Brexiwhingers

[Cuthbert]

I am sorry but the idea of the country coming together, moving on as you say is ridiculous. Brexiteers have almost certainly made us ALL poorer, gave us less choice and damaged the economy in the long term. Then, as it slowly starts to sink in, that this is the case they demand unity and for us all to move on. No Chance!!!!

Osboro, sorry but the vast majority of people employed in those industries voted out. Now the whine and whinge that we haven’t reached those Sunny Uplands they were certain we would reach.

Brexit could be a success, and the UK might be more prosperous in the future. It's far too early to tell. Obviously at this early stage there is going to be quite a bit of disruption. I was/am a remainer, but there really is very little to be gained from being determined for things to fail.

Let's not forget that there were ALWAYS pros and cons of being in the EU. It's not like it was 100% good or 100% bad - as the retrospective views seem to imply these days.

 

[r00fie1]

".....could be a success" (?!!).
At who`s expense?
We were told it was good for "all" (?!) of us.

"Could" means - "it isnt now and Im not sure....." - backtracking and contradicting everything the racist Farage and the right rhetoric promised.

Would anyone care to explain why Farage was / is so anti-Europe and who was / is pulling his strings and filling his wallet?

That`s probably important to understand who really is manipulating and interfering with the British political process......?

Its not Russia, China or the Outer Hebrides.

 

[Laughing]

Cutthroat Cuthbert, not cutthroat, EDIT raises a valid point, the vocal remain, I am guessing, would rather see the uk plunge into recession so they can continue the rhetoric and silly meaningless posts about passport colour, continue pointing fingers at those they blame.

I have no idea what this means but it seems to be the case for many.

 

[SmallTown]

Cutthroat raises a valid point, the vocal remain, I am guessing, would rather see the uk plunge into recession so they can continue the rhetoric and silly meaningless posts about passport colour, continue pointing fingers at those they blame.

I have no idea what this means but it seems to be the case for many.

No

 

[Cuthbert]

".....could be a success" (?!!).
At who`s expense?
We were told it was good for "all" (?!) of us.

"Could" means - "it isnt now and Im not sure....." - backtracking and contradicting everything the racist Farage and the right rhetoric promised.

Would anyone care to explain why Farage was / is so anti-Europe and who was / is pulling his strings and filling his wallet?

That`s probably important to understand who really is manipulating and interfering with the British political process......?

Its not Russia, China or the Outer Hebrides.

Yes, it could be a success roofie1, in due course. I'm pretty sure that most people would have expected it to take time, having been in the EU for as long as we have.

One of the biggest complaints from the fishing industry currently is that they are losing money because the fish is spoiling because transit is taking too long. Things like that will be ironed out. It's currently a legitimate gripe, even if you were a Brexit voting fisherman. (Although the OP seems to imply it's not)?

Anyway, as I've said several times, I was/am/would be a remainer, but I don't see the upside in being determined for things to fail moving forwards.

 

[coluka]

Coluka, I was venting my spleen at what I see as hypocritical complaints from industries that were happy to to trump their own selfish and populist agendas. Now the chickens are coming home to roost and they whine and whinge. Did they give a damn about reality or other peoples jobs. Did they F@#k and now we all suffer because people refused to listen to sense, experts (not claiming that) and the evidence. I put my views up, as I am permitted to And if you think that is just for the sale of argument then you can think that.

Osborn: Remain

You can not hide your post was divisive or that you never thought it would not be. Secondly, what long lasting chickens have come home to roost purely because of brexit? Please post evidence as i don’t see any 19 days in. There may or may not be but only time will tell. Are you seriously suggesting that 52% of the electorate that voted did not give a damn about their jobs or their colleagues? Everyone has lost their jobs have they? And purely due to brexit, nothing else? People lose employment all the time, brexit is not at the heart of all losses, nor indeed all new jobs. I still see firms advertising vacancies still and we are in a pandemic.

You say people refused to listen to sense - what you really mean is they did not listen to you and similar thinking people, they disagreed. Democracy is something you don’t agree with unless it falls your way by the looks of it. The longer people fight brexit, the worse they make it for our country. The argument is over, brexit happened. Get on and make the best of it, but by all means do your civic duty as you see it to see if you can rejoin with the help of the electorate. Eventually we may, if we do, thats democracy too, I for one support democracy in action, not my selfish view. The only whinging is from remain. If any brexiteers were whinging, they have no right if brexit was the cause of their angst. We can only move forward in life if we let go of the past and forge the best future we can with whatever life throws our way, sulking is never a good decision.

 

[Muttley]

The longer people fight brexit, the worse they make it for our country.

Exactly how will me pointing out the folly of this ludicrous decision make one jot of difference to the economic performance of this country? Anyway let's all enjoy a picture of happier times...

 

[coluka]

Exactly how will me pointing out the folly of this ludicrous decision make one jot of difference to the economic performance of this country? Anyway let's all enjoy a picture of happier times...

