Renewal Announcement - 30th March Deadline

I think a Theakstons is £3.80 or £3.90.


No idea about food prices, I’ve never thought about having my lunch or tea at the match 😅
 
DidsburySmog92 said:
I don’t think the debate is about quality vs value for money. I don’t think any of us can really say we support Middlesbrough to watch incredible football. We can’t say that we feel there is a relationship between what we pay and the quality of the product we get back because football is not transactional like that. We watch it because we have a connection to something bigger than the sums of our parts. We have a loyalty and commitment that won’t go away and we support everything the club means to us collectively and individually.

The expectation argument can be had forever. Personally I think we are in an accurate place between 15th in the second tier and 12th in the top tier. We are like lots of teams. Squads change, people move on, but we still support don’t we? I don’t think it’s useful to connect these announcements with how the club in performing.

It is disappointing that the club has acted in a way that disrespects the reasons why we all make the sacrifice to support the club. To some of us it’s an enormous sacrifice and to some of us it’s less about financial sacrifice and more about a time sacrifice. That’s the injustice here. We deserve clear communication, an apology and a commitment to be better with suitable accountability. That sacrifice is what brings us all together and it is not beyond a good PR and marketing team to make that into a positive that can galvanise fans during a tough part of the season to commit to renewing their tickets.

The experience has shown weaknesses in the club and weaknesses in the fan forum governance and I hope that they will address them. I think fans need a more accountable relationship with the bodies making representation to the club, increasing participation and turning a percentage of people who love to moan into people who can contribute in a progressive way. Again a good PR team would be all over it to get out of the crisis they have got themselves in!
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Well said that man 🫡
 
DidsburySmog92 said:
I don’t think the debate is about quality vs value for money. I don’t think any of us can really say we support Middlesbrough to watch incredible football. We can’t say that we feel there is a relationship between what we pay and the quality of the product we get back because football is not transactional like that. We watch it because we have a connection to something bigger than the sums of our parts. We have a loyalty and commitment that won’t go away and we support everything the club means to us collectively and individually.

The expectation argument can be had forever. Personally I think we are in an accurate place between 15th in the second tier and 12th in the top tier. We are like lots of teams. Squads change, people move on, but we still support don’t we? I don’t think it’s useful to connect these announcements with how the club in performing.

It is disappointing that the club has acted in a way that disrespects the reasons why we all make the sacrifice to support the club. To some of us it’s an enormous sacrifice and to some of us it’s less about financial sacrifice and more about a time sacrifice. That’s the injustice here. We deserve clear communication, an apology and a commitment to be better with suitable accountability. That sacrifice is what brings us all together and it is not beyond a good PR and marketing team to make that into a positive that can galvanise fans during a tough part of the season to commit to renewing their tickets.

The experience has shown weaknesses in the club and weaknesses in the fan forum governance and I hope that they will address them. I think fans need a more accountable relationship with the bodies making representation to the club, increasing participation and turning a percentage of people who love to moan into people who can contribute in a progressive way. Again a good PR team would be all over it to get out of the crisis they have got themselves in!
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It would be so easy to fix an all.. the club are just dialling it in tho I'm afraid. It's so bad it feels intentional.. like they don't want our custom. It's embarrassing and while they may be looking for short term gains with the season tickets I 100% it will have the opposite effect. I don't see us making £500k of this.. quite the opposite.. and the long term losses.. much much higher.

and for what.. because they can't be bothered.
 
I was chatting to my Manager today and he said he's spoken to Gibson about this in the past and he'd said not having the TV money whilst being in the Championship was a big factor as to why he doesn't feel he can lower ticket prices.
 
We are all addicts to some degree. We keep going back chasing the few incredible highs we get and for the communal experience with friends and family.
This is exploited.

I have just looked at the 10 seasons prior to this one.

Middlesbrough: 1 season in the PL, 1 automatic promotion, 3 play off failures, 3 more top tens, but only 2 within 6 points of the play offs and 2 seasons of awful Championship nothingness. We currently lie 13th and dropping, on a terrible run.
How do we compare?

10 clubs have been PL throughout:
Arsenal, Chelsea, Crystal Palace, Everton, Liverpool, Man City, Man Utd, Southampton, Tottenham, West Ham.
2 more have had 9 PL seasons and won the Championship by an absolute mile when they did drop:
Newcastle and Leicester.
Let's discount those 12 clubs and focus on the rest of us.

Aston Villa have had 7 PL seasons and look fixtures to me.They are simply a bigger club in every way and are competing for CL, never mind playing PL.

