Omicron

[SmallTown]

It’s incredible. I find it hard to see how Whitty, Vallance, Van Tam and co can continue after this, but I’m pretty sure it will be conveniently swept under the massive carpet and the government will press ahead with the next lockdown, or circuit breaker, or whatever büllshït name they give it.

There is an article 7 posts up that states the Netherlands are going into lockdown.
And yet you seem to be of the belief that if this country goes into a lockdown it’s a conspiracy.
In the developed world we have probably enforced the most relaxed and least stringent Covid policies of all. Yet people still think they are too much?

 

[FabioPorkpie]

Anybody else extremely tired of the completely ignorant Whitty bashing?

 

[FabioPorkpie]

Did you see the Robert Kennedy Jnr house party? I hope it’s true

Throwing a Christmas party is a good way for Robert Kennedy Jr to relieve the stress that comes from leading the anti-vaccine disinformation campaign. And please be a good little anti-vaxxer and get your COVID shot when you RSVP yes

Throwing a Christmas party is a good way for Robert Kennedy Jr to relieve the stress that comes from leading the anti-vaccine disinformation campaign. And please be a good little anti-vaxxer and get your COVID shot when you RSVP yes

fark.com

‘Kennedy’s anti-vaccine group, the Children’s Health Defense, more than doubled its revenue in 2020 to $6.8 million’

And people wonder why the likes of HART, PANDA, Yeadon, JHB, Emma Kenny, UsForThem etc ’would lie‘?

 

[SmallTown]

Anybody else extremely tired of the completely ignorant Whitty bashing?

Stupidity has been legitimised in this country is the problem. Brexit has shown us we don’t need to make decisions based on common sense and economic reality. Now Covid has shown us that people want to ignore men of science because they are telling them not to spread a dangerous disease

 

[uncle_rico]

Stupidity has been legitimised in this country is the problem. Brexit has shown us we don’t need to make decisions based on common sense and economic reality. Now Covid has shown us that people want to ignore men of science because they are telling them not to spread a dangerous disease

Even when the men of science are being exposed for not “following the science”?

 

[FabioPorkpie]

Is this the one where the modeller basically admits that the Government decide on a policy then instruct them to come up with a model that fits it??

Nailed it. Read the twitter exchange. It's outrageous.

Unsurprising that people are making something out of nothing here, and completely misunderstanding the point Medley is making.
Even less surprising that Fraser is trying to paint a narrative out of it that doesn’t exist.

 

[Randy]

Unsurprising that people are making something out of nothing here, and completely misunderstanding the point Medley is making.
Even less surprising that Fraser is trying to paint a narrative out of it that doesn’t exist.

Did you read it? It basically says the government give us the thing to work the modelling round.

 

[Randy]

Stupidity has been legitimised in this country is the problem. Brexit has shown us we don’t need to make decisions based on common sense and economic reality. Now Covid has shown us that people want to ignore men of science because they are telling them not to spread a dangerous disease

Much like most people, more then likely yourself included, ignoring South African scientists because "hmmphh hmmphh Britain knows best hmmmpphhh"

 

[chickenrunner]

Anybody else extremely tired of the completely ignorant Whitty bashing?

Yep. Plan for the worst, hope for the best.
I'd love to see some risk assessments from people commenting on here. ....... Working at height? Scaffolding? Fall restraint? Fall arrest? Nah, sod it it'll probably be OK.
Spoiler alert, when I risk assess a task I don't really think there will be multiple casualties with life changing injuries and possibly deaths but as a responsible person I have to consider those outcomes and mitigate against them.
Whitty, SAGE et al are simply risk assessing the situation which inevitably involves 'worst case scenarios', get it out of your heads that they are predicting things.
The Spectator article basically suggests our risk assessments should be based on the 'best case scenarios' using evidence provided by people with no responsibility whatsoever for health outcomes in this country. I'd suggest that if the journalist, Fraser Nelson, had a job with any responsibility he'd fill his pants 'cos he hasn't got a clue.

 

[FabioPorkpie]

Did you read it? It basically says the government give us the thing to work the modelling round.

I read it, three times, to try and understand what people were getting excited about but I think it comes down to interpretation.

My interpretation is different to yours though, so I’ll try and say it how I read it -

I see a man who is involved in modelling for emergency response (that point is very important) simply saying ‘we model for worst case scenarios because they are the ones that will require action, and drive policy. We are asked ‘what will happen in a worst case scenario? Tell us so we can be prepared to create policy around mitigating IF we look like we are heading down a path towards worst case scenario.’

and

‘ we don’t need to waste time focussing on best case scenario outcomes and the government don’t want us to, because in those scenarios we do nothing. No action is required. Nothing is learned from looking at the path where no action is required. No policy discussions are needed if there is no action required’.

I hope that makes sense?

I think Fraser understands that and he knows exactly what he is doing. I mean he’s got lots of publicity for his paper and lots of people sharing the (non) story on Twitter and social media such as here. So he’s done his job.
But I fail to see how there is anything sensational or newsworthy in what Medley says, unless it’s misinterpreted.

I hope that makes sense?

Anyway, fingers crossed for good news from SA in the coming days. I’ve had a quick look and data from some of the other provinces looks like it *may be hinting at following Guatengn and peaking. Still early days but keeping everything crossed Weekend reporting means probably 4 or 5 days before worth properly looking at it.

As Andy says, I don’t think we are far away from knowing one way or the other regarding severity, hospitalisations etc, maybe just a matter of a couple of weeks more data should provide enough to be able to paint a slightly clearer picture

 

[FabioPorkpie]

Let’s get something straight
@magic.

