I need a little help seeing the positive.

No one is saying we’re going to sell our 5 best players, just that it’s different to last season in that we actually own them.

I could maybe see one of Forss or McGree going but that’s about it.



There was a picture of McGree on insta with a protective boot on, back in Oz, so he hasn’t even bothered sticking round til the season ends. I could be reading too much into that though 😅
 
We look a mid table outfit even with the current loan players (O'Brien, Thomas, Ayling and Greenwood)
When they leave we are immediately depleted.
That's 4 players to recruit for.

Some other players will leave given their contract situations:
McNair, Howson and Jamie Jones are all out of contract.
McGree, Smith, Dijksteel and Coulson will all go into their last year. I think it likely all will leave.

Forss is continually rumoured to be on the move (sadly)

That is 11 of the current first team squad of 28, (plus Coulson) where its highly uncertain they will be here.

Barlaser, Hoppe and Silvera are not good enough, but have 2 seasons left. Who will buy them?
If they go, they too are numbers to replace.

The bit of quality we do have could attract offers the club cashes in on.
Hackney, VdB and/or Latte Lath could be cashed in on. I hope not.

I think it will be another summer of high turnover.
I'm hoping that this summer sees a strong nett spend, not a surplus, and sees us retain the quality we have and not sell it.
Quality first team ready recruits at RB, LB, CM, LW, 10 and CF, then a bit of youthful padding, (or retaining Paddy/Howson) and we can cope with those 11 likely on their way.

It really is about the recruitment/retention decisions and the budgets set.
Take advantage of the FFP/P&S opportunity we now have and invest significantly on quality would be exciting.
Flogging Hackney, VdB and Forss/LL and buying cheap prospects would be another kick in the balls.
 
Currently, I’m not optimistic towards next season. This post got me thinking, are we really moving forward?

We’d just lost at home again, heavily. Plus, we’re going to finish significantly lower in the league than last season. Is that progress?

I keep seeing fans say that the squad is in a better position than it was the season previous, but I don’t see how.

We’re going to lose McNair, Thomas, Greenwood, Ayling* & Howson*.
I mean really? If that is what you feel and think I can't help you, no one can. It's in your head.

Are we moving forward? Maybe

Did we just lose "heavily"? No

Are we going to lose those five players? Dunno. But we can probably keep at least three of them if we want to.

It's upto you how you view it. The miserablists will tell you how poor our recruitment was last summer, yet we are set to return a decent profit on our dealings. The realists will tell us we lack ambition, that Gibbo doesn't want promotion...

That's fine. It's your opinion. Personally I'm already looking forward to next season. You do you.
 
We look a mid table outfit even with the current loan players (O'Brien, Thomas, Ayling and Greenwood)
When they leave we are immediately depleted.
That's 4 players to recruit for.

Some other players will leave given their contract situations:
McNair, Howson and Jamie Jones are all out of contract.
McGree, Smith, Dijksteel and Coulson will all go into their last year. I think it likely all will leave.

Forss is continually rumoured to be on the move (sadly)

That is 11 of the current first team squad of 28, (plus Coulson) where its highly uncertain they will be here.

Barlaser, Hoppe and Silvera are not good enough, but have 2 seasons left. Who will buy them?
If they go, they too are numbers to replace.

The bit of quality we do have could attract offers the club cashes in on.
Hackney, VdB and/or Latte Lath could be cashed in on. I hope not.

I think it will be another summer of high turnover.
I'm hoping that this summer sees a strong nett spend, not a surplus, and sees us retain the quality we have and not sell it.
Quality first team ready recruits at RB, LB, CM, LW, 10 and CF, then a bit of youthful padding, (or retaining Paddy/Howson) and we can cope with those 11 likely on their way.

It really is about the recruitment/retention decisions and the budgets set.
Take advantage of the FFP/P&S opportunity we now have and invest significantly on quality would be exciting.
Flogging Hackney, VdB and Forss/LL and buying cheap prospects would be another kick in the balls.

Exactly what I’m getting at, but more succinctly put. I don’t think it’s anywhere near as simple as ‘get a few players in and we will challenge’, it looks to me like another massive upheaval.
 
As much as that would be good money I’d be a bit concerned if we let them all go. Even if we brought in proven quality to replace them. I think we’ve shown this season that it takes time for players to gel. Last thing we want is to give the rest of the league another 7 game head start because we have 8 new players in the starting XI.
So would I and I’ve 99.99% certain we will not sell McGree, Forss, Rav, Hackney and Lath this summer.
 
Left wing with pace / goal threat , CDM with real athleticism ( and six goals a year ) and a rapid RB ...
We're in with a shout of being a 3rd to 5th place without luck.
( Mcgree could leave , finch as 3rd striker , )

We're 15million off that
 
Reasons to be cheerful
( Over the is time last year )

MC now more experienced, and perhaps more pragmatic.

