Acklam_Lad
Well-known member
Well done for winning the idiot post of the year
Shamima Begum
- Thread starter Priv
- Start date
Well done for winning the idiot post of the year
newyddion
Well-known member
it’s idiotic to suggest it.. so surely it is idiotic to carry it out.
Acklam_Lad
Well-known member
This subject runs very high emotions but this is my take on it
1. What evidence has been given for grooming except her lawyer saying so? I can’t recall any being released
2. She travelled to Turkey of her own free will with two others… no one forced her and she had ample opportunity to ask for help.
3. We can’t ignore the crimes she committed… most would carry the death penalty in other countries
4. I am yet to see her so any remorse
5. Her tv interviews clearly show she is a danger and still believes in the ISIS Cause
That being said she is our problem and should be serving life without parole in a British jail.
1. What evidence has been given for grooming except her lawyer saying so? I can’t recall any being released
2. She travelled to Turkey of her own free will with two others… no one forced her and she had ample opportunity to ask for help.
3. We can’t ignore the crimes she committed… most would carry the death penalty in other countries
4. I am yet to see her so any remorse
5. Her tv interviews clearly show she is a danger and still believes in the ISIS Cause
That being said she is our problem and should be serving life without parole in a British jail.
atypical_boro
Well-known member
Worth bearing in mind that adults can be groomed too. She may still be extremely vulnerable and whilst that isn’t a reason to strip her of her citizenship, I don’t think anyone can say with any conviction that she poses zero threat, we don’t know who she may still be in contact with and/or how likely it is she could be manipulated again.
The stakes are high, I don’t want any more children murdered in my or any other city, but I do appreciate that there is no simple solution and this precedent is dangerous too.
The stakes are high, I don’t want any more children murdered in my or any other city, but I do appreciate that there is no simple solution and this precedent is dangerous too.
Chris_Boro
Well-known member
It doesn't matter what she's done, we are a country of due process and this sets a dangerous precedent.
Simply removing citizenship is absolving ourselves of any responsibility.
Simply removing citizenship is absolving ourselves of any responsibility.
Muttley
Well-known member
1. She went to a war zone and was instructed on how to do so to avoid being stopped
2. Grooming convinces people to do things that they would not otherwise do
3. I am not aware of her "committing" crimes, being witness to, yes, committing, no. Perhaps you could list the "punishable by death in other countries" crimes.
4. Have you looked?
5. Her TV interviews were conducted in a place where is is likely still aware of the reality of her situation should she disavow "the cause".
The fact remains she is British and should be brought back to face justice for what she has DONE AS A MINOR.
h_m_boro
Well-known member
Missing my point entirely.
parmoboy
Well-known member
She could come back and radacalise others in a UK prison, which could then result in a terrorist attack being carried out on UK soil.
I accept absolving ourselves of responsibility isn't a good look but the British government and security forces have to prioritise our security and keeping us safe.
I accept absolving ourselves of responsibility isn't a good look but the British government and security forces have to prioritise our security and keeping us safe.
"They also argued there was overwhelming evidence that Begum was “recruited, transported, transferred, harboured and received in Syria for the purposes of sexual exploitation”"
Shamima Begum may have been a victim of child trafficking, court told
Lawyers for 23-year-old who left UK to join Islamic State in 2015 challenge ‘hasty’ decision to revoke citizenship
www.theguardian.com
You clearly have no idea what grooming means
What crimes? You made the statement..... provide FACTS. What crimes?
Shamima Begum: Runaway IS bride from London sorry 'from the bottom of my heart' - as she says her only crime was being 'dumb'
As a teenager, Shamima Begum ran away to join Islamic State in its former stronghold in Syria and has been accused of playing an active role in the group - something she denies; the stateless 22-year-old says she would welcome a fair trial back in the UK.
news.sky.com
Where? Which one 'clearly' shows she is a danger. Prove it.
Just lots of typical Tory Press bland statements.
Jonny Ingbar
Well-known member
I'm not sure the label 'scum' and the acceptance she was groomed accord in the same sentence.
