Have to laugh at the stick Lineker and Gary Neville get on social media/Twitter

BoroMart said:
teachers don't plan curricula in a national certification, the version of blooms is irrelevant to the point oo.

Nobody is arguing that it would be impossible to have the ability to solve at Blooms higher levels without formal education. But it is less likely as Blooms will arm you with the necessary toolkit to address issues that work at the higher level.

What you appear to be arguing it that formal education isn't necessary and you could pick someone out of a rainforest and they would be born with the intellectual skills necessary to solve the most complex of problems. That they could comprehend the challenges in brexit and ask the right questions to break the through the lack of expert knowledge in that field.

Personally, I have far too much respect for experts, I believe we stand on the shoulder of giants, the growth of civilisation bask this up as our understanding and technological advances increased as we learned to read and write to share knowledge. That includes methods and approaches to problem solving.

I find it amazing that you have so little regard for formal education
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I don't hold formal education in low regard but I don't have a particularly high regard for much of formal education in the UK. Teachers may have little influence on national curricula but they do plan them elsewhere. The reformulation of Bloom's taxonomy is relevant as it places more emphasis on the importance of 'creating'. I broadly share these views 'What's wrong with Bloom's taxonomy' but I'll leave them in a link as it's of limited relevance to the rest of the thread.
 
The criticism seems to be a classic case of 'playing the man, rather than the ball'. By all means disagree with what they say, but who is saying it is irrelevant. Everyone has a right to express an opinion.
 
I don't mind footballers, ex-footballers/broadcasters etc using their platform to comment on politics, they live in society, they pay their taxes, as long as their employer is ok with it I don't have an issue.

But Jenas was on the radio being interviewed about racism in football. He spoke relatively eloquently on the subject matter without being controversial or identifying any solutions.
Interviewer then asked him about the Saudi takeover of newcastle and he spoke positively about the money, signings etc.
Interviewer then asked him about the regime, Khashoggi & sport washing and he said it was an unfair question and he shouldn't be asked about that.

To me, if you hold yourself up as a commentator on social and societal issues you shouldn't dodge questions just because you are worried about not being invited back to do the hospitality.
 
BoroMart said:
depends if they are doing it to treat other people as lessor than them, say by being racist as an example. Are you saying that people should be able to be racist without challenge as that is their personal view and they have freedom of speech?
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Lets just say 'right wing', not extreme or racist.
 
JackG said:
I don't hold formal education in low regard but I don't have a particularly high regard for much of formal education in the UK. Teachers may have little influence on national curricula but they do plan them elsewhere. The reformulation of Bloom's taxonomy is relevant as it places more emphasis on the importance of 'creating'. I broadly share these views 'What's wrong with Bloom's taxonomy' but I'll leave them in a link as it's of limited relevance to the rest of the thread.
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Well that's a nice way to side step the notion that education isn't important, without admitting that education actually is important.

teachers don't plan the national curriculum, and in other formal bodies it isn't the teachers that create the learning objectives either.

Creating is great, but it requires an understanding of foundational concepts. Your claiming anyone without a fundamental understanding of music, can just pick up a Gibson 335 and randomly pluck and create a jazz masterpiece....you've 'created' something, but it's crap because you have no formal understanding of musical structure. I think you have a fundamental misunderstanding of how blooms works, you don't go straight in at the top
 
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newusername said:
I don't mind footballers, ex-footballers/broadcasters etc using their platform to comment on politics, they live in society, they pay their taxes, as long as their employer is ok with it I don't have an issue.

But Jenas was on the radio being interviewed about racism in football. He spoke relatively eloquently on the subject matter without being controversial or identifying any solutions.
Interviewer then asked him about the Saudi takeover of newcastle and he spoke positively about the money, signings etc.
Interviewer then asked him about the regime, Khashoggi & sport washing and he said it was an unfair question and he shouldn't be asked about that.

To me, if you hold yourself up as a commentator on social and societal issues you shouldn't dodge questions just because you are worried about not being invited back to do the hospitality.
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I noticed Jamie Redknapp was at it at the weekend too trying to skirt around the Saudi/Newcastle issue, claiming fans don't really care who owns clubs and that somehow the PL wouldn't exist if we looked into the business dealings of owners. Only wanted to talk about all this supposed investment that's going to be pumped into Newcastle and this is all that should matter.
 
