Who are the best players in Europe now, under 30?

B_G said:
Well at one point Real Madrid had:

Xabi Alonso
Kaka
Guti
Raul
Higuin
Benzema
Van Nistelrooy
Ronaldo
Marcelo

Pretty much all of them are elite and only ever 4 or 5 of them played. Man City are in a similar position now where they can have world class players being rotated. Even KDB gets rotated.
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Hmm. At that time I don’t think Guti or Benzema were elite, Raul over the hill too. Most of the rest probably were but Kaka struggled with injuries and was past his best I’d say. So that only really leaves 5 who were “elite” at that particular time I’d say.

Benzema scored 8 goals the season you’re talking about and Guti was well past his best, hence why he ended up at Besiktas. Raul scored 5 and was definitely past his best too.
 
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atypical_boro said:
Ok, maybe comparing them with Mahrez is flawed, and maybe Pep rates them both well above him.

The fact is none of them are weekly starters like Haaland/KDB though.
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Jack Grealish 2022/23 season - PL 28 appearances, FA Cup 5 appearances, Champions League 13 appearances.

Phil Foden 20022/23 season - PL 32 appearances, FA Cup 5 appearances, Champions League 8 appearances.

Looks like they are both bit part players. :unsure:
 
Norman_Conquest said:
Jack Grealish 2022/23 season - PL 28 appearances, FA Cup 5 appearances, Champions League 13 appearances.

Phil Foden 20022/23 season - PL 32 appearances, FA Cup 5 appearances, Champions League 8 appearances.

Looks like they are both bit part players. :unsure:
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Well you’ve ignored starts v appearances.

For me the truly elite players, even in the modern game, are starting every week or almost every week. Not 57% of the league matches.
 
atypical_boro said:
I think you’re probably right. But there is something about good players staying good for longer I think. They used to hit roughly 32 and be seen as third choice etc, unless they were either amazing or at a club where they were probably too good.
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Not just footy of course. Look at Djokovic and Nadal. Or Tom Brady, LeBron James etc.....

Now whether that's due to superior fitness regimes and better sports science or is dependent on certain other scientific "enhancements" to supplement that depends on how cynical you are I suppose.
 
atypical_boro said:
Hmm. At that time I don’t think Guti or Benzema were elite, Raul over the hill too. Most of the rest probably were but Kaka struggled with injuries and was past his best I’d say. So that only really leaves 5 who were “elite” at that particular time I’d say.

Benzema scored 8 goals the season you’re talking about and Guti was well past his best, hence why he ended up at Besiktas. Raul scored 5 and was definitely past his best too.
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My point is they were in a similar position to City now where they could and would rotate elite players.
Your argument that Foden and Grealish aren't elite because they get rotated isn't valid in my opinion it's just a reflection of the the depth of world class players that City have.
 
atypical_boro said:
Well you’ve ignored starts v appearances.

For me the truly elite players, even in the modern game, are starting every week or almost every week. Not 57% of the league matches.
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The source I went through (Wiki) only gave appearances and not starts but even so, you can't argue with their stats in a team that just completed the treble.

Your rules and anyone elses opinions don't count. 🤣 🤣 🤣
 
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festa5 said:
Not just footy of course. Look at Djokovic and Nadal. Or Tom Brady, LeBron James etc.....

Now whether that's due to superior fitness regimes and better sports science or is dependent on certain other scientific "enhancements" to supplement that depends on how cynical you are I suppose.
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Good point.
 
Norman_Conquest said:
The source I went through (Wiki) only gave appearances and not starts but even so, you can't argue with their stats in a team that just completed the treble.

Your rules and anyone elses opinions don't count. 🤣 🤣 🤣
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You seem to think that if someone replies and I don’t instantly agree with it that’s me saying it’s outlawed or doesn’t count or something. I haven’t mentioned “rules”. I really don’t know why you respond to my threads though, other than to do this every time.
 
B_G said:
My point is they were in a similar position to City now where they could and would rotate elite players.
Your argument that Foden and Grealish aren't elite because they get rotated isn't valid in my opinion it's just a reflection of the the depth of world class players that City have.
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You very well may be right but I’m just saying I think it’s an indication of the way football has changed if so.

I think if we did a “best 10 players in the world” thread for players of any age both would struggle to get anywhere near in it, especially since Messi etc would still be in it.

