The final nail in the coffin for the high street?

jeff_potato said:
I would like to see the impact of returns from online sales. I've never bought clothes online until this pandemic and it's a real pain because everything seems to be different sizes from different manufacturers, so instead of a ten minute drive to the Metro and finding something quickly, it takes a couple of weeks around deliveries and arranging pickups.

It surprises me how many returns are free, though; there must be load of young people buying clothes, doing their 'outfit of the day' for Instagram and sending them back: that must surely be a massive overhead. (Although obviously not as massive as rent for a shop)

Fenwick in Newcastle is a mind boggling example of how not to run a store in the 2020s. When my tumble dryer broke, the replacement I wanted was only about £10 dearer in there than online, so I tried to buy it... one person speaks to me, gets a colleague. They fill in a chitty (Is it 1968?!?) and hand it to the supervisor. They ring it through and then tell me that actually, they only deliver to my postcode on a Tuesday morning at a specific time. So I'll have to be in. No can do: I must be at work at that time. Oh well, no sale. And that was that!

We walked outside, got out my phone and it was delivered within 48 hours... crazy.
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I'm the oppsotite really. It's not that convenient to go anywhere that there's a good range of shops so tend to get most stuff delivered now. I don't have the same feelings over convenience. I tend to buy a few options or sizes, use places that have free returns and put what I don't want in at the local post office/newsagents collect plus etc. I'm not sure how it's taking a couple of weeks to sort out?

I have no idea on the economic impact for places offering free returns. But they probably benefit from lots of people buying various options with the intent of sending some back, and then never doing it.
 
Yeah returns for me are usually instant almost. Amazon refund once you send it as their tracking updates

A percent will do returns after wearing but that happens at shops as well.
 
I remember when I used to buy games in the 80’s out of Amiga Format. Chips and Games World in boro had some games but not a huge range and magazines offered then cheaper, but had to lay by cheque and wait up to 28 days for delivery and you had better believe it took that 28 days

Similarly a game corrupted once and I had to send the floppies off to bullfrog, took absolute weeks.

Now games are delivered instantly via Steam, epic, Xbox live, psn etc, or you can buy physical copies, but a much better system for the end user. I can’t even imagine something taking 28 days to come now unless it’s off AliExpress! And then you had to be in all day waiting for the delivery.

Compare this to amazon and DPD where you get a 1 hour delivery time a lot and can track where the courier is on the map.

In certain regions you can even use PrimeNow and get same day delivery off amazon, or (for a fee) within an hour.
 
For those posters that hate going to physical stores and are over 45.

Did you use catalogues before the internet?

The principle was the same - see something in a printed catalogue and order by phone/mail, then its delivered to your house. No need to go near a shop.

Ref online returns - I was astounded when I saw the figures for returns for clothes - for some businesses its 70% - businesses must be resealing these clothes and sending them again, possibly a couple of times.

I get bombarded with messages about offers on clothes online which I think contributes to online sales.
 
Redwurzel said:
For those posters that hate going to physical stores and are over 45.

Did you use catalogues before the internet?

The principle was the same - see something in a printed catalogue and order by phone/mail, then its delivered to your house. No need to go near a shop.

Ref online returns - I was astounded when I saw the figures for returns for clothes - for some businesses its 70% - businesses must be resealing these clothes and sending them again, possibly a couple of times.

I get bombarded with messages about offers on clothes online which I think contributes to online sales.
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I agree completely.

For me it isn't consumer interacting with a website that has revolutionised shopping & sounded the death knell of the High Street but the improved logistics industry.
 
newusername said:
I agree completely.

For me it isn't consumer interacting with a website that has revolutionised shopping & sounded the death knell of the High Street but the improved logistics industry.
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Yep, if I had to wait 28 days or even a week for something to come I wouldn’t bother

I nearly ordered something from Debenhams a few months back but it was 10 days delivery.

Reruns rate for amazon I believe if you are consistently above 10-15% they’ll look at your account, but I love their returns process. I’ve had them replace things after owning it for a year and it’s better than any companies warranty in terms of speed and service.
 
TheFair86 said:
I remember when I used to buy games in the 80’s out of Amiga Format. Chips and Games World in boro had some games but not a huge range and magazines offered then cheaper, but had to lay by cheque and wait up to 28 days for delivery and you had better believe it took that 28 days

Similarly a game corrupted once and I had to send the floppies off to bullfrog, took absolute weeks.

