SmallTown
Well-known member
it’s interesting you think that paying the minimum wage is “slave labour”. If only we had some form of government that could address this...
The National Farmers' Union (NFU) said they need up to 70,000 fruit and vegetable pickers
- Thread starter Johnny Vincents Motorbike
- Start date
it’s interesting you think that paying the minimum wage is “slave labour”. If only we had some form of government that could address this...
1finny
Well-known member
The economics are pretty simple though, I suspect.
British growers produce at a price that makes them competitive. They can currently get labour (at least in the short term) so its kind of ok.
A couple of options going forward
They significantly increase wages to attract UK workers (don’t forget, btw, up until recently there wasn’t much of a labour pool). Which puts costs up.... makes them uncompetitive and they go out of business.
The government helps by keeping routes to cheaper labour open.
Is it a government issue? Probably not its plain economics but - they have promised farmer’s help in the new world and they got votes on the back of that.
British growers produce at a price that makes them competitive. They can currently get labour (at least in the short term) so its kind of ok.
A couple of options going forward
They significantly increase wages to attract UK workers (don’t forget, btw, up until recently there wasn’t much of a labour pool). Which puts costs up.... makes them uncompetitive and they go out of business.
The government helps by keeping routes to cheaper labour open.
Is it a government issue? Probably not its plain economics but - they have promised farmer’s help in the new world and they got votes on the back of that.
ticker_tape
Well-known member
I think it was more, "not ask what your country can do for you but what you can do for your country"
People were leaping to get the plaudits for enrolling in NHS help, but id have thought those great patriots would have held dear to one Brexits major barriers, the influx of foreign workers and helped the farmers foc.
Doesnt seem to get the medals helping pick fruit to feed hungry britons
People were leaping to get the plaudits for enrolling in NHS help, but id have thought those great patriots would have held dear to one Brexits major barriers, the influx of foreign workers and helped the farmers foc.
Doesnt seem to get the medals helping pick fruit to feed hungry britons
boromike85
Well-known member
None if your arguments are strengthened because you don't have any other than Boo Brexit. They have said farmers will still receive help to make up for any EU subsidies they lose. It's not so they can continue to exploit workers.
What is it about cheap foreign labour living 6 to a shipping container for a fee while receiving minimum wage that you think is positive?
Erimus74
Well-known member
Yes Ticker & let's not clap the NHS staff who voted for Brexit, that'll fit in with your logic
SmallTown
Well-known member
What is it about not being able to get fresh fruit that you think is positive then?
C
Cooper671
Guest
Talk about avoiding the question!
He’s already told you. Farmers can start preparing for next year now. They have had 3 years already. Instead they are sat twiddling their thumbs and using cheap foreign labour. Then January will come they will cry foul stating their is no one to pick the fruit as they haven’t bothered to put anything in place and you will come along blaming Brexit. Failing to prepare is preparing to fail which is what they are doing and you support it so you can continue with your rabid obsession with Brexit blame. If their is no one to pick the fruit because farmers haven’t bothered to recruit them they are the ones to blame.
Queue oh look not blaming the government typical response but that’s the reality
He’s already told you. Farmers can start preparing for next year now. They have had 3 years already. Instead they are sat twiddling their thumbs and using cheap foreign labour. Then January will come they will cry foul stating their is no one to pick the fruit as they haven’t bothered to put anything in place and you will come along blaming Brexit. Failing to prepare is preparing to fail which is what they are doing and you support it so you can continue with your rabid obsession with Brexit blame. If their is no one to pick the fruit because farmers haven’t bothered to recruit them they are the ones to blame.
Queue oh look not blaming the government typical response but that’s the reality
ticker_tape
Well-known member
If you work for the NHS and voted Tory or Brexit you vote for work mates to be kicked out. The wife has nursed all her life and wouldnt dream of it.
SmallTown
Well-known member
I think you've lost it a bit here. Whether it's farmers, the government, whatever, to blame it sounds like you accept there will be a disruption to the food supply in January. I hardly believe I have to spell it out to you but that disruption wouldn't have happened without brexit
Erimus74
Well-known member
But many have so I ask you again, do you just clap for the ones who didnt vote Brexit?
ticker_tape
Well-known member
Why arent you picking fruit?