So 13 clubs have dwarfed us in the last decade.

However
Let's look at the rest and be honest about how we've done.
10 clubs who it would be impossible to make a case have bigger potential than Boro and in most cases have nothing like our past, but have all undisputedly out-performed us:

Burnley: 7 seasons in the PL, promoted automatically in the other 3 seasons. Currently in the PL again.
Bournemouth: 6 seasons in the PL, 2 automatic promotions, 1 promotion through the play-offs and the other was top 10 and within 6 points of the play offs a decade ago. Currently in the PL again.
Brighton: 6 seasons in the PL, 1 automatic promotion, 2 more play offs and a 20th place finish 9 years ago. Currently PL again.
West Brom: 6 seasons in the PL, 1 automatic promotion, 1 losing play off and the other 2 seasons top 10 and within 6 points of the play offs. Currently comfortably in Play Offs, but unlikely to go up.
Watford: 6 seasons in the PL, 2 automatic promotions, with 1 more within 6 points of play offs last season. A 13th finish a decade ago. Currently floundering like us.
Wolves: 5 seasons in the PL, 1 automatic promotion, 1 top 10 outside play offs on GD, 2 poor seasons and 1 season in L1. Currently in PL again.
Swansea: 5 seasons in the PL, 1 play off promotion, 1 play off fail, 2 other season top 10, albeit not within 6 points of play offs. Currently floundering like us.
Stoke: 5 seasons in the PL, then 5 seasons of utter failure since where the best they've finished is 14th,13 points out of play offs. Currently floundering like us.
Fulham: 4 seasons in the PL, 1 automatic promotion, 2 play off promotions, 1 play off failure, 2 low Championship finishes nearly a decade ago. Currently PL again.
Norwich: 4 seasons in the PL, 2 automatic promotions, 1 play off promotion, 1 more top 10 and just 2 poor season, albeit one of them just 7 points off play offs last season. Currently in Play off mix.

Moving on
7 more clubs who've out-performed us:

Sunderland: 4 seasons in the PL, 1 playoff failure last season, 1 championship bottom and 4 season in L1. Currently in play off mix.
Hull City: 3 seasons in the PL, 1 play off promotion, 4 very poor Championship finishes, plus 1 relegation bottom and a promotion season in L1. Currently in play off mix.
Leeds United: 3 seasons in the PL, 1 automatic promotion, 1 play off failure, 1 top 10 missing play offs by 5 points and 4 awful seasons of Championship nothingness. Currently in automatic promotion race.
Brentford: 2 seasons in the PL, 1 play off promotion, 2 play off failures, 3 more top 10 finishes, but only 1 within 6 points of play offs, and another 1 in mid table, plus a L1 season a decade ago. Currently in PL again.
Sheffield United: 2 seasons in the PL, 2 automatic promotions, 1 play off failure, 1 top 10 finish within 6 points of play offs, 4 L1 seasons in a promotion. Currently in PL again.
Cardiff: 2 seasons in the PL, 1 automatic promotion, 1 play off failure, 2 more top 10's, but only 1 within 6 points of play offs, 4 awful seasons of Championship nothingness. Currently a point behind us in nowhere land.
Huddersfield: 2 seasons in the PL, 1 play off promotion, 1 play off failure, 6 seasons of Championship nothingness. Currently in the lower reaches again.

and on again:
2 more clubs who match our PL status in the last decade:

Nottingham Forest: 1 PL season, 1 play off success, 2 more top 10 seasons with 1 missing play offs on GD, 1 further season just 6 points off play offs, 5 awful seasons of Championship nothingness. Currently in PL again.
QPR: 1 PL season, 1 play off promotion, 8 awful seasons of Championship nothingness. Currently in danger of relegation.

And Luton Town: 1 Play off promotion, 1 Play off failure, 2 lowly Championship seasons, 2 season in L1, 3 in L2 and 1 Non League. Currently matching our single PL season, but may yet survive unlike us.

So that is 34 clubs covered, including us. Our ten year record does not read well.
If we take it back another 4 seasons it gets worse.

Of those 34 clubs: 9 are PL fixtures, ( Arsenal, Chelsea, Spurs, West Ham, City, United, Liverpool, Villa, Newcastle)
11 PL clubs, (Brighton, Fulham, Wolves, Bournemouth, Brentford, Burnley, Sheff U, Forest, Palace, Everton and Luton) will all probably drop out of the PL in the fairly near future, but if they do they will have Parachute Payments to give them a massive advantage of a return within 2-3 years. Brighton and Fulham also have very wealthy and committed owners, while all but Sheff U and Everton of the others are well run.
3 Championship clubs (Leeds, Leicester and Southampton) are waiting their inevitable return in the next 2 seasons with PP funding and highly valuable squads.
Many of these 14 clubs we could compete with if on PL revenues, but we are not and they are.

