Black man killed by police in Minnesota - new revelation

[SuperStu]

He was polite and calm but he didn't do what the police were telling him to do.

Which made the police angry, and heightened the tension. Not saying the police were in the right, but that's what happened.

Dunno about you but if someone's pointing a gun at me, I do as I'm told.

I'm not sure if you're on about the man who was killed or the soldier who wasn't.

I've just seen the video of the soldier on the news and it's a bit of a catch 22. There's two officers pointing guns at him shouting for him to unbuckle his seatbelt and get out the car. He (very understandably) doesn't want to do anything that moves his hands out of their sight for even a moment. I don't really think you can say there's a definitive answer on what the right thing to do is. It's a very dangerous dilemma.

 

[Rauko]

Maybe it's linked to gun ownership, I don't know .. but, outside of it, there's just a general gung-ho attitude among Americans that you don't see elsewhere .. A shoot first, ask questions later attitude. Underneath the cop uniform and behind the badge there is a human being, yet the first thought when somebody makes off from you in a car is to whip out a gun and start shooting away like John Wayne? I don't understand that.

Nigh on everyone in the US seems to come across wanting to be a potential movie star or TV personality or over enthusiastically shouting "Woohoo!" and high fiving each other over the smallest things making out that they are some sort of big shot. Politicians or those in the media and news come on TV with their plastic skin, OTT fake tans, their perfectly styled wigs, the blindingly white teeth talking about their love of God in their voices straight from TV Adverts.

I have American cousins and when we've visited each other they quickly become tiresome .. there's one thing being energetic and enthusiastic but everything is just so over the top, 100mph and full of drama.

Generally, in the many times I've visited, I think America is great and, on some level, so are many of the people I've met (to a point, as I said above) ... but beyond gun ownership (as I say, it may be linked) - there's something seriously .. I don't know the right word .. Wrong? Messed up? Present? .. in the psyche of many Americans that maybe plays a small part in things like this or mass shootings or just general America being America things that we see on the news daily.

 

[Laughing]

I couldn't imagine being a parent of a black male in the U.S.A, I'd be petrified every time they left the house.

Lot's of black parents coach their kids at a very young age how to deal with traffic stops and other interactions with the police. These parents may well be doctors or lawyers as well as more socially immobile.

That right there is a damning indictment of the US police's engagement with black folks

 

[Laughing]

OK The APC's are a bit of overkill... but I don't begrudge them the best body armor and equivalent AR15's when they are faced with the same from the criminals.

If you are a black man in the USA you have almost a 1 in 1,000 chance of being killed by a police officer in your lifetime. The police are part of the problem, not part of the solution.

Consider that statistic for a minute.

 

[red_harrington]

I'm not sure if you're on about the man who was killed or the soldier who wasn't.

The soldier who wasn't.

From what I read, the guy who was killed got out of the car at the request of the police, but then got back in and drove off.

Which is a pretty daft thing to do, given what happened next

I'm not condoning the police actions in any way, I'm just saying that if there are trigger happy policemen about, and you're black, then unless you want grief and possible death, the best thing to do is just comply. That said, the problem with this approach, is it does give the police carte blanche to continue with their aggressive behaviour.

 

[Heam44]

A black man in the USA, being stopped by the police is, statistically, in the most dangerous situation they have ever been in. This is a fact and the events should be viewed through that prism

Surely not, how is that even possible? Can you explain?

 

[Laughing]

Surely not, how is that even possible? Can you explain?

See my follow up post on the chances of a black man dying at the hands of the police in his lifetime. Between the ages of 25 and 29 it goes up. That is more dangerous than driving a car, getting on a plane, dying of heat disease, at that age bracket, it really is true dependent on how you look at the statistic.

If your 50 or above you have more chance of dying of cancer or heart disease.,i would assume.

 

[Youngie]

If you are a black man in the USA you have almost a 1 in 1,000 chance of being killed by a police officer in your lifetime. The police are part of the problem, not part of the solution.

Consider that statistic for a minute.

Why are you aiming that at me? I haven’t suggested otherwise

 

[Heam44]

See my follow up post on the chances of a black man dying at the hands of the police in his lifetime. Between the ages of 25 and 29 it goes up. That is more dangerous than driving a car, getting on a plane, dying of heat disease, at that age bracket, it really is true dependent on how you look at the statistic.

