What is the actual aim this season?

I don't think progress was solely the aim. I think it was quite clear cut we were in the mix to compete for the those top two spots. It's not even Christmas and that opportunity is now long gone. That's not good enough.
 
Humpty said:
I don't think progress was solely the aim. I think it was quite clear cut we were in the mix to compete for the those top two spots. It's not even Christmas and that opportunity is now long gone. That's not good enough.
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We were never going to challenge Leeds and Burnley for top 2.
 
Humpty said:
Revisionism. The club were bullish about our prospects this season and rightly so. Our squad is as good as those three mentioned.
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We'll have to agree to disagree on that point - our overall squad value is miles away from Leeds and Burnley and a way off Blades too.
 
Of course we are trying to get to the top of the league. And the margins are small.

There are at least 3 games this season which we easily could have won on balance of chances that we lost. That would put us a point off top.

It's been close but not quite there.

I think where people on here differ is how much of a failure is it... aiming for top 2 but finishing top6 is good. Top8 disappointing but OK. Top 10 not awful for us as a club but not good enough with the squad.

Overall I'm enjoying the season.
 
Humpty said:
Funny you should say that because just last night Carrick said in his interview we're striving to be at the top of the league. Straight from the horses mouth.
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honestly - what else is he going to say? Every team is striving to be top of the league but for one reason or another, can't achieve it.
 
Ravshoutsatbeck said:
Of course we are trying to get to the top of the league. And the margins are small.

There are at least 3 games this season which we easily could have won on balance of chances that we lost. That would put us a point off top.

It's been close but not quite there.

I think where people on here differ is how much of a failure is it... aiming for top 2 but finishing top6 is good. Top8 disappointing but OK. Top 10 not awful for us as a club but not good enough with the squad.

Overall I'm enjoying the season.
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Yeah, agreed. We have been competitive with the top 6 and but for some fine margins could easily be in the top 2. We still have a chance of being up there. Of the other 7 teams in the top 8, we've played 5 away now. The only stand out hard game away now is Sheffield Utd away in February. (I think it is pretty much reversed for Sunderland)

You could say we could be doing better and I'd agree but it's so marginal. What's the alternative, rip it up and start again? No thanks.
 
A post less than half way through the season after what will be our two toughest fixtures feels like the wrong tone, particularly as said poster normally posts about bed wetting.

This isn’t bed wetting but we are on course for a top 6 finish

We’ve played a lot of the teaMs around us away from home
 
You know i'd i feel a lot better if i felt we'd done ourselves justice this season. If we'd competed towards the top of the league and fell short, very much like Sunderland. Sunderland have exceeded the sum of their parts but we haven't even been close to doing that. Our results have been sub-standard despite the pretty football.
 
We've shot ourselves in the foot too many times this season to be thinking of any higher than 4th but we have played a lot of the teams around us away from home, leaving a number of useful home games for us.

Millwall
Burnley
Sheff Wed
West Brom
Sunderland
Watford
Leeds
Norwich
 
Wiseman_Vaughn said:
Progress would be a place in the play-offs and at the end of the day, that's all you can ask for. (I would fancy us against anyone in the division if it came to that).
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Completely disagree. We were good enough for the autos two years ago but had given the league a huge head start. Last year we had a bad start and a bad injury crisis so we couldn't expect to maintain the previous season's performances. This season we spent big, kept all of our best players and were 100% expecting to be one of the auto contenders. Having a chance of finishing 6th is in no way progress. That's basically where we've been for the last 8 years and none of those seasons resulted in promotion. Yes, it's better than last season but only because of mitigating circumstances. Being as good as Sunderland is not an achievement.

These fine margins that could have miraculously got us 9 extra points aren't fine margins. We've lost games we should have won because we've not been good enough. Do people not think that the teams above us have had similar results as well? Burnley drew with Oxford, Preston, Hull and QPR but if they'd won them they'd be 15 points ahead of us. Every team has a string of results that they "should have won". Good teams win those games.
 
Ravshoutsatbeck said:
Of course we are trying to get to the top of the league. And the margins are small.

There are at least 3 games this season which we easily could have won on balance of chances that we lost. That would put us a point off top.

It's been close but not quite there.

I think where people on here differ is how much of a failure is it... aiming for top 2 but finishing top6 is good. Top8 disappointing but OK. Top 10 not awful for us as a club but not good enough with the squad.

Overall I'm enjoying the season.
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Not finishing in the top 6 would be failure, it wouldn't be okay at all.

The club, management, squad and players are all targeting this season as the one to really try for promotion.

If we miss out on the play-offs entirely, it's been a bad season, no ifs or buts about it.
 
I always tend to see what the bookies make of us, as they have zero bias, whereas fans will always have an element of biasness in their thoughts.