Because people talking the country down and not giving their all to move on has a negative impact on not only themselves, but equally, if not more importantly, those around them that have no choice but to listen. You are as divisive as anyone Muttley, If Carry On Whinging were a film, you’d be one of the lead characters

 

[SmallTown]

Because people talking the country down and not giving their all to move on has a negative impact on not only themselves, but equally, if not more importantly, those around them that have no choice but to listen. You are as divisive as anyone Muttley, If Carry On Whinging were a film, you’d be one of the lead characters

I'm not sure how pointing out things that are actually happening is talking the country down? I know we live in a post truth world where everyone has to ignore or spin bad news but most anti brexit posts I have seen are "this IS costing more money" or "this IS more difficult now". That's not bringing the country down. Its pointing out uncomfortable truths. I know, modern politics and trumping means we can just discount unpleasant facts. It doesn't mean they don't exist though.

 

[r00fie1]

At least the North Atlantic Cod are "happy"

 

[HarryVegas]

I thought brexit was supposed to be a great idea? Surely somebody "whinging" on a local footie board couldn't stop such bold and certain progress, could it?

 

[coluka]

I'm not sure how pointing out things that are actually happening is talking the country down? I know we live in a post truth world where everyone has to ignore or spin bad news but most anti brexit posts I have seen are "this IS costing more money" or "this IS more difficult now". That's not bringing the country down. Its pointing out uncomfortable truths. I know, modern politics and trumping means we can just discount unpleasant facts. It doesn't mean they don't exist though.

Constant negativity affects those around us, we do not always know how friends, colleagues, even family think, it affects their drive, their mood, their spirit, their fight, their determination. It brings people down. Speak to any Dr, Psychologist, Counsellor etc it is a proven fact. Constant negativity breeds yet more negativity, surprised you can’t see that. Debate is healthy if controlled and reasoned, far too many people seem entrenched instead of moving forward, in the words of the Mogganaut, it is what it is, so accept your lot and move forward with life, failure to do so means you are shooting yourself as well as others in the foot.

 

[SmallTown]

Constant negativity affects those around us, we do not always know how friends, colleagues, even family think, it affects their drive, their mood, their spirit, their fight, their determination. It brings people down. Speak to any Dr, Psychologist, Counsellor etc it is a proven fact. Constant negativity breeds yet more negativity, surprised you can’t see that. Debate is healthy if controlled and reasoned, far too many people seem entrenched instead of moving forward, in the words of the Mogganaut, it is what it is, so accept your lot and move forward with life, failure to do so means you are shooting yourself as well as others in the foot.

Thats dangerously close to blaming remainers for the failure of brexit. I'll say it again: most posts I see I simply pointing out things that are actually happening as a result of brexit. We have gone from the old "project fear" guesses and now are saying things that have gone wrong.

If that comes across as negative its only because there are many negative points to brexit. Its not a negative attitude. Its just pointing out that its failing and we need to do something about it.

 

[Muttley]

"moving forward"

Yeah that'll do it for those Scottish Fishermen, the lines of truckers in Kent, etc.

Let's all pretend that everything is marvellous, be happy because that's the way to affect GDP you idle fukkers...

Know your place scum.

 

[WeeGord]

Constant negativity affects those around us, we do not always know how friends, colleagues, even family think, it affects their drive, their mood, their spirit, their fight, their determination. It brings people down. Speak to any Dr, Psychologist, Counsellor etc it is a proven fact. Constant negativity breeds yet more negativity, surprised you can’t see that. Debate is healthy if controlled and reasoned, far too many people seem entrenched instead of moving forward, in the words of the Mogganaut, it is what it is, so accept your lot and move forward with life, failure to do so means you are shooting yourself as well as others in the foot.

Coluka, as a very long standing member of this board and undoubtedly one of the most popular I have always read your posts and considered your views and opinions on Brexit even when they don't match my own. You're pretty much always respectful in your posts on what is without doubt a very divisive subject and that is a credit to you.

However, I have to say that this idea that we need to just move on for the greater good and leave the Brexit shambles (that, IMHO, is exactly what it is) behind us is inflammatory and divisive in itself. People can't just take it on the chin and move on when there are many metrics under which we are now much worse off individually and as a nation. Our freedoms have been eroded, not enhanced, and to suggest that those people who voted to try and avoid this mess need to just move on is akin to burying heads in the sand.

The people who are mostly going to benefit from Brexit are not the majority of the millions who voted for / were hoodwinked into it, but those small numbers of people who wield power and influence via the means of propaganda. They will benefit greatly.

The Brexit discussion is ongoing, and will be for quite some time - to try and sweep the mess under the carpet 3 weeks in when major problems are already apparent will not be the correct medicine for this illness.

 

[LaPennaBianca]

Coluka, as a very long standing member of this board and undoubtedly one of the most popular I have always read your posts and considered your views and opinions on Brexit even when they don't match my own. You're pretty much always respectful in your posts on what is without doubt a very divisive subject and that is a credit to you.