The whole basis of children being groomed is that they are persuaded to act in a manner that they wouldn't of otherwise.
Because you didn't have a valid one. I repeat she didn't stab anyone.Missing my point entirely.
Redka
Well-known member
There must be some fairly strong mitigating evidence in this hush hush affair.
I like most thought she would win her appeal today.
The danger of her coming back is she wouldn’t be safe on the streets. The press would be all over her and she would attain some kind of celeb status in this messed up country which would anger people further. Truth be told for her own benefit it’s probably best she stays where she is - it may not be right but it’s probably for the best.
I like most thought she would win her appeal today.
The danger of her coming back is she wouldn’t be safe on the streets. The press would be all over her and she would attain some kind of celeb status in this messed up country which would anger people further. Truth be told for her own benefit it’s probably best she stays where she is - it may not be right but it’s probably for the best.
She'd be better off in a refugee camp in Northern Syria?
Jesus wept.
newyddion
Well-known member
She was married to a 21 year old fighter 10 days after arriving
With Amira Abase and Kadiza Sultana. Their disappearance has been attributed to Aqsa Mahmood, a woman from Glasgow who joined ISIL in 2013. Samra Kesinovic, was beaten to death for trying to escape.
I am unsure of the crimes..
Difficult to know who the bad guy is when you’ve been left in refugee camp for eight years and watched your three kids die.
Why would she want to return to the UK and dress in a western style if this was the case?
Yeah.. sad
Centralscrutinizer
Well-known member
It'd be easier for everyone to just read through the last lengthy thread wouldn't it 
wilkos_perm
Well-known member
I'd suggest the security risk is not greater having someone locked up in the UK vs unmonitored overseas in a region where terrorism is rife.
Acklam_Lad
Well-known member
"They also argued there was overwhelming evidence that Begum was “recruited, transported, transferred, harboured and received in Syria for the purposes of sexual exploitation”"
Shamima Begum may have been a victim of child trafficking, court told
Lawyers for 23-year-old who left UK to join Islamic State in 2015 challenge ‘hasty’ decision to revoke citizenship
You clearly have no idea what grooming means
What crimes? You made the statement..... provide FACTS. What crimes?
Shamima Begum: Runaway IS bride from London sorry 'from the bottom of my heart' - as she says her only crime was being 'dumb'
As a teenager, Shamima Begum ran away to join Islamic State in its former stronghold in Syria and has been accused of playing an active role in the group - something she denies; the stateless 22-year-old says she would welcome a fair trial back in the UK.
Where? Which one 'clearly' shows she is a danger. Prove it.
Just lots of typical Tory Press bland statements.
Not sure what I have said would put me as a Tory… besides if you look at my other posts on this side you can clearly see I’m not
atypical_boro
Well-known member
Whilst that’s probably true, if she decides to blow herself up (it’s not as if no one does this) she isn’t going to kill as many Brits over there.
Wiseman_Vaughn
Well-known member
It's a tough one.
• Is it proven that she commited crimes while being a part of ISIS or was her crime that she joined ISIS? If she did commit crimes, can they be proven? If so she should be tried here and serve time here.
• Is she a risk to the public knowing her ideology? Lot's of people have radical ideology but would never act on it - how can you make people believe something??
• If she is a victim of grooming - who were the groomers - have they been prosecuted?
I used to think that she should be denied the right to return but I changed my mind - why should she be somebody elses problem - We should take responsibility and deal with her here via a trial
• Is it proven that she commited crimes while being a part of ISIS or was her crime that she joined ISIS? If she did commit crimes, can they be proven? If so she should be tried here and serve time here.
• Is she a risk to the public knowing her ideology? Lot's of people have radical ideology but would never act on it - how can you make people believe something??
• If she is a victim of grooming - who were the groomers - have they been prosecuted?
I used to think that she should be denied the right to return but I changed my mind - why should she be somebody elses problem - We should take responsibility and deal with her here via a trial
wilkos_perm
Well-known member
True, but i don't believe that's a likely scenario