It's a weird situation with McGree. I think he has good qualities, but he is too lightweight defensively when played in midfield and is very wasteful as a ten. I'm also not convinced Wilder wants to play with a ten, otherwise why the push to get another striker. We don't need 5/6 strikers in the squad if we are going to persist with one up front. I just don't think he trusts the midfield at the moment so is trying to make us more solid but it must be frustrating for the forwards we've went out and bought this summer. Hoppe not even getting on bench, Forss getting splinters on his ass. Can't help but feel Wilder is getting himself in a bit of a muddle at the moment. Hopefully we get the signings right in next 48hrs or this situation could get a lot worse.
* The Unofficial "Official" Watford v Boro Match-Night Thread *
- Thread starter r00fie1
- Start date
dooderooni
Well-known member
If we were 7 games from the end of the season with those stats then I'd worry.
As I said earlier, we need legs in midfield to replace Tav. With his energy last year we were good defensively so that shows the value of having a bit of pace and energy. He might not have been making last ditch tackles etc, but he was up and down and that limits space for the opposition to play in. Currently we can get bypassed in midfield too easily.
We've addressed the lack of creativity on the left already so if we replace Tav then we know we can defend and we'll also have more threat.
Far too early to write us off, even for the top 2 nevermind the playoffs.
CarrickBall
Well-known member
I think we can forget going up this season.
Look at the top of that table. We’re nowhere near them. 3 spots for the top league.
No clean sheets, 2nd worst defence in the league, 1 win in 7, 6 points from 21.
And that’s our record ‘when we’re playing well’. I dread to think what it’ll be like when we aren’t..
thewanderer
Well-known member
For the record I think Wilder will get it right, but he needs to sort it out and fast as the frequency of games in this league will mean that this will turn into another season that is a write off before it's really got going.
Laughing
Well-known member
Wilder has said on multiple occasions we don't sneak out the backdoor and will always go for the win. Muniz was playing as instructed
Andy_W
Well-known member
You're not doing your username any justice
We don't have the worst defence in the league, far from it, we've just conceded a lot of goals, largely against good sides, and a lot of them through misfortune and bad decisions.
So, rather than focusing on the result (the table), let's focus on what makes up that summary, which is still subject to wild variance.
Played West Brom at home, many peoples picks for top 6, deserved to win, despite not having brought in any of our main strikers
We've played QPR away (6th) and didn't deserve to lose that, even after the bad first 20 minutes - still didn't have any of our main strikers
We've already played Sheff Utd (Top) at home, and we deserved to beat them - still didn't have any of our main strikers
Drew away at Stoke, where we were effectively robbed - still didn't have any of our main strikers
We've played Reading away (5th), deserved to win that - still didn't have any of our main strikers
We beat Swansea, which was possibly the least deserved result we've had - one of our main strikers had been here about a day
We've just played probably the best team in the league away (for now anyway, with that front two), lost Howson and Lenihan during it, and still didn't deserve to lose - one of our main strikers scored
In any of those games have we been played off the park?
How many bad decisions have gone against us, leading to goals and a big change in the result? At least 4?
How many bad decisions have gone for us, leading to goals or saving goals, which have actually mattered? I can't think of any.
In any of those games have the opposition had better chances (even after the mistakes, and terrible decisions)?
For those games we've played we're probably around 4 points below par, for anyone with the highest expectations pre-season, 6 points from what we should have expected with xG etc, it's not the end of the world.
Have a look at the next 16 games, how many of those games will be as hard as most of the games we've played? Two, Burnley and Norwich away, but then we've played all three relegated prem teams away, and have them all to come at home second half of the season.
Have a look at who Burnley have played, 6/7 of them are absolute muck.
Norwich, 6/7 games against absolute muck sides, and they've look far from convincing in any of those, from what I've seen.
The only good result Sheff Utd had against a good side was us, and they didn't deserve it (on chances created/ given away), the rest have been against poor/average teams, largely at home.
In the next 13 games, there is zero fear against any of them, we could easily average 2 points a game, possibly even more if we continue to play the way we do, now with a decent striker, chuba coming back and possibly a second big addition. Even if we just win the home games and draw half of the away games, it's still 24 points.
We could easily be sat on around 30-32 points then, after 19 games, which even after the bad results at the start would head us toward 73-77 points, more than last year, and playing better football. I'd expect the second half of the season to bring more points than the first too.
We've had some exceptionally tough games, when our squad is still depleted and largely new to each other (pretty big overhaul), and still created more than the opposition (who are better than average). It's not Wilders fault that we can't score as many as we deserve, or that silly defensive mistakes are being ruthlessly punished in a way they would not normally do. Mistakes happen in any team, we made just as many mistakes under other managers, but I feel we've been a lot less fortunate this season (up to now).
We're playing well, and creating a lot of chances, I'm not sure what more you can ask for on that side, especially still missing the big ~£10m signing we've clearly been after, and some centre mid-backup. Although, we should still have had 10-12 points without him, whoever he is.
r00fie1
Well-known member
Chappy112
Well-known member
Performance is a better predictor of future results than results are. I’d be worried if the performances weren’t there but they clearly are.
Andy_W
Well-known member
How many teams have felt they should have beat us, or drew with us, on balance? How many would have complained if they had lost or drew with us?
You don't win games or get results by playing *****, and not creating more chances than the opposition unless you have a few ludicrous players who can perform well above the norm (we don't really have or want to buy any of these players, they're normally relegated from or going to the premiership). I can't think of a team who has ever been top 6 in the championship and been battered every week, and still got results.
Results are an effect, a sum of many outcomes and 90 minutes of football. There are many causes which create the end result and often the end result does not tell the full story. You can't create a result and work backward from there (other than a draw, which is where you start), you need to put some pieces together, and then hopefully the sum of that will ensure results take care of themselves. Sometimes the sums don't add up for one reason or another.
We've got the pieces together, I don't see any major problems with any of it, other than maybe another proven striker and some centre mid cover.
The football has largely been very good to watch (chances created v chances conceded, and how we've done it), way above previous years, but we're not getting results as we're not putting the ball in the net enough, from the vast number of chances we have created against good sides. There's been an imbalance of key decisions going against us leading to goals conceded and other opportunities not realised, and there's also been a few complete flukes or pot shots which normally we should not expect to go in.
In any of the years since we came down from the prem, by the end of the season I would not have fancied us in the playoffs, had we made it, or expected a good performance/ result against the good sides. If we put this side in that position I would actually expect that now, with how we're playing.
We just need some results to go our way ( and get some wins on the board, and the next 13 games is a great opportunity to do it. I don't even want decisions to go our way, I just want fouls to be fouls, wherever they are on the pitch, over time we would be better off with that, as we will have more of the ball in dangerous areas.
BoroGold
Well-known member
It's about time we changed the defence after over 60 yrs of it then.
Laughing
Well-known member
I am no coach but it seems to me that letting the defence get to know each other and they may work better as a unit. Same for the midfield the left wing back and the strikers. Who knows, a little patience may go a long way to stopping people getting their knickers in a twist.
Still going no where but down
r00fie1
Well-known member
And your point is?as we are so much better
Just backing up my post
r00fie1
Well-known member
More conjecture than certainty, but we will have to wait and see.Just backing up my post
Could say the same for the previous Manager, and Woodgate.......
Pulis left in December 2019 - 4 Managers in three years.
This Manager has the balls to admit we need a "major rebuild" - and take all the crap people throw at him.
We could carry on with dinosaurs "fire-fighting" relegation ad infinitum - but going nowhere.
Worrying, but not too much just yet.