However, I have to say that this idea that we need to just move on for the greater good and leave the Brexit shambles (that, IMHO, is exactly what it is) behind us is inflammatory and divisive in itself. People can't just take it on the chin and move on when there are many metrics under which we are now much worse off individually and as a nation. Our freedoms have been eroded, not enhanced, and to suggest that those people who voted to try and avoid this mess need to just move on is akin to burying heads in the sand.

The people who are mostly going to benefit from Brexit are not the majority of the millions who voted for / were hoodwinked into it, but those small numbers of people who wield power and influence via the means of propaganda. They will benefit greatly.

The Brexit discussion is ongoing, and will be for quite some time - to try and sweep the mess under the carpet 3 weeks in when major problems are already apparent will not be the correct medicine for this illness.

The people saying move on are showing the same naivety they did when they voted for the shambles.

Firstly, the EU's MO is to keep it's neighbours in a constant state of negotiations and always taking a decisions in a) its own time and b) to its own direct benefit. The UK is now the junior partner next to a monolithic neighbour, that is out lot now. To think this deal is the end of anything shows how I'll informed you are about the EU.

Secondly, the vote exposed some faultlines in society and highlighted how spiteful people on both sides of the divide can be. The entire way in which the Brexit process was enacted - divisive, crowing, belligerent and aggressive - is testament to this. Moreover, these divisions are the basis of the Conservative Party's electoral coalition - older, angrier voters.

The Tories are a party with no ideas facing economic turmoil. So if you think they'll be leaving the Brexit culture wars behind you've not been paying attention.

 

[Laughing]

In the same spirit as your post WeeGord, what would be the endgame for the argument and debate? What are people trying to achieve?

 

[WeeGord]

In the same spirit as your post WeeGord, what would be the endgame for the argument and debate? What are people trying to achieve?

I don't think there ever is an endgame, but I DO think there is a much bigger majority in the future. I genuinely believe that in 12-24 months, that polling will show that a new referedum would show at least a 60-40 split, possibly even 65-35 in favour of rejoining the EU. It won't happen, not for a generation, but I really believe that is the direction of travel when the con of leaving the EU becomes apparent.

Most of the reasons I have been given by friends and colleagues as the reasons they voted leave tended to be nonsensical - they were sick of the working class being ignored and forgotten about, were sick of the fat cats getting paid ridiculous sums, sick of the inequality of pensions compared to some European states. I always pointed out that these things were nothing to do with the EU, but some believed that leaving the EU would result in a brighter future. Some talked about soverigenty without even knowing what it is. Some talked about immigration without realising immigration will continue.

As and when things slowly dawn on some people I think there will be a rethink and that's why I would urge anyone who beleives they may have got it wrong in voting leave to accept it and make their moves to put it right. Entrenched views help nobody. A generation down the line I beleive (hope) there'll be the chance to rejoin the EU and the discussion between this point until then needs to be open and honest, and not just 'get on with it' or 'we lost, get over it'. As a nation we have, IMHO, shown ourselves to be very naive and easily manipulated and I just hope that this proves to be the foundation of more honest and open discussion moving forward.

Just accepting something negative and harmful and not being able to discuss or voice our thoughts in NEVER the way forward.

 

[coluka]

"moving forward"

Yeah that'll do it for those Scottish Fishermen, the lines of truckers in Kent, etc.

Let's all pretend that everything is marvellous, be happy because that's the way to affect GDP you idle fukkers...

Know your place scum.

Moving forward is better than moaning. Give it a try you may improve your thought process and outlook by years, even decades.

 

[Laughing]

I don't think there ever is an endgame, but I DO think there is a much bigger majority in the future. I genuinely believe that in 12-24 months, that polling will show that a new referedum would show at least a 60-40 split, possibly even 65-35 in favour of rejoining the EU. It won't happen, not for a generation, but I really believe that is the direction of travel when the con of leaving the EU becomes apparent.

Most of the reasons I have been given by friends and colleagues as the reasons they voted leave tended to be nonsensical - they were sick of the working class being ignored and forgotten about, were sick of the fat cats getting paid ridiculous sums, sick of the inequality of pensions compared to some European states. I always pointed out that these things were nothing to do with the EU, but some believed that leaving the EU would result in a brighter future. Some talked about soverigenty without even knowing what it is. Some talked about immigration without realising immigration will continue.

As and when things slowly dawn on some people I think there will be a rethink and that's why I would urge anyone who beleives they may have got it wrong in voting leave to accept it and make their moves to put it right. Entrenched views help nobody. A generation down the line I beleive (hope) there'll be the chance to rejoin the EU and the discussion between this point until then needs to be open and honest, and not just 'get on with it' or 'we lost, get over it'. As a nation we have, IMHO, shown ourselves to be very naive and easily manipulated and I just hope that this proves to be the foundation of more honest and open discussion moving forward.

Just accepting something negative and harmful and not being able to discuss or voice our thoughts in NEVER the way forward.

I tend to agree that the momentum in a short space of time will be toward closer ties with the EU again. People will start to regret their vote to leave, it took me until Johnsons promotion to PM to feel sick to my stomach with votng to leave the EU.

Nothing wrong with debate but rhetoric is not debate.