BoroMart
Well-known member
the problem is forced by a dearth of capable LBs, he doesn't like Saka as a wing back, only as a forward playerIt’s his own fault. No one forces him to to shoehorn as many right footed full backs Into the squad.
the problem is forced by a dearth of capable LBs, he doesn't like Saka as a wing back, only as a forward playerIt’s his own fault. No one forces him to to shoehorn as many right footed full backs Into the squad.
Yes but no, but yes, but... etcAs embarrassed as I am by our recent performances, and as much as he has to foot some of the blame for it, I do think that Southgate has a point that no previous England manager has had as much pressure on them in terms of results outside of the tournament/qualifiers.
The introduction of the Nations League has removed a solid crop of friendly matches where there was room for practice and experiments, largely on the back of years of fans whinging about friendlies taking place.
I like the Nations League, but there's now only a handful of games where the result has no bearing for a team.
That's partly down to the impact of the pandemic, but it's something to be considered.
At the same time, I don't think it excuses the performances, he was happy to claim it as two semi-finals in the first tournament when we beat Spain and Croatia.
To be fair Grealish and Foden usually play more advanced than Philips and Rice, and they've both had injury and illness issues.We don’t have many games before the WC now though. Southgate seems to experiment all of the time, and doesn’t play our most gifted players. A good manager would be able to build a team round Grealish and Foden, not keep them on the bench, and persist with the likes of Philips, Rice and Mount.
Yes but no, but yes, but... etc
Make a point
.I've found his decision not to call up a natural LB/LWB this time around very strange. Fair enough Chilwell and Shaw were unavailable, but why not call up Mitchell, Creswell or Targett instead?
It's a strange one.
I could understand it if the decision was just that Trippier would play there if Chillwell and Shaw are injured and stuck with that, but we've had 3 different right backs playing there in this period.
If you're going to experiment that much, he should definitely have just brought in an actual left back.
I presume you don't like The Nations League, since you keep saying 'glorified friendly', but it's not really correct.It’s a glorified friendly tournament
It's a minor competition right now. It's like the intertoto cup or zenith data systems trophyI presume you don't like The Nations League, since you keep saying 'glorified friendly', but it's not really correct.
As mentioned previously there is a qualification route in to the Euros. There is a prize pool of something like €100M. Attendances are higher than those for actual friendlies. There is relegation and promotion. (The atmosphere at games is most definitely different from friendlies too).
If you said it was a 2nd or 3rd rate tournament, I couldn't really disagree... but they're not friendlies.
It's a minor competition right now. It's like the intertoto cup or zenith data systems trophy
It's not that I like or dislike it, and it's not just me who thinks they are glorified friendlies.I presume you don't like The Nations League, since you keep saying 'glorified friendly', but it's not really correct.
As mentioned previously there is a qualification route in to the Euros. There is a prize pool of something like €100M. Attendances are higher than those for actual friendlies. There is relegation and promotion. (The atmosphere at games is most definitely different from friendlies too).
If you said it was a 2nd or 3rd rate tournament, I couldn't really disagree... but they're not friendlies.
which is why I called it a minor COMPETITION, not a Minor friendly.Which weren't friendly competitions either.
The Nations League being a tertiary competition doesn't make it a series of friendlies, however hard people try to claim it does.
I agree with a lot of what you said. However, I suspect that people who are "hammering" Southgate for the last four performances DO care about the Nations League. As such they will have been delighted when England made the final four, and won't have been dismissing the concept. (I don't think it's a case of not being pleased either way).As for England, it’d be interesting to see how many of those people hammering Southgate for the past four performances and results were dismissing the Nations League as a concept when England made it to the final four. Those are the people that can’t be pleased either way, let’s be honest.
I don’t begrudge people showing frustration. But some of that, in my opinion, comes from some sort of entitlement. This isn’t just your mates, England fans, or Boro fans. Paying to follow and support these teams doesn’t guarantee you entertainment, wins, goals. In fact we had some great counter-attacking play on show from Hungary last night… if it’s entertaining you’re looking for.I agree with a lot of what you said. However, I suspect that people who are "hammering" Southgate for the last four performances DO care about the Nations League. As such they will have been delighted when England made the final four, and won't have been dismissing the concept. (I don't think it's a case of not being pleased either way).
As I said on another thread, one of the most exciting England games that I've been to in recent years, with one of the best atmospheres, was when we beat Croatia 2-1 at Wembley (coming back from 1-0 down). We qualified for the finals in the last 15 minutes. I tried to get tickets for the finals, but they sold out to ESC members with more 'caps' than me.
I actually had a ticket for last night, but didn't go in the end. Some of my mates did go. They were also in Germany last week. It's expensive going to all these games, supporting England, so I think people have a right to show a bit of frustration (and boo / criticise Southgate) when England serve up turgid rubbish.
Sure, but do you think the players would like it if no one turned up? (You're basically saying "More fool you (me) for paying good money to go and see unimportant games".I don’t begrudge people showing frustration. But some of that, in my opinion, comes from some sort of entitlement. This isn’t just your mates, England fans, or Boro fans. Paying to follow and support these teams doesn’t guarantee you entertainment, wins, goals. In fact we had some great counter-attacking play on show from Hungary last night… if it’s entertaining you’re looking for.
It’s professional sport at the end of the day. Southgate’s job is to win matches and he’s done that, more than most other England managers in history. That disjointed, laboured performance last night is indicative of nothing more than end-of-season weariness, experimental team selections, players missing, a very well-organised and underrated opposition(in the midst of this backlash, Hungary’s progress under this Italian coach has gone almost completely unmentioned).
Personally I’ve never got the booing. I mean, it *looks* ridiculous. It’s the stuff of children, of pantomime. It doesn’t make players play better. It doesn’t put energy into tired minds and limbs, or confidence into wilting players. It doesn’t bring the opposition out of their shape, open up angles, force mistakes. It’s entirely counterproductive.
This may be a slightly inflammatory thing to say but if you pay £40, £50, £60 plus travel, expenses and time off work to go and see what was essentially a friendly game, and it’s sh*t, then… there’s not a lot anyone can do about that. It’s just the way this sort of football goes, especially when one team is experimenting ahead of a tournament and the other is at full tilt.
If England play like we did last night during the next World Cup then the manager has a lot more questions to answer. But until then, it’s just noise. In my opinion.