Nobody, nobody at all is a lockdown lover. Some of the clowns in independent sage demand them at the drop of a hat but they are just the opposite end of the sensationalist spectrum to Fraser and HART and Baker etc.

But nobody is really a lockdown lover.
We ALL hate them.

Whether they may be necessary as a last resort in some scenarios is a different matter.

 

[chickenrunner]

Let’s get something straight
@magic.

Nobody, nobody at all is a lockdown lover. Some of the clowns in independent sage demand them at the drop of the hat but they are just the opposite end of the sensationalist spectrum to Fraser and HART and Baker etc.

But nobody is really a lockdown lover.
We ALL hate them.

Whether they may be necessary as a last resort in some scenarios is a different matter.

Double like and spot on. Like using Hitler in an argument the phrase 'lockdown lovers' means you've LOST.

 

[magic]

Let’s get something straight
@magic.

Nobody, nobody at all is a lockdown lover. Some of the clowns in independent sage demand them at the drop of the hat but they are just the opposite end of the sensationalist spectrum to Fraser and HART and Baker etc.

But nobody is really a lockdown lover.
We ALL hate them.

Whether they may be necessary as a last resort in some scenarios is a different matter.

Deleted

 

[Osboro]

Well that’s my Christmas f****d. Tuesday flight to Germany train and hotel for a week all cancelled .
looking a bit bleak for me and the mrs , no family no meal ( yet) ah well me dad did 5 years away in the war so it’s not too bad.

 

[Cambsred]

Ignore the fact its in the spectator. This exchange happened on Twitter and has quite frankly left me staggered.

My Twitter conversation with the chairman of the Sage Covid modelling committee

The latest Sage papers have been published, envisaging anything from 200 to 6,000 deaths a day from Omicron depending on how many more restrictions we’ll get — up to and very much including another lockdown. Earlier today I had an unexpected chance to ask questions of Graham Medley, the chair of...

www.spectator.co.uk

Don't stop posting stuff like this @Randy because I miss a lot of stuff online which I find really interesting. Thank you.

And thanks @FabioPorkpie .

Really good to see balanced reposnses. You can see the reason for the modelling and extremes of it.

One big thing that I've noticed in the covid dialogue now is that people seem to forget Delta exists and thst cases are still very high outside of Omicron. In the short term we need to be mindful of that still spreading outside of main cities.

 

[mymatelookslikephilstamp]

Thanks for replying
Blunt yes, angry no.
Although I could understand you thinking that, trying to defend the indefensible.

Clearly not trying to defend the indefensible. I think my comments are all pretty well reasoned. It clearly isn't as black and white as right or wrong, no matter your own personal opinion.

Like I said if everyone adopted your attitude millions would be dead and society would have collapsed by now. Have you seen the dead bodies in the streets pre-vaccination in Italy and the Army collecting them like dead meat?

Except this didn't happen, the same way the videos doing the rounds when Covid first came around in China of people walking down the street and collapsing didn't happen either. Link here and here

Astonishing that you think all would be OK without the jab.

I never said that, I said it is a personal choice based on risk. As I said, my current situation (young, fit and healthy) means I don't feel any need to take it. If I was older and my situation was different, perhaps I would take a different approach. You seem to ignore that I said this above.

You thinking that the only motivation for getting the jab is to stop it spreading explains how your ignorance has fed your selfishness.
Thankfully the vast majority of the rest of us understand and accept our socail responsibility.

If it doesn't stop spreading and doesn't stop infection, why does it bother you if I personally do or don't take it? I haven't impacted anyone (i.e hospitals, medics etc) by not taking it. I've had a (very) mild cold for a couple of days and have isolated since I had symptoms.

I will say though at least you have the bollox to stand up and be counted and despite the above I respect you for that at least.
I also don't advocate forced vacination and also respect your right to choose. I just think your freedom should be restricted and fully support the Covid Passport to that end.

I think there are many, many more people on here who think very similar to me (that the ongoing restrictions and reaction to Omicron is unjustified) but think twice about posting because someone will jump on them on here for having a different opinion to the mainstream narrative and be seen as a social leper.

Out of interest, if you're in agreement that a vaccine doesn't stop you catching or spreading the most recent variant, what is your reason for supporting vaccine passports? Wouldn't testing alone seem a much more rational approach?

 

[Randy]

Out of interest, if you're in agreement that a vaccine doesn't stop you catching or spreading the most recent variant, what is your reason for supporting vaccine passports? Wouldn't testing alone seem a much more rational approach?

This is the question nobody can seem to answer.
Welsh have had vaccine passports for weeks and weeks to get into places. Now some of these places are been forced to shut. The same in France, Netherlands.

 

[GazBoro]

It’s incredible. I find it hard to see how Whitty, Vallance, Van Tam and co can continue after this, but I’m pretty sure it will be conveniently swept under the massive carpet and the government will press ahead with the next lockdown, or circuit breaker, or whatever büllshït name they give it.

They'll continue because people will dismiss it as more 'conspiracy' tripe, or will just remain apathetic and do as they're told. It'll be business as usual come Monday morning.

 

[SmallTown]

Much like most people, more then likely yourself included, ignoring South African scientists because "hmmphh hmmphh Britain knows best hmmmpphhh"

Wrong again

 

[SmallTown]

This is the question nobody can seem to answer.
Welsh have had vaccine passports for weeks and weeks to get into places. Now some of these places are been forced to shut. The same in France, Netherlands.

You and @mymatelookslikephilstamp since can't be that stupid surely? I don't know how many times it has been explained to you now