And that, for me, is an indication that under 30s are rarely the elite in the present format of the game. Festa5 makes a good point about potentially why.
 
atypical_boro said:
You seem to think that if someone replies and I don’t agree with it that’s me saying it’s outlawed or something. I haven’t mentioned “rules”. I really don’t know why you respond to my threads though, other than to do this every time.ew
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I thought the reason we posted on a message board was to get replies. The trouble is, you've made your suggestions and when we offer ours they are deemed to be irrelevant. It seems you have a list of players in your mind and stick by them.

It is not only me on this thread that thinks Grealish and Foden are top European players, they are at least two others that I can see.
 
Norman_Conquest said:
I thought the reason we posted on a message board was to get replies. The trouble is, you've made your suggestions and when we offer ours they are deemed to be irrelevant. It seems you have a list of players in your mind and stick by them.

It is not only me on this thread that thinks Grealish and Foden are top European players, they are at least two others that I can see.
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Who has said anyone’s response is “irrelevant?”.

People suggest stuff in response to my question, some of it I’ve agreed with and some of it I haven’t, if you care to read through it all again. All responses are, of course, “acceptable”.

For clarity, I’m not *personally* convinced Grealish and Foden make the list. Other posters may be absolutely convinced, and they are free to be. I really hope this clears things up for you, and if so, please apply to any future threads I may start.
 
atypical_boro said:
You very well may be right but I’m just saying I think it’s an indication of the way football has changed if so.

I think if we did a “best 10 players in the world” thread for players of any age both would struggle to get anywhere near in it, especially since Messi etc would still be in it.

And that, for me, is an indication that under 30s are rarely the elite in the present format of the game. Festa5 makes a good point about potentially why.
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Would Messi still be in it?

Messi and Ronaldo were both spectacular players. Either of them would ordinarily have been once in a generation players, but we happened to get two at the same time. It's not really surprising that they were both still considered in the worlds best into their 30s.

There's always been players in their 30s who were in the Top 10. Most players don't hit their peak until late 20s. Zidane, Xavi, Iniesta and Lampard were no different.
 
B_G said:
Would Messi still be in it?

Messi and Ronaldo were both spectacular players. Either of them would ordinarily have been once in a generation players, but we happened to get two at the same time. It's not really surprising that they were both still considered in the worlds best into their 30s.

There's always been players in their 30s who were in the Top 10. Most players don't hit their peak until late 20s. Zidane, Xavi, Iniesta and Lampard were no different.
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Well it’s only 6 months since he was the best player at the World Cup, so I think there’d be a strong argument for it?

Yes late 20s was usually the traditional peak, and I think it may now be later than that. I certainly think in bygone eras there’d be more 20 somethings considered to be the best player(s) in the world than currently.

Kroos, Modric, Lewandowski would all still probably be in a top 10-20. Neymar, Courtois, KDB, Salah, Kane etc. There aren’t as many in their 20s who I think would be definitely considered, even if you do have Grealish and Foden.
 
Norman_Conquest said:
Your argument comparing Grealish and Foden with Mahrez is flawed.

I think Pep sees Mahrez as a squad player rather than a first name on the sheet player. He tends to play in the games when Pep is resting players or they expect to win. He certainly wouldn't have made the starting lineup in the CL and is well behind Grealish and Foden on that account.

The other part I think your argument is flawed is that Pep likes to rotate players and just when they think they are in and settled, out they go and are rested. This seems to be the case with Pep until the business end of the season and then the team becomes more settled. Grealish became an integral part of the first eleven and Foden will play more minutes as Silva's legs start to go

Mahrez never even got a look in during the FA Cup or Champions League finals.
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If Silva had been injured Mahrez would have been on. De Bruyne was injured so I'm came Foden.
 
atypical_boro said:
who are the major assets Europe has? Kane turns 30 this close season too, joining KDB/Neymar/Salah/Courtois etc.

Mbappe
Haaland
Sane
Gvardiol
Valverde
Vini
Bellingham
Pedri
Saka?
The Napoli fella, forget his name

Seem like the most obvious? But is it just me or are most of the world’s best players now well over 30?
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If Haaland stays fit he's going to be right up there, he reached 200 career goals 2 years younger than Messi, and 4 years younger than Ronaldo.

His numbers could be unprecedented, if he plays until his mid/late 30s and he stays fit which might be a problem with his body shape and size .
 
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