Lockdown Deaths

SmallTown said:
We had one of the weakest, poorly enforced lockdowns and we are nearly at the top of the worst deaths table. Are these two things a coincidence?
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Countries like Spain Italy and France had the harshest lockdowns and are right there with us FFS.

You claim China like there numbers aren't pie in the sky like seriously get a grip.
 
Alvez_48 said:
Countries like Spain Italy and France had the harshest lockdowns and are right there with us FFS.

You claim China like there numbers aren't pie in the sky like seriously get a grip.
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Taiwan then? South Korea, New Zealand, Australia, Japan.
 
1finny said:
The FT are not claiming all excess deaths are Covid related
They are reporting the numbers - excess deaths over a 5 year average. This is the government's preferred measure.
The reason that is the measure is because lots of actions were taken to protect from Covid which they knew would have consequences - keeping hospital beds free was bound to have an impact as we saw in care homes.
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The FT did that analysis last month and literally nailed every excess death to covid 19 including where they weren't included on the death certificate.
It was touted widely on this forum.
 
SmallTown said:
Taiwan then? South Korea, New Zealand, Australia, Japan.
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Hmm South Korea no lockdown... Also all in the southern hemisphere. Super.

I can't comment on what any othose nations health services did in terms of other care. I know ours shut everything down.
 
So in January and February, people who had contracted Covid-19 were dying, but they weren't being registered as deaths with Covid-19. Now in May people are dying who don't have Covid-19, but are being registered as dying with Covid-19.

Best of luck running an inquiry to sort this out. Nobody will ever know the real number but the only thing we can be sure of is that the quoted number won't be correct.
 
1finny said:
The FT are not claiming all excess deaths are Covid related
They are reporting the numbers - excess deaths over a 5 year average. This is the government's preferred measure.
The reason that is the measure is because lots of actions were taken to protect from Covid which they knew would have consequences - keeping hospital beds free was bound to have an impact as we saw in care homes.
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Yes but they are insinuating that they are covid-19 related.
And this is the point of my question? Has shutting down hospitals and locking down homes to focus on covid-19 caused the same amount of overall deaths that not locking down would have caused?

Also to answer soutra's point, it's obvious to anybody with any sort of common sense that people were dying from this in January and February.
 
Alvez_48 said:
The FT did that analysis last month and literally nailed every excess death to covid 19 including where they weren't included on the death certificate.
It was touted widely on this forum.
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They run the analysis regularly - at least once a week.
You clearly haven't read it but - feel free to rubbish it. That's the way of the world these days
 
RandySavage said:
Yes but they are insinuating that they are covid-19 related.
And this is the point of my question? Has shutting down hospitals and locking down homes to focus on covid-19 caused the same amount of overall deaths that not locking down would have caused?

Also to answer soutra's point, it's obvious to anybody with any sort of common sense that people were dying from this in January and February.
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Disagree - you, and others can interpret their words how you like. They are consistent they are reporting excess deaths.
To your other point - absolutely. That's why you can't just measure Covid deaths and say 'great/poor' job done.
 
1finny said:
They run the analysis regularly - at least once a week.
You clearly haven't read it but - feel free to rubbish it. That's the way of the world these days
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No I'm not reading the weekly analysis you're right... When the initial one was so biased why would I continue?

The point is the article in the OP rightly points out these deaths are actually not due to covid.
 
Alvez_48 said:
No I'm not reading the weekly analysis you're right... When the initial one was so biased why would I continue?

The point is the article in the OP rightly points out these deaths are actually not due to covid.
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We agree on the point those deaths are not necessarily due to contracting the virus.
But, it is the government's preferred measure of the impact of Covid.
 
1finny said:
This, alongside our silence, is sickening
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Agreed, it's another case of cause and effect.
But no people want to stay locked down (which I get, I do) whilst stuff like the Hong Kong situation fly's under the radar and the military build up on the Indian border is unreported and the fact that Taiwan have been pleading for help for years because they see what's about to happen to their country and they are ignored by the world, most recently due to coronavirus.
 
I've been told of 3 cases where the cause was given as covid when it clearly wasn't. In one case an 80 yr old women lapsed into a diabetic coma and the death was attributed to covid. When her daughter queried it she was told that if covid went on the death certificate an autopsy wasn't needed. One of the other was a bleed on the brain from falling off a horse.
 
Alvez_48 said:
Hmm South Korea no lockdown... Also all in the southern hemisphere. Super.

I can't comment on what any othose nations health services did in terms of other care. I know ours shut everything down.
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So the southern hemisphere doesn't count? That's a head scratcher.

Also, I mentioned South Korea, Japan and Taiwan? What part of the Southern hemisphere are they in?
 
RandySavage said:
Well no, because those deaths that may have been caused by covid-19 are been caused by things as a direct result of locking down. I agree we've saved lives but not as many as we will be led to believe.
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How many deaths do you think have specifically been caused by the lockdown? Can guarantee that a massive amount more have been saved than if we hadnt locked down
 
Alvez_48 said:
Hmm South Korea no lockdown... Also all in the southern hemisphere. Super.

I can't comment on what any othose nations health services did in terms of other care. I know ours shut everything down.
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South Korea did lockdown, much stricter than ours in some regions too
 
JM14 said:
How many deaths do you think have specifically been caused by the lockdown? Can guarantee that a massive amount more have been saved than if we hadnt locked down
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We don't know yet as lack of cancer detection will have an effect on the ultimate figures.
I posted the other day of a hospital in California that had more cases of suicides than covid-19.
The mental health pandemic that this lockdown will cause will directly contribute to thousands of deaths in this country.
 
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