Gareth Southgate's strong message after some supporters booed when England players take the knee [Gazette]

uncle_rico said:
No of course not, but I am opposed to completely getting rid of it. It’s what western culture has been built upon for centuries.
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What does this even mean? How exactly would any political campaign "get rid" of families? What specifically are you worried about them doing?

I think you need to understand to anyone who's not already an anti-BLM Marx-fearing true believer it sounds like complete nonsense. You may as well be worried about political organisations getting rid of gravity or oxygen or something.
 
SuperStu said:
What does this even mean? How exactly would any political campaign "get rid" of families? What specifically are you worried about them doing?
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You've got to have some kind of mega brain rot to seriously believe the social media nonsense about wanting to destroy all nuclear families. What do they imagine is going to happen, 4 black people in berets turn up - a lawyer, a realtor, a coneyancing lawyer and a removal man? Then they make one of the parents take a lease on a flat, sign divorce papers and and then immediately escort them out the property? The complete lack of sense to it makes you realise how it is right wing media spin.

All you have to do is search for it, and the first page and a half is redditt nonsense, the breeding ground for conservative and conspiracy nonsense. Beyond that you find some more sensible stuff, which puts the correct context around this. a desire to have parities and support networks beyond the 'traditional' nuclear family. 50% of families break up, more so in black familes because of their prepensity for poverty and associated issues.

People need to learn to read a little instead of just repeating the memes.

www.politifact.com

PolitiFact - Ask PolitiFact: Does Black Lives Matter aim to destroy the nuclear family?

Black Lives Matter has been derided as a terrorist organization (a claim we rated False), a Marxist movement (we found l
www.politifact.com www.politifact.com
 
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Been watching the old Big Match Revisited and hearing clearly the monkey chants aimed at black players

I suspect some of those booing the taking of the knee would consider them the good old days


Let's face it those booing will get what they want - the taking of the knee will stop
Worked at Millwall, and now Southgate is saying it might happen at England games
 
Taking the knee is a way of showing you are supporting BLM.
Booing the sight of kneeling is a way of showing you don't agree with what is happening.
That you don't agree with taking the knee doesn't mean you don't agree with the sentiment , just the ridiculous sight of footballers following a fashion.
Do something about it rather than making a fashion statement.
 
BoroMart said:
and lets be honest mate, racism has become a political tool, hating on BLM has become a political tool. Those footballers were making a statement about equality, I'd bet some of those in the stands booing were making a statement about rejection of right wing politics because they perceive anti-racism to be a leftist policy. Maybe THEY should keep politics out of it? 🤷‍♂️
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The politicians are probably having a laugh-- having the general public fight against each other over matters that while affect us don't really cut into the other issues affecting us all [working class] on daily basis.
 
Paarmo said:
Taking the knee is a way of showing you are supporting BLM.
Booing the sight of kneeling is a way of showing you don't agree with what is happening.
That you don't agree with taking the knee doesn't mean you don't agree with the sentiment , just the ridiculous sight of footballers following a fashion.
Do something about it rather than making a fashion statement.
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Whopper alert
 
Expat Smoggie said:
The politicians are probably having a laugh-- having the general public fight against each other over matters that while affect us don't really cut into the other issues affecting us all [working class] on daily basis.
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True, we should be discussing things like a basic living wage, narrowing the gap of wealth which would have a positive effect on everyday issues such as crime, poverty, education and health
 
GazC_MFC said:
True, we should be discussing things like a basic living wage, narrowing the gap of wealth which would have a positive effect on everyday issues such as crime, poverty, education and health
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Racism thrives on inequality. Until we address underlying inequality in society then racism will carry on. It was rife within disenfranchised youths who felt they had no place in the 70s joining the NF
and there's swathes of people who feel forgotten and worthless today. Inequality and divisive government policy's cause surprisingly division. A fairer society where every member is valued would reduce hate. We need to tackle the bigger picture, anti racism campaign's whilst laudable don't to me get at the root causes of racism which is wealth inequality, and inequality of life opportunities.
 
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BoroMart said:
Of course racism is learned. But actually kids spend far more time in school, far more time with friends than with their parents. They are influenced by these, plus their sports coaches, and other family and anyone else they interact with.

They are also influenced by media, and now social media. Social media is the big digital disruptor in all our lives, and probably the biggest influence for many adults and kids sadly. It's been weaponised by right wing hate groups and has influenced many people, with a barrage of targetted misinformation, and hate. Things will only truly get better when appropriate digital laws exist to create good governance, we are sadly in the age of misinformation.

No one thinks that racism went away, only that it had reduced, but now it's increased again. Austerity has made people angry and resentful at what they don't have, social media led by Tory PR told them it was because of immigrants from europe as a diversion from the bankers who were sneaking out the back door with the family silver tucked in their jackets. People needed someone to blame and Polish, French and the good old Germans were the first target. We had a rise in islamaphobia after the manchester bombing and now hate towards Black people due to BML. Now it's anyone from teh far east that might look a bit 'wuhan-ese' that get it. Basically there have been targeted social media led hate campaigns against every key ethnic group except the south americans in the last 5 years. The peope were ready to blame, and the right wing PR stoked it.
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Bm, all God points. I am not sure I agree. I suspect, but don't know, that racism is fostered at an early age before social media takes hold. You would hope teachers and coaches, even if they are racist, keep their opinions to themselves.
I am not sure that a young, reasonable adult, can turn into a racist because social media tells them to.

