Tav - so I'll ask it again...

[Jonny_Rondos_Disco_pants]

He works hard and is full of energy.

if payero gets a run and plays nice football but doesn’t work hard, who do you pick?

 

[Andy_W]

I thought he largely had a good game today, against a very good side. He won a lot of the ball, and played some good sharp passes that needed good technique. His energy in the middle is worth a lot to us.

He's really not getting the run of the ball mind, but I think a few on here expect him to be Lampard, when that's largely not even his style never mind his position/ ability.

He looks quite mentally weak, and like things get to him easily, when he loses the ball or misplaces a pass, and people getting on the backs and booing that kind of player really do no good whatsoever.

 

[Subbuteo_171]

Mate i could go out there and "work incredibly hard" and "not hide".

Doesn't mean i'm good enough.

You are right with that post, and totally wrong with your first.

 

[StBill]

He was very poor today and that miss . He looks better wide in front 3 to me, but that position doesn’t exit in this team. Payero was offering much more before he got injured, I expect he’ll come back in as the fixtures start to pile up.

 

[Randy]

He is just struggling for form atm.

He works incredibly hard and gets into goor positions, needs a goal just to get him going.

I echo those thoughts. That miss at the end though was shocking. Literally put on a plate for him. Half volley, let the ball do the work.

 

[Cardiffdaffs]

He was very poor today and that miss . He looks better wide in front 3 to me, but that position doesn’t exit in this team. Payero was offering much more before he got injured, I expect he’ll come back in as the fixtures start to pile up.

I disagree. I don't think he was that poor. Plenty comments above have already said it. He works hard in a clear system and is not afraid to get hold of the ball. Not everything works but he is a big talent. I think there are posters on here who are being uber-critical. The OP for instance didn't take more than half hour into the game to have a go.

 

[ChrisTheRed]

If working hard is what it takes to be a top level footballer then I think we'd all be top level footballers.

However, it isn't and we aren't. I was told he is an attacking midfielder - a number 8 if you like - but can someone please tell me how many goals and assists he has in the last season and a half?

I'd go out there and run around all day but that wouldn't be enough. He is not even close to Premier league class... Unless you're referring to the Indian premier league that is.

 

[BoroPhil]

he played well today, was all over the place, made some really important defensive contributions and nearly capped it off with a goal. I imagine he's one of the first names on Wilder's teamsheets as with every other manager recently.

 

[norfolkngood]

People cannot keep defending a player that offers no goals or assists....

Maybe you will have to tell Wilder that, as he has just been singing his praises after the game. And rightly so.

 

[Subbuteo_171]

Irrational from the OP imo.

 

[ChrisTheRed]

Maybe you will have to tell Wilder that, as he has just been singing his praises after the game. And rightly so.

Well if he wants to try and boost him he isn't going to slag him. He's a man manager but that doesn't mean he's good enough.

 

[Cardiffdaffs]

Well if he wants to try and boost him he isn't going to slag him. He's a man manager but that doesn't mean he's good enough.

Good job you're not the manager then.

 

[parmoboy]

I've defended Tav in the past, saying that he needs a run of consecutive games in midfield.

Well he's now had a run of 6 games in midfield and has no goals or assists to show from it.

We can talk about the work he does off the ball but on it he offers very little. Summed him up 1st half when he won the ball, lost it, and instead of trying to win it back again he waved his arms in the air appealing for the foul. Not long after that he bottled a 50/50.

 

[Cardiffdaffs]

I've defended Tav in the past, saying that he needs a run of consecutive games in midfield.

Well he's now had a run of 6 games in midfield and has no goals or assists to show from it.

We can talk about the work he does off the ball but on it he offers very little. Summed him up 1st half when he won the ball, lost it, and instead of trying to win it back again he waved his arms in the air appealing for the foul. Not long after that he bottled a 50/50.

Ah another one watching for errors. I saw at least 4 bottle jobs on 50-50s from 4 separate players, I saw the ball lost inexplicably by numerous players this afternoon. Im not going to criticise any of them because we won through a collective team effort of which Tav was a visible part.

 

[Lottowyn]

There's the "King's new clothes" element with Tav.
But he is consistent. When that sitter near the end came to him you knew it was going over the crossbar.

 

[ChrisTheRed]

I've defended Tav in the past, saying that he needs a run of consecutive games in midfield.

Well he's now had a run of 6 games in midfield and has no goals or assists to show from it.

We can talk about the work he does off the ball but on it he offers very little. Summed him up 1st half when he won the ball, lost it, and instead of trying to win it back again he waved his arms in the air appealing for the foul. Not long after that he bottled a 50/50.

100% on the money.

Bottled another one in the second half as well.

 

[parmoboy]

Ah another one watching for errors. I saw at least 4 bottle jobs on 50-50s from 4 separate players, I saw the ball lost inexplicably by numerous players this afternoon. Im not going to criticise any of them because we won through a collective team effort of which Tav was a visible part.

I saw plenty of good things from most of our players but very little from Tav.

Trust me, I wish I could say something different. I was one of those who stuck my neck on the line and defended Tav when others were saying he needs dropping.

Maybe I'm missing something which others are seeing, but he's just not doing it for me. I appreciate he works hard off the ball with regards to closing down, but the lack of goals and assists is not good. Payero already has more than him despite playing less games.

 

[Cardiffdaffs]

I saw plenty of good things from most of our players but very little from Tav.

Trust me, I wish I could say something different. I was one of those who stuck my neck on the line and defended Tav when others were saying he needs dropping.

Maybe I'm missing something which others are seeing, but he's just not doing it for me. I appreciate he works hard off the ball with regards to closing down, but the lack of goals and assists is not good. Payero already has more than him despite playing less games.

I don't distrust you I simply don't agree with you.

 

[Andy_W]

It's mad how many mention Tav's miss today, but were not as critical for Watmore's the other week. It's also mad how some expect every chance to be taken, it doesn't happen in the Prem, and certainly doesn't in the Champo.

Plenty today missed chances or didn't score, on both sides, which most would expect should have been taken, but it happens every week. Solanke's got 16 goals already and he missed a sitter too, even Mitrovic still misses plenty and he's streets ahead of the league.

I'm not Tav's biggest fan, but it's clear to see he's got some good assets and energy, and for his role he's better than anything else we have, that's why he plays every week. So we should all support his when he plays, it will do the team more good.

Wilder, Warnock and Pulis all picked him more often than they didn't, and contrary to what many on here think, those four have all forgot more than most on here ever knew.

From the footy stats sites, he's got the 4th highest av rating of all of our players, the second best pass completion (and the best for a midfielder), the most average key passes per game etc.

Also, he's 22, and plenty of time to improve, certainly as a centre mid who are often later developers.

 

[BoroPhil]

I mean if you are measuring his performance on goals and assists, then yeah you are going to be disappointed.
If he did start delivering on that front and added to his already excellent all-round game, he'd be the best player in the team by some distance