Rehabilitation for everyone?

Randy said:
I am annoyed at the government.
Is prison a deterrent in this country compared to say a South American country's prison system?

I suggesting that the most disgusting crimes be met with the appropriate measures. Killing three children, raping one of them and an adult and then still been able to live a comfortable life, granted behind four walls, isn't an appropriate punishment.
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The punishment is imprisonment, the loss of freedom.. if law abiding folks are not being treated well then that is a separate issue. I'm sure there are folks out there that would be willing to take a life of a murderer. Would they be willing to put a cross next to a box that would ensure a higher quality of life for our most vulnerable?
 
JM14 said:
That’s not the prisoners fault, be annoyed at the government that allow veterans to live on the street and not the prisoners who have zero control over the situation. We are one of the richest countries on the planet, we can afford to house prisoners in safe conditions whilst also ensuring no one needs to live on the street.

If you’re suggesting the death penalty as a way to reduce crime, look at the countries where it’s used, they have far higher levels of crime than countries which don’t
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That's not strictly true e.g. some Middle Eastern countries have brutal punishment regimes and low crime rates
 
Randy said:
I am annoyed at the government.
Is prison a deterrent in this country compared to say a South American country's prison system?

I suggesting that the most disgusting crimes be met with the appropriate measures. Killing three children, raping one of them and an adult and then still been able to live a comfortable life, granted behind four walls, isn't an appropriate punishment.
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Yes, prison is a deterrent.

I wouldn't call his future a 'comfortable life' otherwise more would be taking it up.
 
Honey_Glazed_Sausages said:
Have the people insisting that the individual mentioned earlier should be killed not given thought to the strong possibility that that's exactly what he wants? Why would you give him exactly what he wants? Surely the last thing he wants is to slowly rot in a cell for the next half a century until he dies??
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What he "wants" or what you want?
 
newyddion said:
as a decent society we cannot condone murder be it state sponsored or otherwise. the cost of living crisis does bring up questions and hopefully the right ones.. as a decent society not only should this man be fed and watered and provided with shelter.. those very basic of human needs. then so too should every law abiding man woman and child in this country.. this shouldnt be a question it should be a simple fact.

then we should be moving on to why food, water and shelter are not readily available to those that need it, the same with education and healthcare. nevermind where are we going as a society.. where are we right now.. what is going on and why are we allowing it to happen?

I'm pretty sure those in power right now would love to have the death penalty, they would love the contracts for the murders, the contracts for a privatised prison service and a monetised health service cash cow.

It feels like were on the verge of either a civil war.. or a twisted lurch into a fascist dystopian nightmare. a few strikes apart it seems very much like the later is the most likely outcome.
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Well said
 
He should be locked up forever. I see gary glitter is about to be released after 8 years only, how can that be right. Heavier sentences for all sex offenders needs to be the case.
 
Saudi Arabia chop off hands for stealing and adultery.
They also stone gay people to death or chop their heads off.
State murder works well there too.
Mind you - the British Government dont make too much fuss, because we are a major Arms supplier to the tyrants.
What with the British Military Mission and the strategic geo-political influence of the kingdom - its important to be hypocritical and defend "British interests" (?!)
 
Glover_elbow said:
He should be locked up forever. I see gary glitter is about to be released after 8 years only, how can that be right. Heavier sentences for all sex offenders needs to be the case.
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Saw the record of one gadge who was a minor (pardon the pun) sex offender. Went round grabbing little girls bums. He was convicted for exactly the same crime in the US and the UK. in the US he got a sentence of something like 14 years. UK he got a 2 year suspended sentence!

This guy had a screw lose. He was just a lifelong sex offender that would never change. I was shocked at the US sentence. Thing is though that would just keep him off the streets cos as soon as he was out he would be reoffending again.

I'm positive that for some of the lower level crimes they just keep them out of jail because it's good for business.
 
Randy said:
I am annoyed at the government.
Is prison a deterrent in this country compared to say a South American country's prison system?