I think it's almost certainly bad parenting. I know a fair few racists that keep their opinions to themselves and have, more recently become emboldened to voice their opinions. It starts with all lives matter, or my daughter can't get a council house and escalates because we have a racist pm and a government that bang on about illeagal immigrants.

I may be wrong but I strongly suspect we have the same number of racists they are just louder.
 
Glover_elbow said:
Racism thrives on inequality. Until we address underlying inequality in society then racism will carry on. It was rife within disenfranchised youths who felt they had no place in the 70s joining the NF
and there's swathes of people who feel forgotten and worthless today. Inequality and divisive government policy's cause surprisingly division. A fairer society were every member is valued would reduce hate. We need to tackle the bigger picture, anti racism campaign's whilst laudable don't to me get at the root causes of racism which is wealth inequality, and inequality of life opportunities.
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It's also heavily linked to poor education, which itself is of course tied inextricably to poverty and social deprivation.
 
Glover_elbow said:
Racism thrives on inequality. Until we address underlying inequality in society then racism will carry on. It was rife within disenfranchised youths who felt they had no place in the 70s joining the NF
and there's swathes of people who feel forgotten and worthless today. Inequality and divisive government policy's cause surprisingly division. A fairer society were every member is valued would reduce hate. We need to tackle the bigger picture, anti racism campaign's whilst laudable don't to me get at the root causes of racism which is wealth inequality, and inequality of life opportunities.
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Spot on (y)
 
A friend of mine just wrote this, about our current identity crisis, which I think ties in with this subject:

"Many English people specifically feel that they are being singled out to carry all the blame for racism, colonialism, Brexit, the lot and that the actions of the past had nothing to do with the other components of the UK.

They then dig their heels in and cling to tarnished heroes (she was talking about the wider characteristics of Churchill, rather than just the straight black & white of the war hero) because no other options seem to be being presented to them. It's insecurity in an uncertain and seemingly belligerent world, fuelled in part by a poor education system and lack of a defined, national folk culture that isn't interwoven with a militaristic past. It's sad really. Sunshine is the best disinfectant."
 
SuperStu said:
We know why people hold racist viewpoints. It's all because of Karl Marx. :mad: Or something... actually, could someone explain that bit again? :unsure:
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Nah you got it wrong mate, Marxism means that working class people will never become millionaires, because they will be taxed 90% and that money will be used to exterminate 100s millions of people due to atheist ideology....or something.
 
Expat Smoggie said:
The politicians are probably having a laugh-- having the general public fight against each other over matters that while affect us don't really cut into the other issues affecting us all [working class] on daily basis.
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It's absolutely divide and conquer, I've said this for a long time. Brexit was just this, the perpetuation of racism is just this, the demonisation of immigrants is this and the glorifcation of our war heroes without context is just this.
 
Laughing said:
I am not sure that a young, reasonable adult, can turn into a racist because social media tells them to.
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adults get brainwashed all the time mate, yes the most at influence are youner, but also those who are vulnerable, mental health problems, drug and alcohol issues, lower education, poor social networks around them, desperate lack of opportunities etc. We have to look at racism in the context of it being a form of extremist radicalisation which happens all the time.
 
BoroMart said:
adults get brainwashed all the time mate, yes the most at influence are youner, but also those who are vulnerable, mental health problems, drug and alcohol issues, lower education, poor social networks around them, desperate lack of opportunities etc. We have to look at racism in the context of it being a form of extremist radicalisation which happens all the time.
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Just look at what Fox News has done to millions of American OAPs.
 
Paarmo said:
Taking the knee is a way of showing you are supporting BLM.
Booing the sight of kneeling is a way of showing you don't agree with what is happening.
That you don't agree with taking the knee doesn't mean you don't agree with the sentiment , just the ridiculous sight of footballers following a fashion.
Do something about it rather than making a fashion statement.
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How the f@ck is it a fashion statement, what are they wearing?
 
HarryVegas said:
Many English people specifically feel that they are being singled out to carry all the blame for racism, colonialism, Brexit
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There is some truth in that. Nearly all of which (with the possible exception of Brexit) we share guilt with pretty much all European nations, to a greater or lesser extent. The Scots and Welsh seem to point over the border when such accusations are made yet they too share guilt for the colonial expansion and nefarious deeds of the British Empire.

Such sins are mostly those of our ruling class (who ironically we keep electing). For example, several generations of my family moved from Scotland to Liverpool where they worked as ships chandlers, sail makers and such. Now these forefathers were in all likelihood working on/for Slaver's ships. Does that make them culpable for the Slave Trade? Not really I'd say though they certainly benefitted from it. The big benefactors of that abhorrent trade are various families who built fortunes on the trade and through our failure to even try to redistribute wealth a lot of them retain their wealth and privilege to this day living in huge Ancestral homes built with profits from slaving. This is where history needs to be taught properly, teach this period rather than WW2 and address the relationship of ordinary people with the slave trade.
 
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