VAR Jimmy Hill 1982 World Cup

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TeessideCleveland

Well-known member
Before the Spain-Northern Ireland game - after Spain had been given a disputed penalty in both their previous games in the 'Home' World Cup - Jimmy Hill suggested video technology could be used to let referees review contentious decisions
'I wonder when that will be brought in...'

Lawrie McMenemy said 'It will never work'

Well it was brought in for the 2018 World Cup - Jimmy Hill having died near the end of 2015

I wonder what he would have thought of how it has panned out so far

I'm a supporter of VAR, but not the inconsistent way it is being used
Hopefully it will improve over time
 
TeessideCleveland said:
Before the Spain-Northern Ireland game - after Spain had been given a disputed penalty in both their previous games in the 'Home' World Cup - Jimmy Hill suggested video technology could be used to let referees review contentious decisions
'I wonder when that will be brought in...'

Lawrie McMenemy said 'It will never work'

Well it was brought in for the 2018 World Cup - Jimmy Hill having died near the end of 2015

I wonder what he would have thought of how it has panned out so far

I'm a supporter of VAR, but not the inconsistent way it is being used
Hopefully it will improve over time
Click to expand...
It doesn’t work when things are subjective, and where replays don’t reduce the level of subjectivity.

It (could) work for offsides but the offside rule will probably need to be changed to make it work effectively.
 
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I think it's a myth that it works for offsides. For a player to be deemed to be a matter of centimetres offside you need to ascertain the millionth of a second the ball left the boot of the assisting player which for me makes those decisions completely subjective.
For me VAR is pretty much the same as the recently proposed super league. Hated by the vast majority of fans, players, pundits and journalists but desperately wanted by an influential few.
 
It ruins the flow of the game for me. Goaline technology was the only thing the game needed, and that works perfectly with no subjectivity because human thinking and decision-making has been taken out of the loop. With VAR you can't really do that, its still down to a humans thinking and guessing, a prime example has as been mentioned above regarding offsides; how can a human ascertain the millionth of a second that a ball left the boot in an offside call? They can't. They're guessing.

They can draw as many lines as the like on their computer screen, but until the computer takes over 100% and is programmed to make a pixel perfect decision that's 100% consistent with every similar incident, VAR is just another guessing game, but taken to the next level. May as well left it down to the linesmen and refs in the first place. at least the flow of the game would have been untouched, and players and fans could celebrate a goal or hurl abuse at the ref for disallowing it, without having to wait 5 minutes for some nameless and faceless guy in a box 100 miles away to give us the thumbs up or down - based on his interpretation..
 
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Whether it's beneficial to use VAR for fractional offsides is a moot point. What is undeniable is that it does remove clear and obvious errors, where someone is flagged offside when clearly onside, or not flagged when clearly offside. Fans - especially Boro fans - are constantly moaning about refereeing standards, so surely VAR is the obvious way forward. Or - if you don't want to wait on a VAR decision, just accept that there will be some errors made by refs and linesmen. The other factor that needs to be considered is players diving and playacting. That really needs to be eradicated to move forward in a world without VAR.
 
Or just have extra linesmen at both sides of the pitch and on the goal line. 2 linesmen for each half.
 
atypical_boro said:
It doesn’t work when things are subjective, and where replays don’t reduce the level of subjectivity.
Click to expand...
I like the NFL option of 3 results when going to VR,
"The ruling on the field ...
... is Confirmed" - video shows the refs got it right
... is Overturned" - video shows the refs got it wrong
... Stands" - video evidence is inconclusive, so we assume they got it right
 
newusername said:
I like the NFL option of 3 results when going to VR,
"The ruling on the field ...
... is Confirmed" - video shows the refs got it right
... is Overturned" - video shows the refs got it wrong
... Stands" - video evidence is inconclusive, so we assume they got it right
Click to expand...
Better than what we have now, but it would be nice if we didn't have so many of the stoppages.
 
It needs to be challenge based, game proceeds as normal, if a decision is made that the captain/coach disagrees with or believes to be erroneous they have one/two challenges to use (get it wrong lose it). If the objective is to remove "clear and obvious errors" this surely is the way to go?
 
Players initiating contact, or falling before contact is made to obtain a penalty is another cancer that needs eradicating. Zaha example on Tuesday as a prime example.

