Everton next points deduction no later than April 8th

Norman_Conquest said:
The Premier League needs to have heard Everton and Forest's cases by 8 April. No doubt both clubs will appeal their points deduction to try and circumnavigate relegation but it all needs to be concluded by the 24th of May. There is a general meeting scheduled for June when any relegated club will transfer their certificates.
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Clears it up a bit 👍

Still an absolute sh*t show. It's clearly taking effect though. Just looking at the Jan transfer window. One of the lowest spending in years.

Interesting to see if the mags will come under scrutiny. Apparently sailing very close to it.
 
S7DiscoDown said:
Clears it up a bit 👍

Still an absolute sh*t show. It's clearly taking effect though. Just looking at the Jan transfer window. One of the lowest spending in years.

Interesting to see if the mags will come under scrutiny. Apparently sailing very close to it.
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It has certainly got them spooked.

I do think it's funny that they had Ashley for all those years and as soon as they were bought by a regime with limitless wealth the powers that be seemingly chose that point to clamp down on spending beyond your revenue raising ability.

The timing is truly delicious.
 
S7DiscoDown said:
Clears it up a bit 👍

Still an absolute sh*t show. It's clearly taking effect though. Just looking at the Jan transfer window. One of the lowest spending in years.

Interesting to see if the mags will come under scrutiny. Apparently sailing very close to it.
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Newcastle need to raise circa £100m in the summer to avoid trouble don't they? Probably going to have sell Bruno aren't they.
Maybe this is what Gibbo has been saving the summer warchest for!
 
S7DiscoDown said:
Clears it up a bit 👍

Still an absolute sh*t show. It's clearly taking effect though. Just looking at the Jan transfer window. One of the lowest spending in years.

Interesting to see if the mags will come under scrutiny. Apparently sailing very close to it.
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This is typical of football in England and how it is run. The PL and EFL have rules in place but no set punishment for clubs breaking them. City and Chelsea are both being looked into but they reckon City's is a different type of breach of the rules.

They reckon selling homegrown talent is the way around it and an academy player sale of £40m will offset more than selling a bought in player for the same price. The article I read used Cole Palmer's sale as an example.
 
Nobody's ever really been able to explain to me how these FFP rules or whatever they are called these days benefit anyone apart from the established elite . Originally I thought it was all about stopping clubs over spending to endanger their financial future, but only now is EPL spend being reigned in, while meanwhile clubs further down the pyramid continue to go to the wall under the stewardship of dodgy owners.
 
TeaCider said:
https://twitter.com/x/status/1762427984877703257

They're not really a reliable source when it comes to Premier League stories, even though they're almost always spot on with Middlesbrough, but they think the second charge will be a 6 point deduction.

Would mean Everton would be 1 point from safety.
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This has been on the books for a while.

Bruce said:
I suspect that it will be reduced to 6 points then the pending penalty will also be 6 points leading to a total of 12 points deducted.

Then, probably, Forest get a 6pt deduction, leading to 6 points becoming the standard precedent for clubs who fess up to a simple breach quickly.
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Just listened to a really interesting conversation on talksport about it. Very detailed from business minded people. Definitely a minefield that many are about to step in.

They did say Chelsea would only have to sell 2-3 homegrown players (all profit) and they should be 'fine'. Although he did mention 50mil for Gallagher and 40mil for Broja (eh? 😂).

Also that it could be a real possibility that when Talksport are in Germany for the Euros the final league positions may not be known. That's the 14th of June.
 
S7DiscoDown said:
Just listened to a really interesting conversation on talksport about it. Very detailed from business minded people. Definitely a minefield that many are about to step in.

They did say Chelsea would only have to sell 2-3 homegrown players (all profit) and they should be 'fine'. Although he did mention 50mil for Gallagher and 40mil for Broja (eh? 😂).

Also that it could be a real possibility that when Talksport are in Germany for the Euros the final league positions may not be known. That's the 14th of June.
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Who's going to buy these players though? Chelsea and Newcastle are two clubs who need big fees for a couple of players each. Unless Man Utd, Man City, Liverpool or Spurs want them, who else will have the spending power?

How much headroom do those clubs have to spend?
Are the players Chelsea and Newcastle are trying to flog better than what they already have?

Teams know they need to sell. If anything this will drive the price down. Could a be a tough season for them next season.
 
S7DiscoDown said:
Just listened to a really interesting conversation on talksport about it. Very detailed from business minded people. Definitely a minefield that many are about to step in.

They did say Chelsea would only have to sell 2-3 homegrown players (all profit) and they should be 'fine'. Although he did mention 50mil for Gallagher and 40mil for Broja (eh? 😂).

Also that it could be a real possibility that when Talksport are in Germany for the Euros the final league positions may not be known. That's the 14th of June.
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I mentioned earlier that academy players are worth more than selling another player for the same price. I'm not sure how that works, must be something to do with the investment a clubs made in them.
 