Now games are delivered instantly via Steam, epic, Xbox live, psn etc, or you can buy physical copies, but a much better system for the end user. I can’t even imagine something taking 28 days to come now unless it’s off AliExpress! And then you had to be in all day waiting for the delivery.

Compare this to amazon and DPD where you get a 1 hour delivery time a lot and can track where the courier is on the map.

In certain regions you can even use PrimeNow and get same day delivery off amazon, or (for a fee) within an hour.
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Maybe it was a few years later when the process had got a bit slicker but I don't remember it being that bad ordering games from the magazines. I remember pursuading my dad to call up and pay by card a couple of times so maybe that made it quicker (can that be right, could you pay by card over the phone back then in the early 90s?). I reckon I must've been one of the few to actually purchase sensible soccer as everyone else just copied it
 
I think one of the things that lead to the demise of the High Street is lack of public transport (or at least the expense of it). I live in Eaglescliffe. The last time i used a bus to get to Stockton was years ago. The fare was £2.50 single. So when I went with my wife it was £2.50 each to get there and the same to get back. That makes it £10 just to go shopping.
As regards parking. I never used to mind paying to park the car. As has already been pointed out, parking is never free anyway. What boils my pss now is the Castlegate car park is now privately owned ( it used to be owned by the council who collected the fees for parking on their property, that us tax payers paid for) and is now operated by a private company who have removed the barriers (which ensured that you could not leave without paying) and hope that people forget to pay so that they can persue them.
 
I tend to believe with internet shopping there is a bit of an element of trendiness far as buying clothes/footwear online is concerned. And is very trendy to do at present. Like Facebook and Google & Co many are also selling your behavioral online data for significant sums which boosts their profits.

Ref costs to shop - Its free to park in the Boro on the streets away from the centre on Saturdays. Its free on the bus for 65 year olds and people with a disability every day. Teesside Park is free to park.

Ref returns at Amazon - they will increase if they get heavily into clothes and will have problems if they ban customers with 15% returns.

Ref next day delivery etc - I can't remember once ever needing a shirt or pair of shoes the next day. Possibly its different for a fashion conscious 18 year old.

Shopping channels on Sat TV have been going since around 1995 offering quick deliveries to your house and never made a big impact on retailing. They generally have good logistical operations and use very good selling skills and offer keen prices. Although you can only buy what they offer which can be a limited range. Shopping channels are now untrendy.

Mike Ashley is not stupid he is bottom fishing now picking up prime high street shops for zero rent in return for paying just the rates.
 
Ref costs to shop - Its free to park in the Boro on the streets away from the centre on Saturdays. Its free on the bus for 65 year olds and people with a disability every day. Teesside Park is free to park.

Ref returns at Amazon - they will increase if they get heavily into clothes and will have problems if they ban customers with 15% returns.
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Time however is not free, and the time spent driving and parking into town, and even more so getting the bus into town and back, is significant compared to just clicking and getting on with your day, and usually saving money, having better product range to choose from ana benefitting from cash back by shopping online through Quidco or topcashback, or applying voucher codes.

When I moved to Ingleby I took the bus to boro game, absolutely never again it took over an hour and return was a nightmare as the service room a break for a few hours on an evening so had to wait an hour in the bus stop. That and not everyone is over 65 or disabled and those that aren’t pay a lot for bus travel to the point it’s attractive to just get a taxi.

Amazon been doing free returns for clothes for years same with ASOS and others, it’s part of their business model. The 15% returns thing is more regular spend and you do get a warning.
 
jeff_potato said:
I would like to see the impact of returns from online sales. I've never bought clothes online until this pandemic and it's a real pain because everything seems to be different sizes from different manufacturers, so instead of a ten minute drive to the Metro and finding something quickly, it takes a couple of weeks around deliveries and arranging pickups.

It surprises me how many returns are free, though; there must be load of young people buying clothes, doing their 'outfit of the day' for Instagram and sending them back: that must surely be a massive overhead. (Although obviously not as massive as rent for a shop)

Fenwick in Newcastle is a mind boggling example of how not to run a store in the 2020s. When my tumble dryer broke, the replacement I wanted was only about £10 dearer in there than online, so I tried to buy it... one person speaks to me, gets a colleague. They fill in a chitty (Is it 1968?!?) and hand it to the supervisor. They ring it through and then tell me that actually, they only deliver to my postcode on a Tuesday morning at a specific time. So I'll have to be in. No can do: I must be at work at that time. Oh well, no sale. And that was that!

