Rogers and Greenwood

Someone made the point a few posts ago that Greenwood is playing a lot of football. That is true of a fair number of our players and makes development much harder for them. It's probably worth baring that in mind when criticising our players.
 
Laughing said:
Someone made the point a few posts ago that Greenwood is playing a lot of football. That is true of a fair number of our players and makes development much harder for them. It's probably worth baring that in mind when criticising our players.
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This is probably the crux of the matter. We've had a proper upheaval this season when you combine the ins and outs with the injuries. The one constant has been the way we play though so it's only fair to accept that the new lads are still learning and adapting to the system and that the injured players will need time to get back up to speed.
For all Azaz has looked excellent for Plymouth this year, he'll still need to adapt and get used to his teammates and how they play.
I doubt we'll see the best of this squad until they've all got themselves totally dialled in to how Carrick wants them to play.
When we had those purple patches last year I think that showed how it looks when everyone is clicking.
 
I'll also admit that I was one of those wanting Carrick to change the way we play during our horrendous start and to stiffen us up defensively. He's proven to me and a lot of others that it wasn't just the players last year that got us so close, it was the framework of the way we play. I've every confidence that he'll get us up given time, the right recruitment and a bit of luck.
 
Rogers has improved leaps and bounds since the start of the season. He is going to become a massive player for us.

Greenwood on the other hand, barely gets involved in the game and anyone who claims " but he works hard " we could sign Mo Farah then could we and they would be happy because he would run around a lot and work hard.
 
Both give the impression to me that they are not players who are always 100% committed to the cause. Appreciate they are young still but giving the impression of a lack of effort isn't a good sign for the future.
 
Some rather unfair criticism of both players on here. Greenwood for example has been fit and available so has played full games when perhaps he might have been coming on for 20-30 minutes or just starting and playing 60 or even rested. Yes, he hasn't been as good as we hoped after he first got into the team but he has been fit and the "barely gets involved" and "lack of effort" tags are just plain wrong. He does put the yards in he has not been as effective as we might like but he has been on the pitch and not the treatment table.
 
I do agree and think Azaz takes Greenwoods place, however, the criticism is a bit harsh... He's had a handful of bad games where he hasn't been his best, but he had a handful before them where he was pretty good. If wages can be agreed, he's definitely worth the reported £1.5 mill in my opinion.

He's 21 - all young players go through bad spells - Rogers was getting pelters on here a couple of months ago and we can all see he's improving.
RVDB wasn't short of critics after his first couple of games either.
 
Muttley said:
Some rather unfair criticism of both players on here. Greenwood for example has been fit and available so has played full games when perhaps he might have been coming on for 20-30 minutes or just starting and playing 60 or even rested. Yes, he hasn't been as good as we hoped after he first got into the team but he has been fit and the "barely gets involved" and "lack of effort" tags are just plain wrong. He does put the yards in he has not been as effective as we might like but he has been on the pitch and not the treatment table.
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Greenwood is a loan player. You don't sign loan players to integrate slowly. You sign them to make immediate impact otherwise you might as well play your own players. Greenwood will be an expensive loan and should be judged as a 1st team player, even if he is young.

The permanent signings we have are long term development players. Greenwood should be judged the same way Archer, Ramsey, Steffen, Giles, Muniz and Mowatt were last season (and Connolly, Balogun etc the season before). Expensive loan signings from bigger teams are 1st team or they are expensive bench warmers and we can't afford them to be.
 
Rogers is improving, but needs to have the players around him. He was bought as a player with potential, a development type, and he's doing just that. Needs to continue doing what he's doing and with a couple of signings and players back from injury.......could be a big second half of the season for him.

Greenwood..... frustrating. He puts a shift in, can't question his effort. But is it fitness issues? Mental fatigue? Just seems to fade out of games. Gets subbed and you forget he's playing. Surely his place is seriously under threat from Azaz so how will he react 🤷🏻‍♂️🤷🏻‍♂️

And if a £1.5m transfer fee is pre agreed, do we gamble for what looks a bargain price??
 
Something I always wonder, do we think players are encouraged to save energy by ambling back? I’d be surprised but it really looks like it when you watch modern day football.
 
Greenwood would benefit from playing more of a central role as he doesn't really have the ability to play from the wide area, pace and trickery, yet he does have two good feet, can see a pass and doesn't mind a dig which could be an asset behind Josh or Lath, we have lots of different options which will pose themselves in the coming weeks which is good to have as we can win the ame in different ways, soon we will have, Greenwood, Rogers, forss, Jones, Azaz, lath,coburn, Crooks, mcgree and silvera available for them front 4 positions not to me thin Hackney can play in there too and that's without and additional signings, each player offers a different threat and means we have a variety of formations.

Both Greenwood and Rogers can frustrate but they are young and improving, hopefully a game or twos rest will help them push on!

Without both of there contributions this season goals and assists where would we be, each player has played a big part in getting us where we are right now in both the league and Cup so I would say that's not to bad.
 
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