Wilder sacked

Willow said:
Wonder if the club will still be forging ahead with the list of changes Wilder demanded because he 'knows what good looks like', never slated him while in post as am an eternal optimist when it comes to boro, but he really was an arrogant bloke. Glad he is gone in hindsight.
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Same, I will always support a manager in post, in the hope they turn things around, but he did come across a bit full of himself at times. Most of our failed managers have said "I have to take the blame for this" at some point, but I don't really recall Wilder doing it
 
BoroMart said:
Same, I will always support a manager in post, in the hope they turn things around, but he did come across a bit full of himself at times. Most of our failed managers have said "I have to take the blame for this" at some point, but I don't really recall Wilder doing it
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He said it in press conferences.
 
BoroMart said:
Same, I will always support a manager in post, in the hope they turn things around, but he did come across a bit full of himself at times. Most of our failed managers have said "I have to take the blame for this" at some point, but I don't really recall Wilder doing it
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Arrogant maybe but no more so than Warnock. And at least he didn't have a bum bag full of photos of himself to hand out to little kids hanging about (like Nobby).
 
BoroMart said:
I can't buy that, no one wants a sacking on their record. I suspect he was disillusioned and yeah this makes it easier for him to jump ship without seeming like he had an ugly ambition. But I still don't buy he lost on purpose to get the sack. I just think he ran out of ideas, far quicker than he did at Sheff Utd. He clearly also struggled to gain the respect of the players
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Spot on Mart.(y)
 
Not had chance to read the thread (will read through later), but this sacking is a bad idea.

I don't see what we have gained by sacking him, unless we already know we're going to get someone better. But who would come here when we've had 6 managers (Agnew, Monk, Pulis, Woody, Warnock, Wilder) since March 17 (effectively 5.5 seasons)? They would have to have a screw lose.

I think the problem is upstairs and recruitment, we have wrecked so many players (especially forwards) and managers it's beyond belief.

It's like we lie to these managers, promise them the funds, and their choice on players, to get them on board, selling them a fake dream. Then we don't get the players who the managers want, sell the ones who they want to keep, and then blame the manager when he can't get the results he was hoping to (based on the assumed better players/ recruitment).

We saw what Wilder could do, when he turned the team around last year, but we then got found out (only creativity was Jones), and then didn't strengthen the right areas so we had more options and become less predictable. Yes, we got Giles and Muniz (both great), but we were already weak in centre midfield, but then made it much, much, much weaker letting Tav go (the only prem class player we had last year, or this year), and not getting worthy players in.

Yes, a new manager might get some better results, but only if the individuals stop making errors, but then if they did that, Wilder would have had more points, he would have got more points too. We're extremely restricted by our centre midfield, that's the priority, not the manager.

The only sense in a change I can see, is maybe if the players lost confidence, or something happened behind the scenes, we might get a new manager bounce for a few games (albeit I doubt Leo would do better than Wilder before that happens). No matter what we are still going to be kneecapped by our poor permanent player recruitment, and the new manager will be pulling his hair out when we don't get some good centre mids in Jan (or next summer) and then we'll have to replace Giles and Muniz too, as we won't have or spend the cash to buy either of them.

Very much looking forward to what Wilder has to see when he gets interviewed in the future, but expect he'll keep quiet until we get the new guy in. We'll get his side, without having to tread lightly, in a few months I expect.

At least we have some money to pay his contract off, since we certainly didn't invest what we recouped last summer.
 
Glover_elbow said:
He did that's right Viv and then deferred it in the next sentence on his players
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He took responsibility. He said it was his fault, that him and his staff were all searching for answers and that obviously the players were as well. But he said it was on him numerous times.

If someone keeps making mistakes, they have to be called out. Some of players have been making the same mistakes for years on end. I would expect a manager to able to point that out without being accused of shirking responsibility himself.

He’s paid the ultimate price now by getting sacked anyway. It doesn’t really matter.
 
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viv_andersons_nana said:
He took responsibility. He said it was his fault, that and his staff were all searching for answers and that obviously the players were as well. But he said it was on him numerous times.

If someone keeps making mistakes, they have to be called out. Some of players have been making the same mistakes for years on end. I would expect a manager to able to point that out without being accused of shirking responsibility himself.