We walked outside, got out my phone and it was delivered within 48 hours... crazy.
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I had exactly the same with buying a fridge freezer from John Lewis. Could (would) only deliver on a certain day.
Went and sat in the coffee shop and ordered it from ao.com, delivered two days later sorted
 
TheFair86 said:
Time however is not free, and the time spent driving and parking into town, and even more so getting the bus into town and back, is significant compared to just clicking and getting on with your day, and usually saving money, having better product range to choose from ana benefitting from cash back by shopping online through Quidco or topcashback, or applying voucher codes.

When I moved to Ingleby I took the bus to boro game, absolutely never again it took over an hour and return was a nightmare as the service room a break for a few hours on an evening so had to wait an hour in the bus stop. That and not everyone is over 65 or disabled and those that aren’t pay a lot for bus travel to the point it’s attractive to just get a taxi.

Amazon been doing free returns for clothes for years same with ASOS and others, it’s part of their business model. The 15% returns thing is more regular spend and you do get a warning.
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Yes time is the major factor, well for me anyway. There's so many more attractive things to do on a weekend than heading around shops, I'd rather just do it online when I have a spare 30 mins. It's a different matter in a nicer environment that would have more attractive things for the kids, like say a trip to York - nip to the shops then head around museums, walls etc. Unfortunately most local high streets can't offer that
 
Anton_Berg said:
It's great if you want to buy clothes that someone else has worn for a day.
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Well the tags will still be on and used items go on warehouse

How is it any softener from buying something that 40 people tried on before you in the shop?

If it’s in new condition being worn for a day doesn’t phase me at all, far worse things in life that people don’t worry about like hotel beds or takeaway hygiene.
 
The thread was about the end of physical shopping.

Some people will appreciate a lot the convenience of ordering something from their sofa at midnight and it been brought to their door a few days later. To other people this is not an advantage. They prefer to view what they are buying and try it on etc before they purchase and combine shopping with something else like going to acafe/pub and meeting up with others. I honestly don't think everyone wants to shop for clothes online.

Ref pricing : the warehouse to home model should not be cheaper in the long run, it is only cheaper at present because warehouses are being subsidised (example grants for Amazon @ Billingham and Amazon not paying UK tax on its profits) and older retail locations are paying historical very high rent/rates. Warehouse rents are rising and high street rents are falling, eventually there will be a truer balance.
 
I'm really surprised that the small independents aren't doing what they do here. Those in the NE of the US are all part of the same buying conglomerate and have basically the same website. I have bought all my replacement appliances from the local dealer, where I can go in and talk to them. They undercut the big box stores and are far more helpful. When I replaced my kitchen, I bought the appliances when they were on special offer and they held them in the warehouse until I wanted them delivering.
 
For electricals there is Euronics network in the UK, retailers with local stores and online. I used a local one to me called the Wash house for Oven and Washing Machine. I ordered in a showroom and stuff is delivered to home. Customer Service was very good and they were cheaper than say AO who are purely online.

Something like a washing machine is different to clothes - online is better for items that have to delivered anyway and don't need to tried on or touched etc and have a low return rate.

The internet is good for intangables i.e. goods and services that are not physical, like financial services, gambling, music, possibly films(movies)
 
Redwurzel said:
The thread was about the end of physical shopping.

Some people will appreciate a lot the convenience of ordering something from their sofa at midnight and it been brought to their door a few days later. To other people this is not an advantage. They prefer to view what they are buying and try it on etc before they purchase and combine shopping with something else like going to acafe/pub and meeting up with others. I honestly don't think everyone wants to shop for clothes online.

Ref pricing : the warehouse to home model should not be cheaper in the long run, it is only cheaper at present because warehouses are being subsidised (example grants for Amazon @ Billingham and Amazon not paying UK tax on its profits) and older retail locations are paying historical very high rent/rates. Warehouse rents are rising and high street rents are falling, eventually there will be a truer balance.
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Some people do like to go manually shopping but there aren't very many of them, otherwise Amazon wouldn't be prospering and places like Burtons dying on their backsides. Obviously not everyone wants to shop online but that number gets smaller every year just like the number of people who love cash gets smaller every year and those that cling on to cheques gets smaller every year. It's one of those things that people love to say, but when it comes down to it they don't want to pay an extra £30 for that pair of Levi's after all.

The internet is good for intangables i.e. goods and services that are not physical, like financial services, gambling, music, possibly films(movies)
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Apart from the small blips that are Amazon and Ebay I suppose, but they are minnows in the market.
 
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