Jimstewart
Well-known member
They could always go down the crazy route of patriotism, promoting veterans, dressing smartly and having sensible policies that appeal to their core vote in lost constituencies as well. You never know what could happen.
New look Labour
- Thread starter Alvez_48
- Start date
It could... but lets get real. It won't. It's not like they've just sprung up out of the ground and nobodys ever heard of these figures before.
Maybe boro will go down the crazy route of winning every game 6-0, with Assomba smashing in two hattricks. It would be lovely. I'd be made up about it. Somehow I don't think he will though, cause I'm able to look at how he's played in the past and extrapolate that to how he's likely to perform in the future.
Yeah there's something in that. I did vote for Miliband's version of Labour where it was definitely a case of b) without a). I may well end up voting Labour under Starmer. But I don't see what that has to do with whether I think standing next to a flag is a massive vote winner or not.
Chris_Boro
Well-known member
Not sure what policy Labour had that is even remotely comparable to Brexit which was more an ideology than a policy. Farage took advantage of the ERG rise to power within the Tories and their fear of votes being split.
Again why 4 years out from an election would Labour pick a policy from a manifesto that was part of a heavy election defeat? The priorities and finances of the country, even its entire make-up are unknown.
Even your choice of words there gives the game away. "Sensible policies".
It's more like 3 years now isn't it. We'll not be having another election in the middle of winter even with the fixed parliament act. Probably going to be May 2024.
...
Not especially. The country in May 2024 will be broadly similar to how it is now.
Chris_Boro
Well-known member
A 2015 David Cameron would have thought the same. Wonder what he's up to now?
If Labour float any policy right now, regardless of how good it sounds, by the time of the next election would have been pulled apart by the Tory media machine and client journalism to the point of irrelevance.
We need to see how the political fallout from the pandemic effects the Tories, they are well capable of eating themselves and if they block attempts at holding a full public enquiry into it then there's Labour's new election policy handed on a plate.
I couldn't disagree more with that. They'll ride on a massive wave of vaccines whenever the pandemic is over, and they'll be more keen than anyone to have an incredibly thorough public enquiry. Preferably one that takes about 10 years to be published.
Wait and see, give them enough rope, etc just doesn't work in politics imo.
Same_as_before
Well-known member
I am 100% confident there will be a massive corruption story before then. That would be my banner on the wall, all the bent payouts financially and family.
Jimstewart
Well-known member
Gives what game away?
Chris_Boro
Well-known member
If that is true, a single Labour policy is not going to cut through is it?
It'd be better than 0!
That we're watching Labour shift back over to the right.
You're right though. To be fair to Starmer there's no route to power for Labour just now. The party is pretty stuffed no matter what he does.
Same_as_before
Well-known member
When did it win with a left programme? Atlee? Or maybe Wilson
Jimstewart
Well-known member
Yeah ?
True. And Blair won promising tory levels of spending.
But again, this doesn't convince me that Starmer can stand next to a flag, expel dozens of CLP secretaries and avoid talking about policies for years and somehow stumble on 100+ gains. Maybe it'll work. If it does, I'll of course admit he's pulled off a result I never expected.
If he then turns around and reveals that he and the likes of Kendall and Streeting were all secretly Bennites all along and embarks on a policy program to turn the country around I'll be as happy as anyone about it.
Billy Horner
Well-known member
I think Starmer has done ok so far, but I would agree that he needs to start to show a bit more of a genuine alternative to the current shambles. As others have said though, it’s probably still a bit too soon to launch a new policy platform, as any good ones would simply be nicked by the government and the rest pulled to pieces by their friends in the media.
On the substance of the OP, it’s a bit of window dressing, but I genuinely don’t see why people should be getting concerned about the Labour Party wanting you be seen as patriotic. It genuinely matters to a significant group of voters that the party needs to win back if it to have any chance of power. It also matters to a large group of potential Tory switchers, who probably would never vote for Labour directly, but might be prepared to vote Lib Dem (in places where that matters) if that meant there might be a Labour PM they could live with.
I genuinely don’t see why patriotism and socialism are seen by some as being mutually exclusive. The post-war Attlee government, which is the most effective socialist government we’ve ever had, was incredibly patriotic. They spent a fortune developing an independent nuclear deterrent, basically on the argument that “it’s got to have the Union Jack painted on top of it”.
That didn’t stop them creating the NHS, the welfare state, nationalising key industries, constraining wealthy landowners through planning controls, building new towns, etc, etc. You can do both!
On the substance of the OP, it’s a bit of window dressing, but I genuinely don’t see why people should be getting concerned about the Labour Party wanting you be seen as patriotic. It genuinely matters to a significant group of voters that the party needs to win back if it to have any chance of power. It also matters to a large group of potential Tory switchers, who probably would never vote for Labour directly, but might be prepared to vote Lib Dem (in places where that matters) if that meant there might be a Labour PM they could live with.
I genuinely don’t see why patriotism and socialism are seen by some as being mutually exclusive. The post-war Attlee government, which is the most effective socialist government we’ve ever had, was incredibly patriotic. They spent a fortune developing an independent nuclear deterrent, basically on the argument that “it’s got to have the Union Jack painted on top of it”.
That didn’t stop them creating the NHS, the welfare state, nationalising key industries, constraining wealthy landowners through planning controls, building new towns, etc, etc. You can do both!
Lefty
Well-known member
'The post-war Attlee government, which is the most effective socialist government we’ve ever had, was incredibly patriotic.'
Indeed. The Beveridge Report, which was essentially the Labour Party's vision for the future of the UK for the working man was read by every serviceman from it's publication in late 1942 to the end of the War in 1945 and it was that as much as the defeat of the Nazi's that they were fighting for and it was that, rather than any snub to Churchill, that they voted for in the July 1945 general election.
You can hardly call out those voters as unpatriotic.
Indeed. The Beveridge Report, which was essentially the Labour Party's vision for the future of the UK for the working man was read by every serviceman from it's publication in late 1942 to the end of the War in 1945 and it was that as much as the defeat of the Nazi's that they were fighting for and it was that, rather than any snub to Churchill, that they voted for in the July 1945 general election.
You can hardly call out those voters as unpatriotic.