If your 50 or above you have more chance of dying of cancer or heart disease.,i would assume.

So 1 in 1000 (or almost) black men die at the hands of the police? Is that right or am I misunderstanding it?

edit - in America.

 

[Osboro]

Why are you aiming that at me? I haven’t suggested otherwise

I don't think he was aiming it at any one, calm down mate, it's a discussion.

 

[brattleboro]

They are a stran ge breed are american people. Not a place ive ever fancied travelling to and i do like to travel

 

[Youngie]

I don't think he was aiming it at any one, calm down mate, it's a discussion.

He copied my reply to a totally different aspect of my discussion.... if he wasn't posting it at me, why bother replying to my post when another 5 posts had gone after mine.

 

[Laughing]

So 1 in 1000 (or almost) black men die at the hands of the police? Is that right or am I misunderstanding it?

edit - in America.

No that is correct. The stats were a bit confusing, because that is over your lifetime. The chances go up in the age bracket 25-29, though how they calculate that over a lifetime, I don't know. Unless of course, you die at 25 by a police shooting, that is your lifetime.

That is why I said the stat is open to interpretation.

 

[Laughing]

He copied my reply to a totally different aspect of my discussion.... if he wasn't posting it at me, why bother replying to my post when another 5 posts had gone after mine.

It wasn't aimed at anyone Youngie, I copied your post as it referred to how well armed the police have to be. Stats show that that isn't really the case, i.e. the level of arms that a militarised police force have access to.

 

[SuperStu]

I'm not condoning the police actions in any way, I'm just saying that if there are trigger happy policemen about, and you're black, then unless you want grief and possible death, the best thing to do is just comply.

That's my point though. The soldier didn't comply, but made sure to keep his hands visible, and stayed alive. If he'd followed their instructions and move his hands down to his side to undo the seatbelt it could well have gone differently.

 

[S7DiscoDown]

You would want an AR15 and body armour as standard equipment in the states.

This is a country where people have them for home defense and can carry a concealed weapon in a super market (if you have a licence). You can legally buy a Barrett 50 sniper rifle for 11k. Why would anyone need one for garden 'plinking'. It goes through an inch of steel

 

[FartingGnome]

"Among all groups, black men and boys face the highest lifetime risk of being killed by police. Our models predict that about 1 in 1,000 black men and boys will be killed by police over the life course"

Says here

Risk of being killed by police use of force in the United States by age, race–ethnicity, and sex

Police violence is a leading cause of death for young men in the United States. Over the life course, about 1 in every 1,000 black men can expect to be killed by police. Risk of being killed by police peaks between the ages of 20 y and 35 y for men and women and for all racial and ethnic groups...

www.pnas.org

Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences of the United States of America.

 

[ForssAwakens]

I've been stopped numerous times by police in the US and each time I have been fearful.

Each time I did exactly what I was told and there was no tension and therefore no problem.

Curious, Are you black?

 

[bear66]

"Among all groups, black men and boys face the highest lifetime risk of being killed by police. Our models predict that about 1 in 1,000 black men and boys will be killed by police over the life course"

Says here

Risk of being killed by police use of force in the United States by age, race–ethnicity, and sex

Police violence is a leading cause of death for young men in the United States. Over the life course, about 1 in every 1,000 black men can expect to be killed by police. Risk of being killed by police peaks between the ages of 20 y and 35 y for men and women and for all racial and ethnic groups...

www.pnas.org

Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences of the United States of America.

That is a frightening statistic.

250 women have been killed by the police since 2015. Although well below male deaths, that seems an extraordinary number as well.

 

[Laughing]

"Among all groups, black men and boys face the highest lifetime risk of being killed by police. Our models predict that about 1 in 1,000 black men and boys will be killed by police over the life course"

Says here

Risk of being killed by police use of force in the United States by age, race–ethnicity, and sex

Police violence is a leading cause of death for young men in the United States. Over the life course, about 1 in every 1,000 black men can expect to be killed by police. Risk of being killed by police peaks between the ages of 20 y and 35 y for men and women and for all racial and ethnic groups...

www.pnas.org

Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences of the United States of America.

That was the report I read a while back FG, thanks, couldn't be bothered finding it again. It is, as I recalled, open to interpretation, but however you interpret it, it is a damning stat.