QPR, Huddersfield, Cardiff, Sunderland, Hull, Swansea and Stoke aren't either; whilst if West Brom, Watford and Norwich don't go back up this season (unlikely) then their PP's are done and they are in our mix of 11 clubs of Championship status without PP's.
Let's look a little lower to clubs depressingly in our pool. Clubs in reality who are pretty much Championship fixtures and we haven't done much better than in the last decade in all honesty.

Birmingham City: 0 seasons in the PL, 2 top 10's but never within 10 points of the play offs. 8 seasons of purgatory. Bottom feeding again.
Blackburn Rovers: 0 seasons in PL, never in the play offs, 4 top 10 finishes, 3 of them within 6 points of play offs, 4 nothing seasons, 1 relegation and 1 L1 promotion. Currently close to us in nowhere land.
Millwall: 0 seasons in PL, never in the play offs, 4 times in top 10 and always within 6 points of play offs. 3 seasons of nothingness, 1 relegation and 2 seasons in L1 including a promotion. Currently bottom feeding.
Preston: 0 seasons in the PL, never in the play offs, 2 top 10 finishes both within 6 points of play offs. 1 more finish within 6 points of play offs (last season), 5 seasons of Championship nothingness and 2 seasons in L1 inc a promotion season. Currently in the play off mix.
Reading: 0 seasons in the PL, 1 play off failure, 2 more top 10's but only 1 within 6 points of play offs, 6 seasons of hanging on, 1 relegation Currently floundering in L1.
Bristol City: 0 seasons in the PL, never in the play offs, 1 top 10 finish within 4 points of the play offs, 7 seasons of Championship nothing, 2 seasons in L1 inc 1 promotion. Currently close to us in nowhere land.
Sheffield Wednesday: 0 seasons in the PL, 2 play off failures, 5 seasons of Championship nothing, 1 relegation, 2 seasons in L1 inc 1 promotion. Currently likely to drop again.
Derby County: 0 seasons in the PL, 4 Play off failures, 3 more top 10 finishes, with 2 of them within 6 points of the play offs. 2 deserved seasons of turmoil inc 1 relegation season and a season in L1. Currently competing for automatic promotion from L1.

Add in Pompey and Bolton and there's 21 clubs without PP's plus at least 3 of the PL drop outs who will have PP for 2-3 years.
May be at least next season there will be 3 Play Off places up for grabs.
But given the club's current status, recent actions and decade long decision ineptitude, I'm struggling to believe they have either the will or the wit.

uncle_rico said:
Try £4.40
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As usual he sees what he wants.
 
Blf said:
The difference between early bird prices and a new season ticket is massive.
Would it bother any season ticket holders on here if the club just said it was the same price with say £10 extra admin charge ?
Could help get a lot more ST holders if people didn't feel they were being ripped off.
Surely ST holders would rather see the club get more ST holders than have some feeling they are being rewarded for loyalty. They will still be paying the same.
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Fully agree, EB offer should be open to anyone willing to put their money upfront
 
indeedido said:
We are all addicts to some degree. We keep going back chasing the few incredible highs we get and for the communal experience with friends and family.
This is exploited.

I have just looked at the 10 seasons prior to this one.

Middlesbrough: 1 season in the PL, 1 automatic promotion, 3 play off failures, 3 more top tens, but only 2 within 6 points of the play offs and 2 seasons of awful Championship nothingness. We currently lie 13th and dropping, on a terrible run.
How do we compare?

10 clubs have been PL throughout:
Arsenal, Chelsea, Crystal Palace, Everton, Liverpool, Man City, Man Utd, Southampton, Tottenham, West Ham.
2 more have had 9 PL seasons and won the Championship by an absolute mile when they did drop:
Newcastle and Leicester.
Let's discount those 12 clubs and focus on the rest of us.

Aston Villa have had 7 PL seasons and look fixtures to me.They are simply a bigger club in every way and are competing for CL, never mind playing PL.

So 13 clubs have dwarfed us in the last decade.