Say we get promoted, we spend £2bn on players & win the league by 7 points. We get a 6 point deduction, win the league by a point & everyone is happy.

Is that how it works now?
 
Norman_Conquest said:
I mentioned earlier that academy players are worth more than selling another player for the same price. I'm not sure how that works, must be something to do with the investment a clubs made in them.
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This is a pretty good description of how it works:


For example, let’s say a club signed a player for £50m on a five-year contract. Amortisation means that, rather than the player costing £50m in the year he was signed, they would cost the club £10m in the books each year, or in other words, an annual amortisation fee of £10m.

As for player sales, the profit or loss made on a sale is calculated by taking the subtracting the player’s book value (their remaining amortised value) at the time of the sale from the transfer fee that has been received. So, continuing on with the original example but three years later; the player has now cost the club £30m (£10m X 3 years) of the initial £50m fee meaning his book value is now £20m (£50m-£30m). Therefore, if the club sell the player for £25m, this allows them to book a £5m profit (£25m fee- £20m book value) on the deal for the player in that year’s accounts.

Furthermore, and this is where academy graduates come into it, if a player has a book value of £0, this enables clubs to book a straight profit on a player sale, with the profit being the amount of the fee they have received (e.g. a £50m sale=£50m profit).

A player can have zero book value for multiple reasons, but the main instance is if they do not cost the club a transfer fee. Meaning that, and this is the key takeaway, academy graduates have zero book value, as they do not cost the clubs transfer fees.
 
Norman_Conquest said:
I mentioned earlier that academy players are worth more than selling another player for the same price. I'm not sure how that works, must be something to do with the investment a clubs made in them.
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Almost the opposite Norm - a homegrown player is deemed to have cost nothing and therefore any transfer fee is all profit. So, for example, if Chelsea sell Gallagher for £50m, that's £50m profit for FFP.

By contrast, Caicedo cost them around £100m on an 8 year contract, so his FFP cost is £12.5m each year over those 8 years. Unless they sell him, in which case any remaining profit or loss is crystallised. So if they tried to offload him for £50m in the summer with 7 years left on his contract, they would crystallise a FFP loss of £37.5m in the process.

As the above demonstrates, they can't actually afford to sell any of the overpriced dross they've signed on 7-8 year contracts, so they will have to sell promising home grown players like Gallagher, Colwill and potentially even Reece James (if he ever stays fit).
 
Andybarca said:
A player can have zero book value for multiple reasons, but the main instance is if they do not cost the club a transfer fee. Meaning that, and this is the key takeaway, academy graduates have zero book value, as they do not cost the clubs transfer fees.
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Or if a player has fulfilled his initial contract length and extended which is also pretty common.

So somebody like McNair would have zero book value if we had managed to sell him.

Selling players with zero book value will give you a higher initial FFP benefit, selling a player with high book value would give you a longer term FFP benedit as you have removed those future annual amortisation fees.
 
If found guilty of deliberate financial mismanagement or financial cheating the punishment should be demotion by 3 divisions. No ifs, no buts, no maybes, no appeals - regardless of who you are or how ‘storied’ your history is.

That’d put an end to it all instantly.
 
B_G said:
Who's going to buy these players though? Chelsea and Newcastle are two clubs who need big fees for a couple of players each. Unless Man Utd, Man City, Liverpool or Spurs want them, who else will have the spending power?

How much headroom do those clubs have to spend?
Are the players Chelsea and Newcastle are trying to flog better than what they already have?

Teams know they need to sell. If anything this will drive the price down. Could a be a tough season for them next season.
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Saudi.
 
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Andybarca said:
This is a pretty good description of how it works:


For example, let’s say a club signed a player for £50m on a five-year contract. Amortisation means that, rather than the player costing £50m in the year he was signed, they would cost the club £10m in the books each year, or in other words, an annual amortisation fee of £10m.

As for player sales, the profit or loss made on a sale is calculated by taking the subtracting the player’s book value (their remaining amortised value) at the time of the sale from the transfer fee that has been received. So, continuing on with the original example but three years later; the player has now cost the club £30m (£10m X 3 years) of the initial £50m fee meaning his book value is now £20m (£50m-£30m). Therefore, if the club sell the player for £25m, this allows them to book a £5m profit (£25m fee- £20m book value) on the deal for the player in that year’s accounts.

Furthermore, and this is where academy graduates come into it, if a player has a book value of £0, this enables clubs to book a straight profit on a player sale, with the profit being the amount of the fee they have received (e.g. a £50m sale=£50m profit).

A player can have zero book value for multiple reasons, but the main instance is if they do not cost the club a transfer fee. Meaning that, and this is the key takeaway, academy graduates have zero book value, as they do not cost the clubs transfer fees.
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That was a concise and easy to understand explanation. Cheers 👍
 
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