C
Cooper671
Guest
Clearly you have lost it as I have not said that at all. I have said farmers can put plans in place now to avoid the situation but instead they are choosing not to and they will cry foul come January and you’ll be blaming Brexit.
You are right it wouldn’t occurred if it wasn’t for Brexit. Luckily I don’t support exploitation of foreign labour like you though and the farmers should get their act together now to stop it from happening.
boromike85
Well-known member
There won't be a disruption. How blinkered can you be. If the fruit in the UK doesn't get picked because the farmers chose not to pick it (which won't happen anyway) then the supermarkets will just import it. If the farmers choose this option instead of treating workers fairly then so be it. They've made the bed themselves, they can lie in it.
I can't believe anyone would try and defend these practices although if anyone would it would be the man upset about his cleaner getting paid better.
Lefty
Well-known member
The Farmers have had 4 years to plan?
How can any business plan when they didn't know what Brexit meant before the vote and still don't know now?
The post December 2019 plan so far seems to consist of standing on an aircraft carrier with a big 'Mission Accomplished' banner on show.
How can any business plan when they didn't know what Brexit meant before the vote and still don't know now?
The post December 2019 plan so far seems to consist of standing on an aircraft carrier with a big 'Mission Accomplished' banner on show.
SmallTown
Well-known member
Will we just import it though? How are the post brexit trade deal shaping up?
To be fair I do like this charmingly naïve brexiteer response of "it'll just be OK" without being able to explain why. I kind of admire your simple ignorance, I'm almost jealous, wish I could love on nothing more than hopes and dreams.
NYboro
Well-known member
Redwurzel
Well-known member
I tend to agree with BoroMike and Cooper on this one
I have relatives from Eastern Europe and some were ripped off by British Employers through high rents and high service charges for in house accommodation. To me it was theft and greed by the British employers. I am sure its not all British employers, but they will be a number who exploit lack of English/poor English.
Near me the large fruit picking farms have built a lot of on site accommodation which they charge commercial rents for. It is also useful for them to have the workforce next to the work place. They are keen on under 25s not because they are fitter but they don't qualify for the living wage, so most are paid below £8.72/hour. Some of the farms bring in non EU workers from say Ukraine and Russia on temporary short term contracts, not sure but it may be possible to avoid paying National Insurance on those workers? Again this all makes employing UK based workers less economic.
Personally I would work picking fruit for £8.72/hour, but I don't see the job advertised at that rate and I may be subject to age discrimination.
In defence of the fruit farms they are tightly squeezed by the supermarkets who all make decent profits. The price of fruit and veg has not kept up with inflation imo.
I have relatives from Eastern Europe and some were ripped off by British Employers through high rents and high service charges for in house accommodation. To me it was theft and greed by the British employers. I am sure its not all British employers, but they will be a number who exploit lack of English/poor English.
Near me the large fruit picking farms have built a lot of on site accommodation which they charge commercial rents for. It is also useful for them to have the workforce next to the work place. They are keen on under 25s not because they are fitter but they don't qualify for the living wage, so most are paid below £8.72/hour. Some of the farms bring in non EU workers from say Ukraine and Russia on temporary short term contracts, not sure but it may be possible to avoid paying National Insurance on those workers? Again this all makes employing UK based workers less economic.
Personally I would work picking fruit for £8.72/hour, but I don't see the job advertised at that rate and I may be subject to age discrimination.
In defence of the fruit farms they are tightly squeezed by the supermarkets who all make decent profits. The price of fruit and veg has not kept up with inflation imo.
C
Cooper671
Guest
Excellent post Redwurzel. Unfortunately ST is just blinded by Brexit rage and sees it as a government issue rather than exploitation of people like your relatives. Careful NY might put a smiley on though. ST complained that his cleaning bill had gone up as the cheap labour had gone and NY doesn’t like the fact his pension has gone down in value so they are blinded by Brexit and would rather exploitation continued to benefit themselves. That’s their real issue