However
Let's look at the rest and be honest about how we've done.
10 clubs who it would be impossible to make a case have bigger potential than Boro and in most cases have nothing like our past, but have all undisputedly out-performed us:

Burnley: 7 seasons in the PL, promoted automatically in the other 3 seasons. Currently in the PL again.
Bournemouth: 6 seasons in the PL, 2 automatic promotions, 1 promotion through the play-offs and the other was top 10 and within 6 points of the play offs a decade ago. Currently in the PL again.
Brighton: 6 seasons in the PL, 1 automatic promotion, 2 more play offs and a 20th place finish 9 years ago. Currently PL again.
West Brom: 6 seasons in the PL, 1 automatic promotion, 1 losing play off and the other 2 seasons top 10 and within 6 points of the play offs. Currently comfortably in Play Offs, but unlikely to go up.
Watford: 6 seasons in the PL, 2 automatic promotions, with 1 more within 6 points of play offs last season. A 13th finish a decade ago. Currently floundering like us.
Wolves: 5 seasons in the PL, 1 automatic promotion, 1 top 10 outside play offs on GD, 2 poor seasons and 1 season in L1. Currently in PL again.
Swansea: 5 seasons in the PL, 1 play off promotion, 1 play off fail, 2 other season top 10, albeit not within 6 points of play offs. Currently floundering like us.
Stoke: 5 seasons in the PL, then 5 seasons of utter failure since where the best they've finished is 14th,13 points out of play offs. Currently floundering like us.
Fulham: 4 seasons in the PL, 1 automatic promotion, 2 play off promotions, 1 play off failure, 2 low Championship finishes nearly a decade ago. Currently PL again.
Norwich: 4 seasons in the PL, 2 automatic promotions, 1 play off promotion, 1 more top 10 and just 2 poor season, albeit one of them just 7 points off play offs last season. Currently in Play off mix.

Moving on
7 more clubs who've out-performed us:

Sunderland: 4 seasons in the PL, 1 playoff failure last season, 1 championship bottom and 4 season in L1. Currently in play off mix.
Hull City: 3 seasons in the PL, 1 play off promotion, 4 very poor Championship finishes, plus 1 relegation bottom and a promotion season in L1. Currently in play off mix.
Leeds United: 3 seasons in the PL, 1 automatic promotion, 1 play off failure, 1 top 10 missing play offs by 5 points and 4 awful seasons of Championship nothingness. Currently in automatic promotion race.
Brentford: 2 seasons in the PL, 1 play off promotion, 2 play off failures, 3 more top 10 finishes, but only 1 within 6 points of play offs, and another 1 in mid table, plus a L1 season a decade ago. Currently in PL again.
Sheffield United: 2 seasons in the PL, 2 automatic promotions, 1 play off failure, 1 top 10 finish within 6 points of play offs, 4 L1 seasons in a promotion. Currently in PL again.
Cardiff: 2 seasons in the PL, 1 automatic promotion, 1 play off failure, 2 more top 10's, but only 1 within 6 points of play offs, 4 awful seasons of Championship nothingness. Currently a point behind us in nowhere land.
Huddersfield: 2 seasons in the PL, 1 play off promotion, 1 play off failure, 6 seasons of Championship nothingness. Currently in the lower reaches again.

and on again:
2 more clubs who match our PL status in the last decade:

Nottingham Forest: 1 PL season, 1 play off success, 2 more top 10 seasons with 1 missing play offs on GD, 1 further season just 6 points off play offs, 5 awful seasons of Championship nothingness. Currently in PL again.
QPR: 1 PL season, 1 play off promotion, 8 awful seasons of Championship nothingness. Currently in danger of relegation.

And Luton Town: 1 Play off promotion, 1 Play off failure, 2 lowly Championship seasons, 2 season in L1, 3 in L2 and 1 Non League. Currently matching our single PL season, but may yet survive unlike us.

So that is 34 clubs covered, including us. Our ten year record does not read well.
If we take it back another 4 seasons it gets worse.

Of those 34 clubs: 9 are PL fixtures, ( Arsenal, Chelsea, Spurs, West Ham, City, United, Liverpool, Villa, Newcastle)
11 PL clubs, (Brighton, Fulham, Wolves, Bournemouth, Brentford, Burnley, Sheff U, Forest, Palace, Everton and Luton) will all probably drop out of the PL in the fairly near future, but if they do they will have Parachute Payments to give them a massive advantage of a return within 2-3 years. Brighton and Fulham also have very wealthy and committed owners, while all but Sheff U and Everton of the others are well run.
3 Championship clubs (Leeds, Leicester and Southampton) are waiting their inevitable return in the next 2 seasons with PP funding and highly valuable squads.
Many of these 14 clubs we could compete with if on PL revenues, but we are not and they are.

