around not having enough trained staff and most of that can be corrected by paying more and making the jobs more desirable.

Don't forget that this is an extremely rare case. It's not like every hospital is failing to spot a serial killer within their midst.
I have no doubt that some are and probably vastly experienced and it may becoming more and more the case, hopefully, Scarborough has had a very chequered history though and was failing before its merger with York and the new trust formed about 12 yrs ago. My experience of Scarborough at that time was as described. It is better but not vastly since the ‘merger’. Unfortunately it is predominantly York centric for some services and a visit to both hospitals is an eye opener York being superior. Scarborough has finally had some investment but staffing levels are less than ideal. I have had some recent experience of both. You can see a specialist at either, but anecdotal evidence and long standing local belief from those i know of is if you choose York over Scarborough, your waiting times are generally likely to be lower. I appreciate managing services across a big county will not be easy when resources are at a premium, a new trauma centre is coming but for ages travel to Hull, York or even occasionally James Cook was common place, York is the daddy and Scarborough its annoying little brother which given the towns size and rural environs is not ideal in certain emergencies.

The comments re administrative managers was anecdotal from friends who were nurses there. I am sure there are good and bad and there is a national postcode lottery.
 
I have no doubt that some are and probably vastly experienced and it may becoming more and more the case, hopefully, Scarborough has had a very chequered history though and was failing before its merger with York and the new trust formed about 12 yrs ago. My experience of Scarborough at that time was as described. It is better but not vastly since the ‘merger’. Unfortunately it is predominantly York centric for some services and a visit to both hospitals is an eye opener York being superior. Scarborough has finally had some investment but staffing levels are less than ideal. I have had some recent experience of both. You can see a specialist at either, but anecdotal evidence and long standing local belief from those i know of is if you choose York over Scarborough, your waiting times are generally likely to be lower. I appreciate managing services across a big county will not be easy when resources are at a premium, a new trauma centre is coming but for ages travel to Hull, York or even occasionally James Cook was common place, York is the daddy and Scarborough its annoying little brother which given the towns size and rural environs is not ideal in certain emergencies.

The comments re administrative managers was anecdotal from friends who were nurses there. I am sure there are good and bad and there is a national postcode lottery.
There is a significant challenge across the country to get people to work in less desirable areas. Doctors and nurses, particularly those coming from abroad, want to live and work in cities. Even locals don't want to stick around because they've moved away for university and meet friends and partners and got used to city life etc.

Staff will always complain about managers, in any line of work. Everyone thinks they are making bad decisions or they don't know what they are doing, especially if they have never done that clinical role but they are difficult jobs and people aren't perfect.
 
Also before anyone jumps on, I just referenced that case because I remember reading an article a few months back where it was said that Letby’s shift patterns were a ‘key part’ of the prosecution’s case and why that was a potential problem. It referenced the Lucia de Berk case and one in America as well.
I am not jumping on you. The de Berk mis-trial and Nelles (in America) were from poor autopsy reports and "avoidable accumulation of potentially toxic levels of bezothiazoldes in babies receiving intravenous therapy" being recorded in those autopsy reports.
I think everyone has been very diligent, especially the jurors, in this trial to not mix co-incidence and causality. Hence the length of the trial and the hung jury some of these terrible, terrible events.
 
Pure evil. The hospital senior management should be cleared out as consultants and staff who went to them were told not to make a fuss. Letby even took out a grievance claim against one consultant who tried to raise the alarm against her.
I don't know how the families will ever be able to cope with what has happened.
 
Really surprised by this verdict. From day one it looked like another Lucia de Berk, and the evidence as reported in the press has been far from convincing. Just have to trust that the jury saw something we didn't.

Mate, I think this might be a slightly misjudged post that you might want to reconsider.
There most certainly was an abundance of evidence that we, the public, have not been privy to.
This isn’t a case of unfortunate coincidences of shift timings and natural deaths etc.
This thing is the most prolific child killer, and there is no doubt about it. She is pure evil personified.
 
Really surprised by this verdict. From day one it looked like another Lucia de Berk, and the evidence as reported in the press has been far from convincing. Just have to trust that the jury saw something we didn't.
I am surprised that you are surprised
 
Was this a case where the perpetrator/killer was viewed as a “sweet thing” and “butter wouldn’t melt in her mouth” type scenario as to why this was allowed to happen? It brings back memories of watching the movie coma, and the evil that could happen in hospitals/medical units because lack of funding or lack of resources.

I still can’t understand the evil inside this person — murdering twins with a lethal injection.
 
Some of the evidence coming out tonight is just sickening... and this will just be the tip of the ice burg.


evidence of Trophy collecting from the dead babies (clothing, toys, sheets, paperwork etc)
members of staff actually saying is she on duty tonight when the alarms went off
targeting parents on social media

she wants stringing up
 
The news today and what went on has really shocked me. How anyone could do such a thing boggles my mind. The most evil thing anyone could do . Poor souls
 
Apparently she is going to refuse to appear in court on Monday for sentencing, what an evil piece of vermin she is! They should leave a piece of rope in her prison cell and tell her to do the decent thing.
 
I am not jumping on you. The de Berk mis-trial and Nelles (in America) were from poor autopsy reports and "avoidable accumulation of potentially toxic levels of bezothiazoldes in babies receiving intravenous therapy" being recorded in those autopsy reports.
I think everyone has been very diligent, especially the jurors, in this trial to not mix co-incidence and causality. Hence the length of the trial and the hung jury some of these terrible, terrible events.
I will say that having read some of the coverage and reporting of this case tonight after work, I don’t think it’s sensible to get involved TBH. I don’t know enough to have an opinion and do not want to offend anyone. I regret linking to a case that may well be completely different without really knowing the facts.

RIP to those poor little babies, whose suffering it is sort of easy to overlook in cases such as this. Their suffering is unimaginable.
 
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