I suggesting that the most disgusting crimes be met with the appropriate measures. Killing three children, raping one of them and an adult and then still been able to live a comfortable life, granted behind four walls, isn't an appropriate punishment.
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Look at the crime rates in South America compared to Europe, the tough prison system is clearly no deterrent. Countries that focus on rehabilitation rather than punishment almost always seem to have significantly better crime statistics

Loosing freedom for the rest of your life isn’t a comfortable life though, im sure most would choose death over a life in prison

Bringing back a death penalty is moving backwards and will do absolutely nothing to stop these type of crimes happening. The victims might get some feeling of justice but the reality is it won’t change anything, and you always have the risk of innocent people being wrongly killed
 
JM14 said:
Look at the crime rates in South America compared to Europe, the tough prison system is clearly no deterrent. Countries that focus on rehabilitation rather than punishment almost always seem to have significantly better crime statistics

Loosing freedom for the rest of your life isn’t a comfortable life though, im sure most would choose death over a life in prison

Bringing back a death penalty is moving backwards and will do absolutely nothing to stop these type of crimes happening. The victims might get some feeling of justice but the reality is it won’t change anything, and you always have the risk of innocent people being wrongly killed
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Unfortunately, the lynch mob mentallity doesnt listen to reason.
 
It's my personal opinion that you can't "deter" crimes such as this. It falls so far outside social norms that any deterrent is unlikely to even be a consideration (although I might be wrong).

The sentence then becomes either retaliation or rehabilitation, retaliation is a slippery slope (for every case as supposedly "cut and dried", there are 100s that aren't).
 
changingman said:
It's my personal opinion that you can't "deter" crimes such as this. It falls so far outside social norms that any deterrent is unlikely to even be a consideration (although I might be wrong).

The sentence then becomes either retaliation or rehabilitation, retaliation is a slippery slope (for every case as supposedly "cut and dried", there are 100s that aren't).
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Agree with your statement. I don't think the sort of person who murders kids is the sort of person who's logically considering the long term implications
 
JM14 said:
Look at the crime rates in South America compared to Europe, the tough prison system is clearly no deterrent. Countries that focus on rehabilitation rather than punishment almost always seem to have significantly better crime statistics

Loosing freedom for the rest of your life isn’t a comfortable life though, im sure most would choose death over a life in prison

Bringing back a death penalty is moving backwards and will do absolutely nothing to stop these type of crimes happening. The victims might get some feeling of justice but the reality is it won’t change anything, and you always have the risk of innocent people being wrongly killed
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You can't just compare different countries like that. There are far too many variables at play to isolate one and say that's the difference. I mean there's a huge militarised drug trade for one. Countries in Europe tend to be far richer.

And I certainly wouldn't choose death over life in prison. I'd just use the time to catch up on my gaming.
 
Sheriff_John_Bunnell_ret said:
You can't just compare different countries like that. There are far too many variables at play to isolate one and say that's the difference. I mean there's a huge militarised drug trade for one. Countries in Europe tend to be far richer.

And I certainly wouldn't choose death over life in prison. I'd just use the time to catch up on my gaming.
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The majority of crime isn’t due to a lack of deterrent, all kinds of social and economic reasons are the main causes of crime. Do you really think someone with the mindset to carry out a serious crime will be bothered what their punishment will be?

Realistically what do people who are calling for prisons to be tougher actually want? Prisoners to be locked in a tiny cell with no access to anything remotely enjoyable? That would just make prisoners impossible to manage for the staff, create hardened criminals and mean those leaving prison have no skills to ever improve so just return to a life of crime

I’m not comparing South America to Europe, just pointing out they have one of the biggest deterrents imaginable with their prison systems and it clearly doesn’t reduce crime
 
MolteniArcore said:
Not sure the guy will have a 'comfortable life' Randy. He'll prob be either in segregation or constantly looking over his shoulder. They like to make examples of such types in prison. Just look at the lives similar inmates have inside - they get attacked and even killed.
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Hopefully.
Maybes comfortable was the wrong word. No stresses of keeping a roof over the head or food on the table.
 
JM14 said:
The majority of crime isn’t due to a lack of deterrent, all kinds of social and economic reasons are the main causes of crime. Do you really think someone with the mindset to carry out a serious crime will be bothered what their punishment will be?

Realistically what do people who are calling for prisons to be tougher actually want? Prisoners to be locked in a tiny cell with no access to anything remotely enjoyable? That would just make prisoners impossible to manage for the staff, create hardened criminals and mean those leaving prison have no skills to ever improve so just return to a life of crime
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Well yes... But I'm taking issue with you using the high crime rate of South American countries as an example that harsh punishment does not work.
 
JM14 said:
If you’re suggesting the death penalty as a way to reduce crime, look at the countries where it’s used, they have far higher levels of crime than countries which don’t
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This seems like a generalisation to me - I would be interested if there were statistics to back that up.
 
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