QPR, Huddersfield, Cardiff, Sunderland, Hull, Swansea and Stoke aren't either; whilst if West Brom, Watford and Norwich don't go back up this season (unlikely) then their PP's are done and they are in our mix of 11 clubs of Championship status without PP's.
Let's look a little lower to clubs depressingly in our pool. Clubs in reality who are pretty much Championship fixtures and we haven't done much better than in the last decade in all honesty.

Birmingham City: 0 seasons in the PL, 2 top 10's but never within 10 points of the play offs. 8 seasons of purgatory. Bottom feeding again.
Blackburn Rovers: 0 seasons in PL, never in the play offs, 4 top 10 finishes, 3 of them within 6 points of play offs, 4 nothing seasons, 1 relegation and 1 L1 promotion. Currently close to us in nowhere land.
Millwall: 0 seasons in PL, never in the play offs, 4 times in top 10 and always within 6 points of play offs. 3 seasons of nothingness, 1 relegation and 2 seasons in L1 including a promotion. Currently bottom feeding.
Preston: 0 seasons in the PL, never in the play offs, 2 top 10 finishes both within 6 points of play offs. 1 more finish within 6 points of play offs (last season), 5 seasons of Championship nothingness and 2 seasons in L1 inc a promotion season. Currently in the play off mix.
Reading: 0 seasons in the PL, 1 play off failure, 2 more top 10's but only 1 within 6 points of play offs, 6 seasons of hanging on, 1 relegation Currently floundering in L1.
Bristol City: 0 seasons in the PL, never in the play offs, 1 top 10 finish within 4 points of the play offs, 7 seasons of Championship nothing, 2 seasons in L1 inc 1 promotion. Currently close to us in nowhere land.
Sheffield Wednesday: 0 seasons in the PL, 2 play off failures, 5 seasons of Championship nothing, 1 relegation, 2 seasons in L1 inc 1 promotion. Currently likely to drop again.
Derby County: 0 seasons in the PL, 4 Play off failures, 3 more top 10 finishes, with 2 of them within 6 points of the play offs. 2 deserved seasons of turmoil inc 1 relegation season and a season in L1. Currently competing for automatic promotion from L1.

Add in Pompey and Bolton and there's 21 clubs without PP's plus at least 3 of the PL drop outs who will have PP for 2-3 years.
May be at least next season there will be 3 Play Off places up for grabs.
But given the club's current status, recent actions and decade long decision ineptitude, I'm struggling to believe they have either the will or the wit.


As usual he sees what he wants.
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Don't know about the rest of it but I'm not having it that Sunderland have had a better 10 yrs just because they spent 3 more seasons in the Premier League than us.
Surely the 4 seasons they spent crying in League 1 counts for more than those basement battles they endured?
Bearing in mind two of their extra Prem seasons were whilst we were enjoying two of our most enjoyable seasons of recent times.
 
Rofesleg said:
Don't know about the rest of it but I'm not having it that Sunderland have had a better 10 yrs just because they spent 3 more seasons in the Premier League than us.
Surely the 4 seasons they spent crying in League 1 counts for more than those basement battles they endured?
Bearing in mind two of their extra Prem seasons were whilst we were enjoying two of our most enjoyable seasons of recent times.
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"Better" is hard to define when you accept that none of the teams mentioned have been successful using the traditional method of trophies won. It's hard to deny we've had a lot of "nothing" seasons over the last two decades, particularly when you compare it to the decade before. Sunderland did go to Wembley 3 times (and won twice) which we haven't done, even if it is only the L1 playoff and EFL trophy. If you just measure on league position then being in the PL is better than being in the championship but being in the championship is better than being in L1 but financially the seasons in the PL is a much bigger difference compared to the championship as the championship is to L1. Just measuring years being in a division is difficult to use as a metric because I presume Sheff Utd would see last season as more successful than this season.

I think it's hard to argue that we've had a good decade by any measure. We're also completely relying on the first 3 years of the decade for our success in that decade. The majority of the last 15 years have been meh at best with last year being a bright spot but still one where we fell short.
 
parmoboy said:
I was chatting to my Manager today and he said he's spoken to Gibson about this in the past and he'd said not having the TV money whilst being in the Championship was a big factor as to why he doesn't feel he can lower ticket prices.
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Gibbo said the same thing when I went to a couple of them fan forums but then he still whacked the prices up when we got promoted so 🤷
 
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