Pundits saying he’s earned the right to go down drive me mad. It is a contact sport, contact does not mean a foul. That’s what VAR should be for as well, to allow referees to say “sorry Wilf, you were clever in placing your leg there so it looked a foil at full pelt, but on review you‘ ve put your leg in an unnatural position in order to initiate contact that would not have occurred with your natural body position.“

You can have unnatural body positions for handball so why not for “fouls” as well.
 
Soutra said:
What is undeniable is that it does remove clear and obvious errors, where someone is flagged offside when clearly onside, or not flagged when clearly offside
Click to expand...
That is categorically not undeniable.

There are still people being flagged offside when they're not. It just happens further up the pitch and doesn't tend to get many (if any) replays or discussion.

I think it was Monreal while at Arsenal who broke from his own half and was clear on goal only to be flagged offside when he wasn't. I've seen a few others (and mentioned them on the board once or twice...). Once the game stops VAR isn't used to check and then set everyone off from the same positions if the call is wrong. As such you end up with even fairly obvious offsides not being flagged. At some point someone will be seriously injured when the game should have stopped.

The use of the word "clearly" is doing a lot of work there, too.

All VAR does is shift the point of contention. It has been an epic failure that is still being pushed despite being a prime example of Emperor's New Clothes.

Bin it. Then bin the bin it was binned in.
 
Scrote said:
That is categorically not undeniable.

There are still people being flagged offside when they're not. It just happens further up the pitch and doesn't tend to get many (if any) replays or discussion.

I think it was Monreal while at Arsenal who broke from his own half and was clear on goal only to be flagged offside when he wasn't. I've seen a few others (and mentioned them on the board once or twice...). Once the game stops VAR isn't used to check and then set everyone off from the same positions if the call is wrong. As such you end up with even fairly obvious offsides not being flagged. At some point someone will be seriously injured when the game should have stopped.

The use of the word "clearly" is doing a lot of work there, too.

All VAR does is shift the point of contention. It has been an epic failure that is still being pushed despite being a prime example of Emperor's New Clothes.

Bin it. Then bin the bin it was binned in.
Click to expand...
Why not eliminate offside entirely from the halfway line to a line drawn right across the top of the penalty area? That would reduce the number of errors being made.
 
Soutra said:
Why not eliminate offside entirely from the halfway line to a line drawn right across the top of the penalty area? That would reduce the number of errors being made.
Click to expand...
A bit like the Subbuteo pitch 😀. Although to be fair that was to prevent 120 yard goals from near your own corner flag.

Like NASL in the 70s then.

b***ks to this armpit nonsense. Make it 2 appeals per team like in cricket, stuff them up in the first 5 mins it’s tough.
 
Trug said:
Or just have extra linesmen at both sides of the pitch and on the goal line. 2 linesmen for each half.
Click to expand...
Couple of years ago I went to a few non league games, and stood on the touch line. To my surprise the refs and linos wore mics and headphones, and the linos worked in tandem by saying ”now” as the ball was played forward, which meant the other Lino could watch the players. Worked incredibly well, players happy with majority of decisions.

The current nonsense where a stray testicle can make you offside but an arm can’t is ridiculous. Clear and obvious is the issue, you don’t get many of those in a typical game - but make it balanced so that players playing for the foul (as mentioned above) also have decisions overturned.
 
Scrote said:
That is categorically not undeniable.

There are still people being flagged offside when they're not. It just happens further up the pitch and doesn't tend to get many (if any) replays or discussion.

I think it was Monreal while at Arsenal who broke from his own half and was clear on goal only to be flagged offside when he wasn't. I've seen a few others (and mentioned them on the board once or twice...). Once the game stops VAR isn't used to check and then set everyone off from the same positions if the call is wrong. As such you end up with even fairly obvious offsides not being flagged. At some point someone will be seriously injured when the game should have stopped.

The use of the word "clearly" is doing a lot of work there, too.

All VAR does is shift the point of contention. It has been an epic failure that is still being pushed despite being a prime example of Emperor's New Clothes.

Bin it. Then bin the bin it was binned in.
Click to expand...


This. With bells on.👍👍👍👍👍👍👍
 
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