Anti lockdown rally

Andy_W said:
Aye, you are.
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Cognitive dissonance causes feelings of unease and tension, and people attempt to relieve this discomfort in different ways. Examples include “explaining things away” or rejecting new information that conflicts with their existing beliefs.
 
Randy said:
Where we could be heading with vaccines? Ok then.
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No, where we could be heading with cases, hospitalisations and then deaths, with circa 25m of the population currently with next to zero protection and most of the others (about 40m) partially protected by 50-98%. But even if that 40m were 90% protected, that's still a vulnerability, for the most vulnerable.

Vaccines will solve our problem, and they already would have, had we just been dealing with Alpha. But because R0 is higher with Delta, it needs a higher threshold, as it spreads more.

Even if a more transmissible variant does come around, it will largely be irrelevant for us, as we will be as far down the line as we can get, and it would effectively hit the "vaccine wall".

There are more hospitals than people in ICU with covid in this country.
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Second try, care to reply to this:
There was in March 20, and in August 20 too, but there wasn't in April - May 20 or October 20 to March 21.

I take it your stance was still the same back in March 20 and September 20?
What about in April 20 and January 21? Were you saying that then? No, you weren't.
 
the_smog_chorus said:
Cognitive dissonance causes feelings of unease and tension, and people attempt to relieve this discomfort in different ways. Examples include “explaining things away” or rejecting new information that conflicts with their existing beliefs.
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Nah, it's just science and maths, it's not that difficult when you understand it (y) No unease or tension, just disbelief at your ignorance and selfishness.

CD is related to conflicting beliefs, which I don't have, although you seem to (y)

How's life down the rabbit hole anyway?
 
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Some arrogance on this thread fellas. You can disagree without insulting each other.

The I understand but you don't attitude is a disgrace to be honest.

It's bit by bit turning the board into a pretty unpleasant place where being right is all that matters.
 
Randy said:
Yep. Any mention of American states is met with silence or excuses that they don't have this variant or that variant.
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NY still has restrictions. People will continue to have to wear masks in schools, subways, large sports arenas, homeless shelters, hospitals, nursing homes, jails and prisons. Unvaccinated New Yorkers will still be subject to a mask mandate while indoors in public places.
 
hewielewie said:
NY still has restrictions. People will continue to have to wear masks in schools, subways, large sports arenas, homeless shelters, hospitals, nursing homes, jails and prisons. Unvaccinated New Yorkers will still be subject to a mask mandate while indoors in public places.
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Massachusetts has openef up though with mandatory mask wearing removed. Don't know about new York.
 
Laughing said:
Some arrogance on this thread fellas. You can disagree without insulting each other.

The I understand but you don't attitude is a disgrace to be honest.

It's bit by bit turning the board into a pretty unpleasant place where being right is all that matters.
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It's not arrogance, not from me, it's just belief in those that know the most, which thankfully most agree with.

Denying science, modelling, maths, logic is more of a disgrace, it's got hundreds of thousands killed.

Being right doesn't matter, doing the right thing to stop people dying does though, as does fighting back against those spreading disinformation.
 
Andy_W said:
It's not arrogance, not from me, it's just belief in those that know the most, which thankfully most agree with.

Denying science, modelling, maths, logic is more of a disgrace, it's got hundreds of thousands killed.

Being right doesn't matter, doing the right thing to stop people dying does though, as does fighting back against those spreading disinformation.
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Go Andy and thanks for your service.
 
Andy_W said:
No, where we could be heading with cases, hospitalisations and then deaths, with circa 25m of the population currently with next to zero protection and most of the others (about 40m) partially protected by 50-98%. But even if that 40m were 90% protected, that's still a vulnerability, for the most vulnerable.

Vaccines will solve our problem, and they already would have, had we just been dealing with Alpha. But because R0 is higher with Delta, it needs a higher threshold, as it spreads more.

Even if a more transmissible variant does come around, it will largely be irrelevant for us, as we will be as far down the line as we can get, and it would effectively hit the "vaccine wall".


Second try, care to reply to this:
There was in March 20, and in August 20 too, but there wasn't in April - May 20 or October 20 to March 21.

I take it your stance was still the same back in March 20 and September 20?
What about in April 20 and January 21? Were you saying that then? No, you weren't.
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There are 1257 hospitals in the UK as of 2019 which includes NHS trust run hospitals and private hospitals.

