Lammy epitomises why Labour will struggle to get in.

TheFair86 said:
I mean that is literally the job of the opposition party to hold the ruling party to account for their actions
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But isn’t part of their job even a little tincy bit for them to lay out who they are what they are about and explain their policies. Not just go that’s **** we would have done better - on every subject in the news?
 
bear66 said:
She's allowed him to be British . . . but not English. :(
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The baffling thing is that I've seen other black people telling him that he can't be English too, and it's sadly seems to be fairly common for BAME to not identify as English.

It's an uncomfortable sentiment that I'm really surprised non-bigoted people would give the time of day.

Obviously a big part of it will be the sad association with far right nationalists, but I can't think of many other reputable countries where such an idea would exist. England is a nation, not just an ethnic group, if you're born and/or raised here then you're English.
 
FatCat said:
But isn’t part of their job even a little tincy bit for them to lay out who they are what they are about and explain their policies. Not just go that’s **** we would have done better - on every subject in the news?
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They have done to an extent but they’re not making the headlines and therein we revert to the crux of the issue, if you control the press you control the narrative issued to the public.

A policy outline, at least, the reasoning behind it and the aims it hopes to achieve will exist but because it’s not reported in the media, either due to a perceived lack of newsworthyness or to give a perception of inactivity, then many believe it doesn’t exist.
 
Corcaigh_the_Cat said:
It could be argued that their stance supporting the status quo, maintaining division within society, of which race is one, makes Tory voters racist.
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I think CtC there is a difference between a tory and someone who voted tory. I would certainly question the moral fibre of someone who identified as a tory. I would also think that most people who voted tory wouldn't identify as such.

There are also, of course, plenty of Labour racists who probably don't even understand what socialism is.

We are going through a fairly shameful time at the moment, as a nation and how we deal with someone who looks or talks differently to "us"
 
TeaCider said:
The baffling thing is that I've seen other black people telling him that he can't be English too, and it's sadly seems to be fairly common for BAME to not identify as English.

It's an uncomfortable sentiment that I'm really surprised non-bigoted people would give the time of day.

Obviously a big part of it will be the sad association with far right nationalists, but I can't think of many other reputable countries where such an idea would exist. England is a nation, not just an ethnic group, if you're born and/or raised here then you're English.
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Any links to that? I've done a bit of googling but can't find anything. I found a link suggesting 90% of people don't believe ethnicity is a factor in being English, with the older age group being prevalent to the opposite view, but even that group has reducing numbers. I was surprised anyone thought genetics was a factor. I can understand differences in opinions to flags and culture issues but not to question nationality.
 
Corcaigh_the_Cat said:
It could be argued that their stance supporting the status quo, maintaining division within society, of which race is one, makes Tory voters racist.
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I think it would be an incorrect argument to make - it would also kinda suggest that you don’t have racist Labour supporters. Truth of the matter is being racist in life is probably borne way before people become interested in politics.
 
American_Mary said:
They have done to an extent but they’re not making the headlines and therein we revert to the crux of the issue, if you control the press you control the narrative issued to the public.

A policy outline, at least, the reasoning behind it and the aims it hopes to achieve will exist but because it’s not reported in the media, either due to a perceived lack of newsworthyness or to give a perception of inactivity, then many believe it doesn’t exist.
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But you say that as if Labour don’t have a platform- I see Keri Starmer being interviewed as much as Boris but Kier chooses to use that platform to bash the opposition rather than explain his own approach.
 
FatCat said:
I think it would be an incorrect argument to make - it would also kinda suggest that you don’t have racist Labour supporters. Truth of the matter is being racist in life is probably borne way before people become interested in politics.
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I'm not suggesting that there aren't racist Labour supporters, I'm suggesting that by accepting that division should be maintained (which Tories do and their voters therefore support) they can be classed as racist.

Also, despite the press creating the idea that we're a two party state, we aren't, we have other parties in which racism will exist but not by definition. You can't argue that case for the Conservative Party.
 
FatCat said:
But you say that as if Labour don’t have a platform- I see Keri Starmer being interviewed as much as Boris but Kier chooses to use that platform to bash the opposition rather than explain his own approach.
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He's only interviewed on controversial matters where the government has miserably failed the British people. In that respect, he has done nothing that could be described as 'bashing' anyone.

His style is not to bash but to forensically expose failings. This should be more powerful than bashing, but will be lost on our poorly politically educated electorate.
 
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