The Isaac Wilson up for sale

Controversial opinion - pubs were killed by the smoking ban.

20% of people in the UK smoked when it came in, let’s raise that to 40% who regularly pop down the pub. Not talking about Saturday night part timers, I’m talking about people who go out a few times a week and thus are the highest spending customers.

In fact I’m regularly in boozers where it’s closer to 70%, everyone sits outside.

… What is the point of paying a markup of 500% on off licence drinks when you don’t actually get to experience the pub, you’re just sitting outside? It’s cold, hostile, expensive, unsocial and not worth it. The actual pub itself doesn’t matter at that point, you can’t even hear the music they play.

Not saying the smoking ban wasn’t a good thing. But, choice was made to instead cater for people who will go out once a fortnight and have one vodka & tonic with their burger = death knell of the industry to make it an uncomfortable environment for a huge percentage of your regular customers.
 
Pubs around London tend to be busy most of the week still.

This suggests that the reason is down to affordability.
 
jonny_greenings_sock said:
Controversial opinion - pubs were killed by the smoking ban.

20% of people in the UK smoked when it came in, let’s raise that to 40% who regularly pop down the pub. Not talking about Saturday night part timers, I’m talking about people who go out a few times a week and thus are the highest spending customers.

In fact I’m regularly in boozers where it’s closer to 70%, everyone sits outside.

… What is the point of paying a markup of 500% on off licence drinks when you don’t actually get to experience the pub, you’re just sitting outside? It’s cold, hostile, expensive, unsocial and not worth it. The actual pub itself doesn’t matter at that point, you can’t even hear the music they play.

Not saying the smoking ban wasn’t a good thing. But, choice was made to instead cater for people who will go out once a fortnight and have one vodka & tonic with their burger = death knell of the industry to make it an uncomfortable environment for a huge percentage of your regular customers.
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I think to suggest they killed the pub industry is probably a bit far. I worked in a very busy Middlesbrough bar at the time the smoking ban was introduced in 2007.

From my recollection 40% of our regular customers didn’t smoke. I’d say It was probably closer to 15-20%. I appreciate this will vary by location. The smokers did whinge about it but they still came in every day / weekend for the football and cheap beer etc. They never left - and to this day I still bump into some of them around Middlesbrough / Stockton pubs.

When the smoking ban came into force in 2007 - which was a lot better for non-smokers. No more passive smoking, no more stinking of smoke after going into pubs or working in them. Not too long after, we had the financial crash. This had a huge impact. Not so long after Garlands closed in Middlesbrough. Garlands was a huge income flow for the likes of Walkabout etc. but their success died alongside Garlands.

When I go to bigger Cities a lot of the pubs tend to be pretty busy no matter where I go. I think there’s a number of factors at play. Generational changes, finances, people choosing healthier lifestyles and what people choose to spend their money on. Some smokers may have fell by the way side, but in general I think larger factors contribute.

In the likes of Middlesbrough there is less wealth and disposable income in comparison to bigger cities. I often tend to find you see a lot more younger professionals in those cities too, and they all seem to flood into the bars and restaurants post 5pm. We don’t have the same amount of foot fall in Middlesbrough.

We aren’t the only small town with these issues. Middlesbrough Centre itself is a problem. It’s so run down with so few places to go, I never really consider going down that end of town unless going to the match.
 
Laughing said:
Pubs around London tend to be busy most of the week still.

This suggests that the reason is down to affordability.
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Not in the part of London I lived, though the pubs in the nearest tourist area were. Again, those used by residents are closing or changing into restaurant type pubs
 
Corcaigh_the_Cat said:
Not in the part of London I lived, though the pubs in the nearest tourist area were. Again, those used by residents are closing or changing into restaurant type pubs
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Thats interesting CtC. I work in Canary Wharf and drink either there, a bad example, or we go to London bridge. Both areas are heaving on an evening.

I don't visit, what you might call, suburbian pubs, maybe you could count Camden, but that is a tourist trap due to the market anyway.
 
Laughing said:
Thats interesting CtC. I work in Canary Wharf and drink either there, a bad example, or we go to London bridge. Both areas are heaving on an evening.

I don't visit, what you might call, suburbian pubs, maybe you could count Camden, but that is a tourist trap due to the market anyway.
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I was in non touristy parts of Islington. It's amazing how many have Islington down as drandiise place to live. My first local is now a Brazilian restaurant. We moved to the Arsenal ground area and the pubs very much relied on the football club. Drinks were half price in one of them after 7 on a Saturday night, it still struggled to pull customers in. Yet pop down to Upper Street and it's thriving.

I was down there not so long ago and I was chatting to a bloke my age about the local pub scene, ge said it's all gone. They're either restaurants or real ale joints charging too much for the locals to afford, that's the older generation.
 
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