He’s paid the ultimate price now by getting sacked anyway. It doesn’t really matter.
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You don't call them out in public. Contrast the way Warnock used to talk glowingly about fry and paddy to the way wilder did. What do you think gets the best performance. Man-management wise Warnock was streets ahead
 
BoroMart said:
I can't buy that, no one wants a sacking on their record. I suspect he was disillusioned and yeah this makes it easier for him to jump ship without seeming like he had an ugly ambition. But I still don't buy he lost on purpose to get the sack. I just think he ran out of ideas, far quicker than he did at Sheff Utd. He clearly also struggled to gain the respect of the player
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You certainly wouldn’t expect it from the type of manager we expect him to be . The players we have and wilder himself are certainly much better than what’s been achieved so far but for some reason the manager doesn’t seem to want to pic his best side available and Saturday was the worst point dropping 2 creators . Jones hasn’t been at his best so he might of had a reason for that but we’ve just had a break . The opposite was there to come back refreshed .
Now we have start start all over again probably with rob Edward who works with Scot at wolves…….and he’s available.
 
Glover_elbow said:
You don't call them out in public. Contrast the way Warnock used to talk glowingly about fry and paddy to the way wilder did. What do you think gets the best performance
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Warnock got great performances out of Akpom TBF. Akpom loved him. And then when he said Uche was his third choice, that was another good one. Or chucking Payero and Sporar and Siliki and Wood under the bus.

The bottom line for me is that they’ll all say stuff in public, especially straight after a game, to try and illicit a positive response. Players like Howson and Jones and Crooks, Wilder was very positive about them in public. Warnock was positive about some, not so much others.

Wilder was positive about Fry at times, but maybe less so after he’s just been pushed around by some lump from Peterborough or we’ve just been pumped at Preston. TBH I think some of our lads need a rocket up them. He said some might be too comfortable with us and I tend to agree.

The next manager will be the same. They’ll be trying to see who responds to what sort of talk. Warnock was critical of Bola, for example, who then became a really important player. Players like Spence hated him. It’s just the way it goes.
 
My money was on UD Almería getting a new manager before the Boro. Given the way we have started this season.
 
Glover_elbow said:
You don't call them out in public. Contrast the way Warnock used to talk glowingly about fry and paddy to the way wilder did. What do you think gets the best performance. Man-management wise Warnock was streets ahead
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Yet Warnock couldn’t get a tune out of them either. Warnock absolutely also called players out post match frequently, so he’s a strange one to use to make that point.
 
Looks like Gibbo has finally “taken a wrecking ball” to Wilder’s tactics. Too many goals conceded and not enough goals scored. Goals from set pieces are vital in this league if you want to be in the top six. We don’t score any. (n)
 
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Quite disappointed at how it has ended. We have played some really decent stuff at times and I honestly thought we would have had a decentish season. Certainly better than we have had. Not sure we had the squad to be contenders, certainly our midfield is pretty abject but we should not be in the bottom 3. That is not good enough. Wilder has paid the price and rightly so. He was not on the same page with the club. His treatment of Hoppe and Forss, to me anyway emphasised that. I know it is said every time a manager is changed but the next incumbent is probably the biggest gamble we have had. We need a coach as opposed to a manager to compliment the club’s philosophy. But that will probably be someone who lacks a lot of experience. In the position we are in we then need to rely on the players who have got us in the position we are in. Dodgy times 😳
 
I wonder if it wasn't planned in advance it just came down to after Coventry match Gibson asking Wilder what his plan was to turn it around and not getting an acceptable answer so he made a snap decision to get rid. You'd like to think there had been some thought put into it though.
 
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Glover_elbow said:
You don't call them out in public. Contrast the way Warnock used to talk glowingly about fry and paddy to the way wilder did. What do you think gets the best performance. Man-management wise Warnock was streets ahead
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You sort of have to, if they're having a nightmare, or not doing as asked. You can't big up players when they're making massive mistakes and not carrying out the team orders/ philosophy, or it would make him look like he's lost the plot.

Warnock did better than Woody, which wasn't hard, but Wilder made us much better after Warnock went. Maybe some of the players preferred the no-nonsense style of lumping it up (or more mixed) under Warnock, and playing a more defensive side so we can have a better chance of winning the ball back.

It doesn't take much knowledge to realise what the players were being told to do under Wilder, which I expect is keep the ball and don't lump it. Give the ball to the wingers, Crooks, McGree and let them do something with it. Lumping up to Muniz is a waste of time against two centre backs, or with no-one near him. Wilder wasn't asking them to make mistakes either, as Warnock wasn't, nobody would.

Seems to me some of them gave up on Wilders ideas, took the tactics into their own hands and we had to sack the manager, as we couldn't sack the players.
 
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