There are currently 188 people in ventilation beds. 1136 patients in hospitals with covid.


So what part of my post was false? Or is the government dashboard made up.
 
Randy said:
There are 1257 hospitals in the UK as of 2019 which includes NHS trust run hospitals and private hospitals.

There are currently 188 people in ventilation beds. 1136 patients in hospitals with covid.


So what part of my post was false? Or is the government dashboard made up.
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Right, I don't disagree with that, never had, never would, but that wasn't my point was it? The one you keep glossing over or failing to reply to.

The reason you wrote it (on an anti "lockdown" thread) was from a point of view of "we have no problem now", "we don't need to keep current restrictions", and I was trying to get you to look ahead at what could happen.

So I asked:
There was in March 20, and in August 20 too, but there wasn't in April - May 20 or October 20 to March 21.
It's not where we are, it's where we could be heading.

So, if you could go back in time, would you have posted that comment in March 20 or August 20? Knowing what came in April - May 20 or October 20 to March 21? I trust your stance hasn't changed much.

Nice to see you're now acknowledging the dashboard, good for you (y) Maybe you should listen to the people on Twitter who maintain it.
Will you acknowledge ONS too and the excess deaths in April 20, May 20, December 21, Jan 21? The "anti lockdown" stance caused a massive chunk of it, I'd rather it didn't happen again.
 
We did make India red on April 23rd, it was too late of course and there was rush of people who came in just thinking of themselves and some brought in Delta. Generally into communities of unvaccinated in April.

I believe in general our vaccines can deal with Delta and and said we have one of the highest vaccinated adult populations in the world, so it will not spread like in 2020 and early 2021. If it does our vaccines are no good.

When people talk about our hospitals - what about all the extra Nighting gale capacity?
 
Redwurzel said:
We did make India red on April 23rd, it was too late of course and there was rush of people who came in just thinking of themselves and some brought in Delta. Generally into communities of unvaccinated in April.

I believe in general our vaccines can deal with Delta and and said we have one of the highest vaccinated adult populations in the world, so it will not spread like in 2020 and early 2021. If it does our vaccines are no good.

When people talk about our hospitals - what about all the extra Nighting gale capacity?
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Do we have one of the highest vaccine populations in the world? Both doses?
 
Redwurzel said:
We did make India red on April 23rd, it was too late of course and there was rush of people who came in just thinking of themselves and some brought in Delta. Generally into communities of unvaccinated in April.

I believe in general our vaccines can deal with Delta and and said we have one of the highest vaccinated adult populations in the world, so it will not spread like in 2020 and early 2021. If it does our vaccines are no good.

When people talk about our hospitals - what about all the extra Nighting gale capacity?
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Thing is, even when it was red we still had loads of flights coming in, and the personnel were mixing with others in the terminal, stood in massive queues. The damage was already done, but we still kept adding more.

Our vaccines definitely can, when enough get it and have had enough time after the second dose to build up full immunity, especially with AZ. With Pfizer the second dose is slightly less important as it gives more 1-jab protection than AZ, and is mainly being given to those with much better immune systems.

Nightingales were a Tory con, we never had the staff to man them, especially as we were holding up a big Brexit sign telling the foreign doctors and nurses that we "had no room" for immigration.
 
Yes - I think its nearly 60% of adults, more importantly its over 90% in vulnerable groups.

Worldwide I think the average is less than 5%

Also there are unvaccinated with antibodies - quite a few in the UK possibly another 4% of general pop.

I think what is happening now are people are a bit traumatised by the last 15 months and they tend to believe to think the worse.
 
Redwurzel said:
Yes - I think its nearly 60% of adults, more importantly its over 90% in vulnerable groups.

Worldwide I think the average is less than 5%

Also there are unvaccinated with antibodies - quite a few in the UK possibly another 4% of general pop.

I think what is happening now are people are a bit traumatised by the last 15 months and they tend to believe to think the worse.
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44 and a half percent.
 
the_smog_chorus said:
So are you saying if Texas had the “delta“ variant it would be a different story?
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Could well be. The US has severe restrictions on entry from both India and the UK and the current incidence of the variant is very low. Remains to be seen what will happen.
 
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