MFP said:
I noticed Jamie Redknapp was at it at the weekend too trying to skirt around the Saudi/Newcastle issue, claiming fans don't really care who owns clubs and that somehow the PL wouldn't exist if we looked into the business dealings of owners. Only wanted to talk about all this supposed investment that's going to be pumped into Newcastle and this is all that should matter.
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Yeah Mike Ashley can attest that they dont care about club ownership, they've been quiet as a mouse with regards to his tenure.
 
BoroMart said:
Well that's a nice way to side step the notion that education isn't important, without admitting that education actually is important.

teachers don't plan the national curriculum, and in other formal bodies it isn't the teachers that create the learning objectives either.

Creating is great, but it requires an understanding of foundational concepts. Your claiming anyone without a fundamental understanding of music, can just pick up a Gibson 335 and randomly pluck and create a jazz masterpiece....you've 'created' something, but it's crap because you have no formal understanding of musical structure. I think you have a fundamental misunderstanding of how blooms works, you don't go straight in at the top
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Education is extremely important but doesn't need to be formal. Your straw man guitar argument suggests you've either failed to read or failed to understand the linked article.
 
JackG said:
Education is extremely important but doesn't need to be formal. Your straw man guitar argument suggests you've either failed to read or failed to understand the linked article.
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I haven't read the article because I'm not claiming that Blooms is perfect. My jazz example is how you cannot get to the create stage without getting your foundation and the normal route to that is through formal education.

Yes some people informally educate themselves, but that isn't the norm.

So my strawman still stands, you can't reach the higher levels of Blooms without foundation level knowledge. You can't write a Jazz master piece without some education about musical theory (and that is normally through some formal qualification), you can't invent the computer without some formal education in the foundations of electronics, for example, and you can't truly analyse and understand the decision around brexit without at least some knowledge of economics, business, or trade.
 
Flood said:
As soon as they post anything criticizing the government they get the usual "stick to football" line from the offended right wingers. As if they have no right to an opinion on politics, but your average Sun/Daily Mail reader is entitled to knock educated sports personalities. I wonder why this is?, same with film/tv people, as soon as they voice a vaguely left wing opinion they're labled 'left wing luvies'. So media folk in prominent positions can't alert people to how badly the country is being run and call the Tories out on it?

And then there's the 'pièce de résistance'- the Champagne Socialist line. So, someone who's done well in life, made a few quid can't be concerened about social issues, helping others and is met with "why don't you give all your money away and house 10 Afghan refugees".

Funny what the right wing media has done to some people in this country. At least the right wingers still have Jim Davidson for a balanced opinion. Oh, and Laura Kuenssberg..
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I could never get my head 'round the "Champagne Socialist" thing, if anything, it shows those up who use the term more than the people it's aimed at.
It gives the impression they think that if you are ok in life, it's wrong to care about those who aren't.
It screams selfish.
 
BoroGold said:
I could never get my head 'round the "Champagne Socialist" thing, if anything, it shows those up who use the term more than the people it's aimed at.
It gives the impression they think that if you are ok in life, it's wrong to care about those who aren't.
It screams selfish.
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I think it's people who equate socialism with communism, and therefore if you've earned a bit of money you should immediately distribute it to those less well off, leaving yourself with only the bare minimum. Careful though, as if you do actually make any charitable donations you'll probably be accused of virtue signalling by the same people.
 
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I like Gary Neville and I think he needs to be commended for a lot of things he says using his profile as an opportunity to call out the bad things in society mostly done very well. However I cannot equate with his decision to go to Qatar and work for a Qatari TV station as a pundit for the World Cup and last night on HIGNFY Ian Hislop made him squirm.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1588646986819203072
 
Makes you wonder how genuine he was about all the super league, school dinners etc outrage when he is more than happy to go out to bat for any old regime with disgusting human rights if the money is right.

Hislop rightly called him out and he had no defence.
 
Yeah it was interesting to see that exchange and Neville knew he had no defence.

What he offered up was really weak. Basically saying you can stay and say nothing or go and raise the issues.

I can’t see him referencing the issues during commentary or in the pre/post game analysis. And that was when I thought he was working for a uk broadcaster.

He’s working for Qatari tv?! 😁 Good luck fighting the good fight Gary. You might be minus a head when you return.

I don’t think him going should degrade his previous good work on highlighting social issues but it will hang over him in future.

Just shows if the money is right……I had hoped for better from him. Not like money is an issue for him.
 
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