Rise of the Nazis

Jostler

Jostler

Well-known member
Anyone watched it? Granted I watched it with the view of seeing if I could see any parallels with what we are seeing both in the UK/Europe and the US, so may be seeing confirmation bias, but there’s definitey parallels. Do we not learn from history?
 
Tragically, people are unable to see the parallels, the demonising of our fellow human beings. They can't make the tiny leap of imagination required. Cos...like...Jews aren't black people are they. FFS Farage even used the Nazis' poster in his brexit campaign.

In 1933, Stockton saw off the British Union of Fascists in a riot, sending one of them home minus an eye. Today many people in our area vote for them. Equally pitiful and scary.
 
I watched it a month or 2 ago with the view that I might actually learn something from it. Once I had finished it I discussed with a m8 how alarming some of the parallels are to what is going on today....its really quite scary!
 
I am definitely centrist, I see no value in right or left wing politics in their absolute. I’m a business owner, but as I see now the need for a labour government to balance the past 10 years, I’d see the need for a conservative government after x amount Of years of labour rule.

The global shift to the right is worrying and in my mind there’s a very good chance it’s has been coordinated.

Trumps Maga vs Hitlers make Germany strong again etc. The anti socialism position and getting people to take a stand against their own interests.

I really hope we don’t look back on the next 20 years as a rise in fascism we regret.
 
Sheriff_John_Bunnell_ret said:
You can see parallels with any period of human history with any other part of human history. Lots of things are very different to the world in 1939. Accessibility of information. Globalisation. The constants are the instincts which drive us.
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Back in the 30's you couldn't google something. Nowadays you can and you get a load of fake news. You have to use your judgement. It's just that there is a lot of people who aren't too bright and easily influenced.
 
KingOfTheTribes said:
Back in the 30's you couldn't google something. Nowadays you can and you get a load of fake news. You have to use your judgement. It's just that there is a lot of people who aren't too bright and easily influenced.
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We are all easily influenced and there are more sophisticated methods than ever before. The only hope we have is awareness of this and the importance of exercising our critical thinking skills.

This is slightly harder for those on the Right unfortunately, hence the sh1tshow globally of the last five years or so in particular.
 
I know this is a football forum.
But well done OP for starting this thread.
I am tired of "this is how the nazis started" mantra.
But I know we must learn from history.
Not doing so would insult those who sacrificed so much.
So keep boring and irritating us with this.
Better that than having to repeat an awful disaster.
 
'If you know what's good for your career you will "take a knee"'.

That's how it worked.

At a match in the 1930s, the England football team gave Nazi salutes before the kick-off. Did they debate it beforehand? Was there any dissent? If they did they caved in and did what they were told to keep their hosts happy.
 
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Jostler said:
I am definitely centrist, I see no value in right or left wing politics in their absolute. I’m a business owner, but as I see now the need for a labour government to balance the past 10 years, I’d see the need for a conservative government after x amount Of years of labour rule.

The global shift to the right is worrying and in my mind there’s a very good chance it’s has been coordinated.

Trumps Maga vs Hitlers make Germany strong again etc. The anti socialism position and getting people to take a stand against their own interests.

I really hope we don’t look back on the next 20 years as a rise in fascism we regret.
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Are we seeing a huge global economic depression?
Are we seeing hyperinflation?
Are the US and UK reeling under ridiculously harsh economic sanctions after the end of a World War?
Is the nation bitter and resentful at the way it was treated when committing to an armistice?
Is Europe concerned about the westward spread of Communism?
Are large numbers of people starving?
Are we seeing virulent anti Semitism?
Does the UK or US need "room to grow" outside of territorial borders?

The answer to all of those is no, or not really, so it's not the same.
 
Soutra said:
Are we seeing a huge global economic depression?
Are we seeing hyperinflation?
Are the US and UK reeling under ridiculously harsh economic sanctions after the end of a World War?
Is the nation bitter and resentful at the way it was treated when committing to an armistice?
Is Europe concerned about the westward spread of Communism?
Are large numbers of people starving?
Are we seeing virulent anti Semitism?
Does the UK or US need "room to grow" outside of territorial borders?

The answer to all of those is no, or not really, so it's not the same.
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Exactly And I think to make the conparrison is frankly an insult to the events you are taking about.
 
Lefty said:
We are all easily influenced and there are more sophisticated methods than ever before. The only hope we have is awareness of this and the importance of exercising our critical thinking skills.

This is slightly harder for those on the Right unfortunately, hence the sh1tshow globally of the last five years or so in particular.
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It's harder for people on the right to critically think?
 
Anton_Berg said:
At a match in the 1930s
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Which is why you need to look at the time not in a modern context but at what was happening then as at the beginning most people thought hitler was just a funny little man that liked flags. Look at the olympics Of the time as you are looking at him post war but back then he and Germany were part of the international community.
 
I’ve seen people use phrase like trump is worse than Hitler...

which is frankly just absurd, now I hate the don as much as anyone as I think he is an evil sociopathic wannabe dictator but hes not worse than Hitler.


this is why I think these comparisons are dangerous.
 
zorro_mfc said:
I’ve seen people use phrase like trump is worse than Hitler...

which is frankly just absurd, now I hate the don as much as anyone as I think he is an evil sociopathic wannabe dictator but hes not worse than Hitler.


this is why I think these comparisons are dangerous.
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Tbh I think it's more dangerous not to see the obvious similarities. To use the questions posed earlier:

Are we seeing a huge global economic depression?
Yes.

Are we seeing hyperinflation?
Not yet.

Are the US and UK reeling under ridiculously harsh economic sanctions after the end of a World War?
The US and UK have both been whipped up into anti-foreigner sentiment and right wing politicians have seized on the opportunity.

Is the nation bitter and resentful at the way it was treated when committing to an armistice?
The nation is bitter and resentful at what it perceives as an invasion of foreign people, who are actually fleeing from wars caused by weapons we manufactured and sold.

Is Europe concerned about the westward spread of Communism?
Europe is concerned at the westward spread of fascism, which is funded and aided by Russia, a hostile state who have bought their way into the very top of UK and US governments.

Are large numbers of people starving?
Visit a food bank, ask their volunteers.

Are we seeing virulent anti Semitism?
Replace anti-Semitism with racism. Yes.

Does the UK or US need "room to grow" outside of territorial borders?
No.
 
zorro_mfc said:
Yes because the far left have never committed atrocities have they.

this kind of inflammatory language doesn’t help anyone.
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I think the point being made here highlights a significant difference - when the far left rise to power it is usually usually through revolution (very unlikely to happen in the west). The far right’s rise to power is usually due to an acquiescence and/or support of the establishment - media, business, religious groups and political parties on the right. Some of the imagery and rhetoric used, in particular with Trump and to a lesser extent here (BJ has Farage for that), have similarities to those used by the fascist dictators we have seen. Key defining factors of Fascism are, but not exclusively, the demonisation of the ‘other’, obsession with the restoration of a nation’s greatness and a hatred of Socialism. Step forward Mr Trump?
 
I’m not denying trump is a fascist and would no doubt love to be a dictator (in his mind he thinks he is) but congress still has the ability to reign in his powers. He can be overthrown ( please god) at this election - that’s the difference.

hopefully his evil stain will be a temporary blip a footnote in history.
 
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