At the moment, we are the 3rd/4th favourites (along with Burnley) to clinch promotion and we're in December (Leeds are way ahead and then Sheff Utd are just above us in the betting). I think we are on course to reach our expected position, which is 3rd/4th, with this squad.

Leeds have by far the best squad and arguably the best manager (his record in this division is sensational tbf).
Then after Leeds, Sheff Utd/Burnley have strong squads which is massively helped with the parachute payments.

After those 3, then our squad is as good as anyone else IMO....and the bookies seem to agree.

We have chalked off 2 of probably the 3 hardest away games in the league over the last 2 matches. Sheff Utd away is probably our toughest game of the season away from home remaining.

We have Sunderland, Leeds, Burnley, Watford & West Brom all to face at home (5 of the top 7 - basically only Sheff Utd away out of the top 7 which includes us).

I am very optimistic we will finish in the top 6.

But I am very pessimistic of our chances of finishing in the top 2.

I think before a ball was kicked, top 6 was the aim, with an outside chance of top 2. I think top 2 has now sailed as we would have to go at a rate of probably 2.2pts per game - which based on our consistency (or lack of consistency) will prove to be difficult. We have lost 7 games already this season and there's only Sheff Wed in the top 12 have lost more.
 
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Ravshoutsatbeck said:
Our aim currently is:

- Always to be in the top 10
- discover and develop players that will make a profit to keep us sustainable
- top 2 if everything falls right
- be competitive for the playoffs most years.

Think we are within those targets.
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Exactly this. I think people who are EXPECTING the top 2 are a bit unrealistic.

Boro are now a Championship side. We are a long way off where the Premier League regulars are. But I think Gibson expects us to have a fighting chance of going up for a season or two and getting the money back in. In that respect he will expect us to be finishing in the top 6 most years.

Autos if the stars align, play offs most of their time, the odd blip but still in the top 10, never flirting with relegation.

Also make a few quid off players we have developed, and maybe the sale of our manager.

Carrick isn’t getting sacked. Even if he was who are we getting in? The last few have been disasters.

Our fans are weird - Karanka got us promoted and then less than a year later some were calling for his head. One season in the top flight is a bonus, 2 a miracle.
 
Nano said:
Completely disagree. We were good enough for the autos two years ago but had given the league a huge head start. Last year we had a bad start and a bad injury crisis so we couldn't expect to maintain the previous season's performances. This season we spent big, kept all of our best players and were 100% expecting to be one of the auto contenders. Having a chance of finishing 6th is in no way progress. That's basically where we've been for the last 8 years and none of those seasons resulted in promotion. Yes, it's better than last season but only because of mitigating circumstances. Being as good as Sunderland is not an achievement.

These fine margins that could have miraculously got us 9 extra points aren't fine margins. We've lost games we should have won because we've not been good enough. Do people not think that the teams above us have had similar results as well? Burnley drew with Oxford, Preston, Hull and QPR but if they'd won them they'd be 15 points ahead of us. Every team has a string of results that they "should have won". Good teams win those games.
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Far too simplistic for me to say 'good teams win those games'. Every team at the top will have a load of games they could have won and could have lost. The top 6 could easily look a lot different. Question is have we competed and looked like we could win, and yes we have in pretty much every game (bar Coventry where we had a red card). Let's see where we are at the end of the season and then we can judge imo.
 
Marvanelli said:
I always tend to see what the bookies make of us, as they have zero bias, whereas fans will always have an element of biasness in their thoughts.

At the moment, we are the 3rd/4th favourites (along with Burnley) to clinch promotion and we're in December (Leeds are way ahead and then Sheff Utd are just above us in the betting). I think we are on course to reach our expected position, which is 3rd/4th, with this squad.

Leeds have by far the best squad and arguably the best manager (his record in this division is sensational tbf).
Then after Leeds, Sheff Utd/Burnley have strong squads which is massively helped with the parachute payments.

After those 3, then our squad is as good as anyone else IMO....and the bookies seem to agree.

We have chalked off 2 of probably the 3 hardest away games in the league over the last 2 matches. Sheff Utd away is probably our toughest game of the season away from home remaining.

We have Sunderland, Leeds, Burnley, Watford & West Brom all to face at home (5 of the top 7 - basically only Sheff Utd away out of the top 7 which includes us).

I am very optimistic we will finish in the top 6.

But I am very pessimistic of our chances of finishing in the top 2.

I think before a ball was kicked, top 6 was the aim, with an outside chance of top 2. I think top 2 had now sailed as we would have to go at a rate of probably 2.2pts per game - which based on our consistency (or lack of consistency) will prove to be difficult. We have lost 7 games already this season and there's only Sheff Wed in the top 12 have lost more.
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The bookies had us 2nd favourites for promotion at the start of the season. I think that speaks volumes about how much we've under achieved.
 
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