Are the Government massaging the death rate.

Alvez_48

Well-known member
Well the mortality rate is 100% not accurate and definitely lower than is shown..so there's that.
 

Jonny Ingbar

Well-known member
The government have been floundering from the start and a response based on the number of people seriously infected is flawed due to how reactive it is.

The Germans have followed the South Korean model, which relies on pro-actively seeking out where the virus is spreading the most and therefore restricting its spread.
 

Lefty

Well-known member
The government have been floundering from the start and a response based on the number of people seriously infected is flawed due to how reactive it is.

The Germans have followed the South Korean model, which relies on pro-actively seeking out where the virus is spreading the most and therefore restricting its spread.

is it true that the Germans are issuing people who have been tested, had the virus and are over it, with a document which allows them to then go about their business without restrictions?
 

bear66

Well-known member
Good idea.

Another reason we should have been testing testing testing.
There are a lot of downsides though. Immunity might only last a few months. People actively try to get Covid-19 to get back to work. Admin!
 

br14

Active member
You can only do mass testing if you have the infrastructure to perform that testing. That means having the equipment, the test kits, the staffing and the cash to pay for it all. The UK isn't alone in being behind the curve on testing.

One thing that occurred to me is that countries that have outsourced their manufacturing base overseas, like the US, the UK, and others, have had significant problems ramping up testing, while those with huge trade surpluses, like South Korea and Germany, because they have a dynamic manufacturing base, seem to be far better prepared.

This is probably because trade deficits really do make you a poorer society and cause dramatic inequality. Financial service surpluses may hide the economic impact of manufacturing deficits, but the fact is only by making stuff do you actually generate wealth. Hopefully when this is all done, some of this damaging madness can be reversed.
 

Lefty

Well-known member
You can only do mass testing if you have the infrastructure to perform that testing. That means having the equipment, the test kits, the staffing and the cash to pay for it all. The UK isn't alone in being behind the curve on testing.

One thing that occurred to me is that countries that have outsourced their manufacturing base overseas, like the US, the UK, and others, have had significant problems ramping up testing, while those with huge trade surpluses, like South Korea and Germany, because they have a dynamic manufacturing base, seem to be far better prepared.

This is probably because trade deficits really do make you a poorer society and cause dramatic inequality. Financial service surpluses may hide the economic impact of manufacturing deficits, but the fact is only by making stuff do you actually generate wealth. Hopefully when this is all done, some of this damaging madness can be reversed.

Or just not elect stupid people who underfund the health service and ignore experts.
 

br14

Active member
Or just not elect stupid people who underfund the health service and ignore experts.

Up to this year if you'd asked the experts in the NHS what they needed money for they'd have come up with a huge shopping list of items, but I'd be willing to bet that dealing with a global pandemic would not have been at the top of the list. If it had of been, Johnson wouldn't have been announcing "40 new hospitals", but "40 million N95 respirator masks". Doesn't quite have the same ring. And certainly wouldn't have attracted any votes.

The problem seems to be that stupid people from all parties listened to the wrong experts.

Not the voice in the wilderness medical experts insisting that we prepare for a global pandemic when there hasn't been one for 100 years, but the inventory management experts that recommended JIT. Buy the product for cheap from China they say. Have them deliver just in time to meet local demand, based on requirements schedules based on annual usage models with a little extra for the occasional influenza outbreak. You'll save a fortune say the experts. And they're right a fortune was saved.

But what happens when supply chains break down? When demand exceeds supply, and the manufacturers can't meet order schedules or are required by law to meet local government demand. Nurses deal with Covid-19 patients without adequate protection and Public Health officials don't have enough test kits to go around is what happens. And you end up in a bidding war with all the other poor schmucks desperate for PPE and testing equipment in a global shortage.

When you think about it for more than 30 seconds, it's bleeding obvious that a respiratory disease global pandemic is going to mean countries quite naturally wishing to provide for their own people first. As the virus hit China "globalisation" went out the window so fast we hardly noticed. Suddenly borders mattered. Even in the EU, the Germans refused to provide the financial reassurance needed by Spain and Italy and Shengen was flushed down the toilet. So we can hardly blame China for putting its people first. Had they failed to do so they could have 1.3 billion rising up in rebellion.

Much of the West was left unarmed against the invisible enemy. While Germany, China, South Korea, Singapore etc. used the real wealth generated from their trade surpluses to protect their people. It's not a coincidence they have the best equipment and the lowest death rates - stupid politicians or otherwise.
 
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1finny

Well-known member
Up to this year if you'd asked the experts in the NHS what they needed money for they'd have come up with a huge shopping list of items, but I'd be willing to bet that dealing with a global pandemic would not have been at the top of the list. If it had of been, Johnson wouldn't have been announcing "40 new hospitals", but "40 million N95 respirator masks". Doesn't quite have the same ring. And certainly wouldn't have attracted any votes.

The problem seems to be that stupid people from all parties listened to the wrong experts.

Not the voice in the wilderness medical experts insisting that we prepare for a global pandemic when there hasn't been one for 100 years, but the inventory management experts that recommended JIT. Buy the product for cheap from China they say. Have them deliver just in time to meet local demand, based on requirements schedules based on annual usage models with a little extra for the occasional influenza outbreak. You'll save a fortune say the experts. And they're right a fortune was saved.

But what happens when supply chains break down? When demand exceeds supply, and the manufacturers can't meet order schedules or are required by law to meet local government demand. Nurses deal with Covid-19 patients without adequate protection and Public Health officials don't have enough test kits to go around is what happens. And you end up in a bidding war with all the other poor schmucks desperate for PPE and testing equipment in a global shortage.

When you think about it for more than 30 seconds, it's bleeding obvious that a respiratory disease global pandemic is going to mean countries quite naturally wishing to provide for their own people first. As the virus hit China "globalisation" went out the window so fast we hardly noticed. Suddenly borders mattered. Even in the EU, the Germans refused to provide the financial reassurance needed by Spain and Italy and Shengen was flushed down the toilet. So we can hardly blame China for putting its people first. Had they failed to do so they could have 1.3 billion rising up in rebellion.

Much of the West was left unarmed against the invisible enemy. While Germany, China, South Korea, Singapore etc. used the real wealth generated from their trade surpluses to protect their people. It's not a coincidence they have the best equipment and the lowest death rates - stupid politicians or otherwise.

4 years ago the NHS pitched for equipment to fund a flu pandemic as a contingency. It was blocked because of cost. That equipment would have come in quite handy now.
 

bear66

Well-known member
4 years ago the NHS pitched for equipment to fund a flu pandemic as a contingency. It was blocked because of cost. That equipment would have come in quite handy now.
Exactly. I read that yesterday. Minutes of meetings disclosed showing plans in place . . . and then at some level it was blocked. Our politicians have really let us down. It's a shame that MPs come from such a narrow background. Career politicians, journalism or business people. Science and mathematical background MPs are rare.
 

bear66

Well-known member
169 infections in Teesside and 30 in NY in South Tees hospital district.

Approx 24% increase in Teesside figures in a day.
 

bear66

Well-known member
209 infections in Teesside and 37 in NY in South Tees hospital district.

Approx 25% increase in Teesside figures in a day.
 

bear66

Well-known member
246 infections in Teesside and 41 in NY in South Tees hospital district.

Approx 18% increase in Teesside figures in a day. R&C by 8%. Lowest figures for some time. Still slightly higher than national average.
 

Sheriff_John_Bunnell_ret

Well-known member
You can bet your bottom dollar that we will be much better prepared for the next global pandemic.

Just hope we don't get an asteroid hitting the planet instead.
 
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