Violence in Leicester

Wary of making any comment on this, as such a sensitive and potentially invidious subject. But I know Leicester very well and there are socio-economic factors, as well as religious, driving these disturbances. It is a generalisation, but largely correct, that the Hindu and Sikh communities have integrated better than the Muslim ones and have been much more successful in migrating from the inner city to the more prosperous middle class suburbs and villages. The Hindu people have, on the whole, been there a generation longer than most of the Muslim community, but there is little sign of a parallel progression.
That said, the violence seems, according to people there, to have been initiated by BJP extremists, hence the protests from the Muslims.
 
Not much information out there, but from what I can gather the majority of the arrests seem to be of Indians here on student visas

It's a shame to see because Indians and Pakistanis have lived in harmony for decades in Leicester, London, Manchester, Birmingham etc.

There's no room for religious hatred, violence in this country and let it be known that any discrimination and fascism will not be tolerated. I hope we come down hard and if need be visas, sponsorships are revoked
 
The Ruthsayer said:
Wary of making any comment on this, as such a sensitive and potentially invidious subject. But I know Leicester very well and there are socio-economic factors, as well as religious, driving these disturbances. It is a generalisation, but largely correct, that the Hindu and Sikh communities have integrated better than the Muslim ones and have been much more successful in migrating from the inner city to the more prosperous middle class suburbs and villages. The Hindu people have, on the whole, been there a generation longer than most of the Muslim community, but there is little sign of a parallel progression.
That said, the violence seems, according to people there, to have been initiated by BJP extremists, hence the protests from the Muslims.
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Probably true that Hindu and Sikh (Indian) communities are more prosperous and numerous than the Muslim community (assuming you're referring to the Pakistanis) in Leicester, but not sure how that relates to this incident.
In terms of integration, how is this measured? I mean we have communities like the Jewish community in Gateshead, Prestwich which have been here centuries yet it could be said that they have shown limited integration - have their own emergency services, banking systems and so forth yet are considered very much successful and British. Again, not sure how it relates to this incident but just a thought

Hope all this hostility can be put to bed and the police force be put to better use!
 
Zain said:
Probably true that Hindu and Sikh (Indian) communities are more prosperous and numerous than the Muslim community (assuming you're referring to the Pakistanis) in Leicester, but not sure how that relates to this incident.
In terms of integration, how is this measured? I mean we have communities like the Jewish community in Gateshead, Prestwich which have been here centuries yet it could be said that they have shown limited integration - have their own emergency services, banking systems and so forth yet are considered very much successful and British. Again, not sure how it relates to this incident but just a thought

Hope all this hostility can be put to bed and the police force be put to better use!
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Zain, I think the lack of integration with the indigenous population restricts opportunity for the minority group. This is the case for both ethnic and religious (often both) minorities. This does engender both alienation and frustration, which I believe will manifest itself in violent protest; hence how this point directly relates to Leicester.
We have sufficient empirical data through the National Census to assess how successful certain ethnic groups have been in re-locating to middle-class housing and also in filling the traditional professional roles or establishing successful businesses.
The Jewish community is a special case. Lacking a homeland until 1948, and often the victims of religious persecution I'm guessing that they were highly adept at being self-sufficient. And finally, I hope I did not give the impression that the Muslims were any less 'British' than their Hindu/Jain/Sikh counterparts; that was certainly not my intention.
 
The Ruthsayer said:
Zain, I think the lack of integration with the indigenous population restricts opportunity for the minority group. This is the case for both ethnic and religious (often both) minorities. This does engender both alienation and frustration, which I believe will manifest itself in violent protest; hence how this point directly relates to Leicester.
We have sufficient empirical data through the National Census to assess how successful certain ethnic groups have been in re-locating to middle-class housing and also in filling the traditional professional roles or establishing successful businesses.
The Jewish community is a special case. Lacking a homeland until 1948, and often the victims of religious persecution I'm guessing that they were highly adept at being self-sufficient. And finally, I hope I did not give the impression that the Muslims were any less 'British' than their Hindu/Jain/Sikh counterparts; that was certainly not my intention.
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"Lack of integration with the indigenous population.." (?).
Bollax.
You havent the faintest clue what you are talking about.
As for Leicester - there is nothing you can tell me I dont already know.
 
Would you like to expand on your comment Roofie? Do you believe that there is full integration, or that the absence of such does not restrict economic opportunities? I expect a reasoned discussion from you, so your unsupported assertion is a little out of character.
Would you care to explain why I am wrong here?
 
Quite a few people pointing at increasing RSS activity in Leicester as a possible cause. This is a right wing Hindu group that regards all of the semitic religions (Christian, Islam, and Judaism) as second rate religions.
 
BlindBoyGrunt said:
Quite a few people pointing at increasing RSS activity in Leicester as a possible cause. This is a right wing Hindu group that regards all of the semitic religions (Christian, Islam, and Judaism) as second rate religions.
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Which is the point I made in my first post.
As I said above, limited economic potential will increase the level of protests by certain elements of the Muslim community.
 
r00fie1 said:
"Lack of integration with the indigenous population.." (?).
Bollax.
You havent the faintest clue what you are talking about.
As for Leicester - there is nothing you can tell me I dont already know.
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And in your tone, how the fcuk do you know I don’t know what I’m talking about? You know nothing of my history and interaction with Asian groups in Leicester. I’m know a great deal more than you do about this chum.
 