Our own very good keeper , young centre centre half , and centre forward .

Josh proved he is good enough at this level if he stays fit .

Izzy back on form .

Clarke fit and performing .

Azaz looks a good player

Money in the club from the Chuba ,Rogers and Crooks sales

Engel , Silvera , Barlaser , Gilbert , all good squad players, ( no where near as bad as some make out ) and all have the potential to improve.

Good Crop of young players , Finch , Matthews , McCabe , Cartwright Bilongo who may play a part .

2 good young keepers have had successful loan seasons and may challenge for a squad place .

2 experienced full backs and a midfielder in on loan currently, who may be available to sign at good value .
 
We found Latte Lath, Morgan Rogers, Seny Dieng and VdB in the last close season. Who’s not to say we won’t find similar quality in this one?
And that is a key point. Historically, unless we threw a boatload of money at established big name stars, our recruitment has, being kind, been patchy.

We now appear to have a well thought out plan with clear direction regarding recruitment. Yes we may lose one or two, but even if we do, the relative success of the recruitment department leaves me with hope we can bring in some quality and have a successful season.
 
And that is a key point. Historically, unless we threw a boatload of money at established big name stars, our recruitment has, being kind, been patchy.

We now appear to have a well thought out plan with clear direction regarding recruitment. Yes we may lose one or two, but even if we do, the relative success of the recruitment department leaves me with hope we can bring in some quality and have a successful season.
Agreed.

Last year the recruitment team were running two separate lists of targets depending on what division we'd be in. Even after the defeat to Coventry they were having to contend with the possibility of bringing the loans back and the uncertainty of Chuba's contract.

None of that applies today. We have been 95% sure of being a Championship team since about February and the recruitment team will have been preparing accordingly. They also have fewer positions to fill and more resource.
 
We look a mid table outfit even with the current loan players (O'Brien, Thomas, Ayling and Greenwood)
When they leave we are immediately depleted.
That's 4 players to recruit for.

Some other players will leave given their contract situations:
McNair, Howson and Jamie Jones are all out of contract.
McGree, Smith, Dijksteel and Coulson will all go into their last year. I think it likely all will leave.

Forss is continually rumoured to be on the move (sadly)

That is 11 of the current first team squad of 28, (plus Coulson) where its highly uncertain they will be here.

Barlaser, Hoppe and Silvera are not good enough, but have 2 seasons left. Who will buy them?
If they go, they too are numbers to replace.

The bit of quality we do have could attract offers the club cashes in on.
Hackney, VdB and/or Latte Lath could be cashed in on. I hope not.

I think it will be another summer of high turnover.
I'm hoping that this summer sees a strong nett spend, not a surplus, and sees us retain the quality we have and not sell it.
Quality first team ready recruits at RB, LB, CM, LW, 10 and CF, then a bit of youthful padding, (or retaining Paddy/Howson) and we can cope with those 11 likely on their way.

It really is about the recruitment/retention decisions and the budgets set.
Take advantage of the FFP/P&S opportunity we now have and invest significantly on quality would be exciting.
Flogging Hackney, VdB and Forss/LL and buying cheap prospects would be another kick in the balls.
Absolute knackers your talking there mate.

We look a mid table outfit even with the current loan players (O'Brien, Thomas, Ayling and Greenwood)
When they leave we are immediately depleted.
That's 4 players to recruit for.

Obrien is back up for howson and Hackney.

thomas is 3rd choice LB, only signed to cover injured player.

Ayling signed because smith out for the season and dijksteel not good enough. only signed for covering smith being injured.

Greenwood, is trash and only been played because Hackney and Mcgree were injured most of the season and we sold rogers. wont be a miss at all.

losing 3 short team loans who were using as emergency cover or as a squad filler isnt going to deplete us. as soon as the other players are fit we'd be stronger than when having to play them.

Everything else you said its just you wetting the bed, speculating worst case scenario's.

We need another RB, CM, LW and CF. for the first 11. A few more back up loans deals or projects to fill the squad out again.

If Forss leaves we will replace because we'd get a decent fee.
If Mcgree leaves we replace because again we would get a decent fee.

we wont sell lath or Hackney unless we get massive money. plenty of cash to replace.

if we actually do sell all 4 of them we could buy and replace because we'd have probably around 40million mark.

if our recruitment team had that amount of money to play with, on top of the rogers sale. we would 100% be bringing is some real good players.

though that scenario wont happen and we are not in a position to need to sell. if players want to leave eg glover, mcgree, forss. then fine they can leave we will find better and improve on them anyway.
 
