What should we do with the NHS?

Cambsred said:
Imagine the NHS having to provide private NHS insurance to all the staff. They cant even get a reasonable pay rise.
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and yet they are needing to take time off because they a
sherlock1969 said:
Yes and the answer to that is for the government to fund it properly.

Not having a go at you directly, but the Tories are relying on people like you 'coming around' to this way of thinking.

Yes, there are other methods of healthcare as we can see across Europe. Some are very good. None are what the Tories would introduce. They want an entirely insurance based system to make profit, which would be disastrous for the country.
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No offence taken. I have experienced the alternatives that were very good. I am very aware that it is underfunded and needs huge investment but where is that going to come from? - from the public - many on minimum wage - we could say that people who can afford it should pay more tax for it - which goes back to my original statement.
 
sherlock1969 said:
What if you are employed but can't afford it? What if you are employed but have two or three things happen quickly? What if you avoid having something checked due to cost and then it becomes more serious, so more expensive? What happens in an insurance based system when insurers won't cover pre-existing conditions?

No, no, no!!!!
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As I said earlier. people who are unemployed, on minimum wage or elderly should not pay.
 
Let's go the whole hog and make the police, courts, schools, pensions etc means tested. They are all struggling.

You only get a bobby round if you are low paid or you pay for your own militia.
schooling you only get the chance to send your kids if you don't have a well paid job.
Pensions, if you've saved for one you don;t get a state one.

Sure that will all improve productivity and the number of people going to work.
 
It is really grimm to see that people are actually falling for this tory narrative of the NHS needing to be privatised.

It was just like this before Labour took over in 1997 and got the NHS back on its feet.

The NHS can be rescued again, as long as people are not so stupid as to vote for the tories (or abstain which amounts to the same thing).
 
Dybuk said:
Let's go the whole hog and make the police, courts, schools, pensions etc means tested. They are all struggling.

You only get a bobby round if you are low paid or you pay for your own militia.
schooling you only get the chance to send your kids if you don't have a well paid job.
Pensions, if you've saved for one you don;t get a state one.

Sure that will all improve productivity and the number of people going to work.
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So the question is: 'What should we do with the NHS?'

I would fund it properly. I would recruit more doctors and nurses. I would pay them properly. I would contract in for newly qualified staff that they had to work for the NHS for so long before going into the private sector. I would try other tricks to dissuade staff from going into the private sector. I would tax the private sector more to cover some of the NHS costs with staff leaving. I would tax investments / dividends to pay for some of this. End non dom status etc.
 
Colgates_shaving_foam said:
It is really grimm to see that people are actually falling for this tory narrative of the NHS needing to be privatised.

It was just like this before Labour took over in 1997 and got the NHS back on its feet.

The NHS can be rescued again, as long as people are not so stupid as to vote for the tories (or abstain which amounts to the same thing).
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haha - I'm not falling for "this Tory narrative" - I'm simply asking for new ideas.
 
One thing that has always annoyed me is NHS doing private work. It makes them a bit of income above their commissioned contract but the rates they charge are practically loss making. Private work should be charged at 10x NHS tariff. No wonder people pay to go private when it is so cheap. If Drs want to set up private treatment centres and charge people those cheap prices then that is up to them but the NHS should never be offering its capacity when there is a waiting list and they should be required to do a percentage of NHS work as a condition for being allowed to practice which will prevent them from going 100% private. Same goes for dentists etc. There should also be huge recharged costs to the private businesses if any emergency/remedial work is needed because of the private work they have had.
 
Genuinely amazing people contorting themselves to avoid facing the actual reality of the situation.

"Let's try and understand why this bank got robbed - no, no, ignore that fella in the stripy top with all your money. We need solutions, our money is missing!"
 
Wiseman_Vaughn said:
and yet they are needing to take time off because they a

No offence taken. I have experienced the alternatives that were very good. I am very aware that it is underfunded and needs huge investment but where is that going to come from? - from the public - many on minimum wage - we could say that people who can afford it should pay more tax for it - which goes back to my original statement.
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People who get paid more already pay more tax.
 
Wiseman_Vaughn said:
Nurses and doctors are overworked and underpaid.
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How does private access to services help with this?

Surely banning private health-care would free up a whole host of medical staff who could then sort out the backlog in the NHS?

That would be a much better solution than forcing everyone to go private and take out insurance.

Unless of course it's not as simple as all that after all...
 
Unravel_Morrison said:
As I said before; a properly healthy, productive workforce pays for itself.
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It does more than, it pays for others too such as pensioners.

Unfortunately a lot of pensioners (and others) voted to get a rid of a lot our young healthy productive workforce because they spoke with funny accents and posh boys in suits told everyone they were the reason they couldn't get a GP appointment.
 
Whilst tory policies, 12 years underfunding, brexit and removing nursing bursaries etc, have caused this to come to head. We as a country need to decide we want western european quality services, including health and social care, but we only want to pay american levels of tax. Quality services cost money and we pay less on the whole than pretty much every other western european country. This problem was always going to come to a head eventually as the country as a whole ages and pressure on social and health services. The tories have just accelerated the process.
 
motownjunk said:
Whilst tory policies, 12 years underfunding, brexit and removing nursing bursaries etc, have caused this to come to head. We as a country need to decide we want western european quality services, including health and social care, but we only want to pay american levels of tax. Quality services cost money and we pay less on the whole than pretty much every other western european country. This problem was always going to come to a head eventually as the country as a whole ages and pressure on social and health services. The tories have just accelerated the process.
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We've already got the highest tax burden for 70 years. The problem isn't lack of tax take, the problem is what a corrupt, criminal government are doing with all of that money.
 
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