The Ruthsayer said:
Would you like to expand on your comment Roofie? Do you believe that there is full integration, or that the absence of such does not restrict economic opportunities? I expect a reasoned discussion from you, so your unsupported assertion is a little out of character.
Would you care to explain why I am wrong here?
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This isnt about integration - its about the Hindutva - a racist right-wing Hindu - Nationalist organisation stiring up hatred and sectarian division.
Its no different to Britains First or the EDL deliberately provoking a situation to instigate violence and disorder.
The Cricket Match cited was merely a vehicle for the Hindutva extremists to pin their banner and organise deliberate unrest and violence.
Its not just an issue in Leicester, but has been on the increase since the Nationalist BJP under Prime Minister Narendra Modi came to power in 2014.
Modi is a member and supporter of the Rashtriya Swayamsevak Sang [RSS] - which has a paramilitary wing.
Modi`s outpourings and support for Hindu Nationalism has given license to like minded extremists to conduct his vile religious war.

 
r00fie1 said:
This isnt about integration - its about the Hindutva - a racist right-wing Hindu - Nationalist organisation stiring up hatred and sectarian division.
Its no different to Britains First or the EDL deliberately provoking a situation to instigate violence and disorder.
The Cricket Match cited was merely a vehicle for the Hindutva extremists to pin their banner and organise deliberate unrest and violence.
Its not just an issue in Leicester, but has been on the increase since the Nationalist BJP under Prime Minister Narendra Modi came to power in 2014.
Modi is a member and supporter of the Rashtriya Swayamsevak Sang [RSS] - which has a paramilitary wing.
Modi`s outpourings and support for Hindu Nationalism has given license to like minded extremists to conduct his vile religious war.
Click to expand...
I don’t disagree at all. Talking to friends I have on both sides of this divide, both state that the protagonists are Hindu. I did make this point, as above. But I also believe, unless things have changed dramatically in the last 10 years, that insularity, whether through choice or coercion, affects the response of minority groups.
 
The Ruthsayer said:
Which is the point I made in my first post.
As I said above, limited economic potential will increase the level of protests by certain elements of the Muslim community.
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Its not "certain elements of the Muslim Community".
Its a tiny minority of Racist Hindu Nationalists - given license by Narendra Modi - who are provoking the small Muslim community - marching through the middle of those areas known to have a concentrated Muslim population and Nationalist Hindu youths smashing shops and causing damage.
Its no different to when the National Front tried to march through Southall all those years ago - or Lewisham. They were sent away with a flea in their ear.
The far right - will use this to fuel their own racist agenda.
 
The Ruthsayer said:
I don’t disagree at all. Talking to friends I have on both sides of this divide, both state that the protagonists are Hindu. I did make this point, as above. But I also believe, unless things have changed dramatically in the last 10 years, that insularity, whether through choice or coercion, affects the response of minority groups.
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This "divide" isnt an issue, its about right wing Hindu Nationalist Extremists deliberately goading and provoking violence and disorder.
The overwhelming majority of the population in Leicester get on well - whether its the Black Community around Highfields, the Muslim Community around Melbourne Road and Humberstone, or the Hindu population centred along Melton Road and other parts of the city. Im certain those who attend the Shree Mandir Temple, the Medina Mosque and the Gurdwara on East Park Road, will all be as horrified at the trouble caused by a few extremists in the City.
 
The Ruthsayer said:
And in your tone, how the fcuk do you know I don’t know what I’m talking about? You know nothing of my history and interaction with Asian groups in Leicester. I’m know a great deal more than you do about this chum.
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Just by your inference that it is the Muslim community.
Im not criticising what you know.
Your "interaction" is nothing to do with it.
As for who knows "more" - its not a competition.
Its what you said which I`m concerned about.
 
r00fie1 said:
Just by your inference that it is the Muslim community.
Im not criticising what you know.
Your "interaction" is nothing to do with it.
As for who knows "more" - its not a competition.
Its what you said which I`m concerned about.
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Noted. I should have made it clearer where the genesis of this dispute lay. I hope I did not imply otherwise.
 
The Ruthsayer said:
Noted. I should have made it clearer where the genesis of this dispute lay. I hope I did not imply otherwise.
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Fair comment(y)
Apologies for flying off the handle, but its an issue which hits a raw nerve.
I too know the area intimately.
 
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r00fie1 said:
This isnt about integration - its about the Hindutva - a racist right-wing Hindu - Nationalist organisation stiring up hatred and sectarian division.
Its no different to Britains First or the EDL deliberately provoking a situation to instigate violence and disorder.
The Cricket Match cited was merely a vehicle for the Hindutva extremists to pin their banner and organise deliberate unrest and violence.
Its not just an issue in Leicester, but has been on the increase since the Nationalist BJP under Prime Minister Narendra Modi came to power in 2014.
Modi is a member and supporter of the Rashtriya Swayamsevak Sang [RSS] - which has a paramilitary wing.
Modi`s outpourings and support for Hindu Nationalism has given license to like minded extremists to conduct his vile religious war.
Click to expand...
Very interesting response. I learned lots.
 
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