I'm probably in the minority but I actually think a top 10 finish and a Semi Final is slightly over par for the circumstances we've had this season.
We've had one single player from last season's great side available for more than 2/3rds of our season, and he's 35! Only two available for more than half, Howson and Fry.
Integrating a whole new regular first team, and then for many of those new players to get injured is a hell of a challenge.
So my main reason for optimism is Michael Carrick who's proved again he's a good manager.
 
I look at the squad after the final day.

Gk: Dieng, Glover (a positive)

RB: Smith (number 1 place to be adressed)

CB: VDB, Fry, Lenihan, Clarke (a positive)

LB: Engel, Bangura (I think they will be good enough following a full pre-season)

CM: Hackney, Barlaser. (Needs work)

AM3: Jones, Forss, Azaz, Silvera, McGree, Gilbert (Needs a little work)

CF: Lath, Coburn (need a young back up)

With no further outgoings, re-signing Howson, and belief in development from within I think we need 3 players.. but could easily start a continuity team with no new players and be competitive.
 
No one is saying we’re going to sell our 5 best players, just that it’s different to last season in that we actually own them.

I could maybe see one of Forss or McGree going but that’s about it.



There was a picture of McGree on insta with a protective boot on, back in Oz, so he hasn’t even bothered sticking round til the season ends. I could be reading too much into that though 😅
I noticed Glover was already somewhere sunny and next to a beach.

I'd imagine it's better for your recovery if you're somewhere warm and sunny, rather than here at the minute where its cold, damp and generally pretty miserable weather.
 
I think there’s lots more to be positive about than end of last season. We’ve solved in my opinion the two most difficult positions - GK who’s good with his feet and can actually keep goal & 20+ goals a season striker. They are hard to find and usually cost three times what we have paid. Can’t see LL moving in the summer we’d want too much money for him now, but if he continues his recent scoring rate I think someone from lower half of the PL might take a punt on him in January, £20m+ we wouldn’t turn down. Hackney’s injury has in some way done us a favour and taken him out of the shop window, he will be here next season for sure. Mcgree I think will sign a new deal, Forrs could well be away but if all are fit he doesn’t get in the 1st team. Azaz looks a player to me and will be a star next season.
Our problems are in defence, Bangura & RVDB and possibly Lenihan are the only ones I’d keep. Ayling has been useful, but his wages will be too high, and we need a younger alternative. I’d bin off Fry & Clarke (not mobile enough either of them) Djiksteel is gone, he’s not trusted, Engel is League 2 level at best, Smith is coming back from what coukd have been a career threatening injury, who knows how it will effect him, my bet is he will struggle to be anywhere near the level he was before.
We need 2 x RB’s, 1 x LB, 2 x CB’s and a dynamic holding midfield player. Get that right then I think automatic promotion is easily achievable. Get half of it right, still think we’re in the play offs
 
I think there’s lots more to be positive about than end of last season. We’ve solved in my opinion the two most difficult positions - GK who’s good with his feet and can actually keep goal & 20+ goals a season striker. They are hard to find and usually cost three times what we have paid. Can’t see LL moving in the summer we’d want too much money for him now, but if he continues his recent scoring rate I think someone from lower half of the PL might take a punt on him in January, £20m+ we wouldn’t turn down. Hackney’s injury has in some way done us a favour and taken him out of the shop window, he will be here next season for sure. Mcgree I think will sign a new deal, Forrs could well be away but if all are fit he doesn’t get in the 1st team. Azaz looks a player to me and will be a star next season.
Our problems are in defence, Bangura & RVDB and possibly Lenihan are the only ones I’d keep. Ayling has been useful, but his wages will be too high, and we need a younger alternative. I’d bin off Fry & Clarke (not mobile enough either of them) Djiksteel is gone, he’s not trusted, Engel is League 2 level at best, Smith is coming back from what coukd have been a career threatening injury, who knows how it will effect him, my bet is he will struggle to be anywhere near the level he was before.
We need 2 x RB’s, 1 x LB, 2 x CB’s and a dynamic holding midfield player. Get that right then I think automatic promotion is easily achievable. Get half of it right, still think we’re in the play offs
I think Fry/Clarke/Lenihan/VDB is kind of an ideal 4 centre backs.

We disagree about Engel - who I think will be really good next year after a full year here.

Also can't see how an out of contract Ayling could command high wages - but I do think one RB fitting our model of young with chance to grow would be a good idea.

RB and CM - plus one or two young attacking players - minimise turn over... top 6 season.
 
While I agree that we've had some recruitment successes, it's always been my worry that we won't keep those players together long enough to make that final step up.
Despite all this FFP talk I'm not confident that the clubs finances are able to allow us not to sell our best players. Maybe the Rogers transfer was a unique situation, but this summer will determine if my mind is changed.
 
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