Going from bad to worse for the Labour Party

Chris_Boro said:
Who is this Society that are denying people their identities?
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I know right.

I mean as soon as I label Mrs Patel as BAME, then white society deems that she is no longer allowed to make samosa or wear her sari? Instead she has to conform to some undefined specific homogenous BAME identity. What is this identity, is it a mix of all ethnic types? Labelled BAME so she must not eat pork, must have her boys circumcised, wear a rasta hat, be buddhist, go to the synagogue, smoke a hookah pipe in an Iranian cafe, and pigment their skin to be sub-saharan black. I mean that's what society deems right?! Once society 'labels them' BAME, then their individuality is lost and they are all stereotypes at once.

It's utter utter nonsense, that society deeming victims of crime and prejudice as a group suddenly means they have no individual identity in all of their lives.
 
BoroMart said:
Can't people be part of a BAME movement for social equality for all ethnic minorities AND continue to be an Indian and hindu, all at the same time?

Do you have to stop believing in your multiple-gods and fore sake Diwali to be allowed to get involved in the BAME movement and to believe in racial equality for all?
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Good points Boromart. I`l offer a personal experience: Our Jewish Voice for Labour recognise not all Jews hold the same views. The "community" comprises many views and beliefs. It includes Black Jews like Jackie Walker and others, including Mike Howard, whose family escaped the concentration camps.
Bringing together Gay, Lesbian, Transgender, Male, Female Jews and JVL supporters: - bringing their experiences and beliefs together. Ultimately, the way forward involves people from all walks of life - to enrich our collective culture.
Whatever the label - everyone is unique under an "umbrella". When it rains we all get wet.
You only make a cake with different ingredients.
Solidarity. (y)
 
BoroMart said:
I know right.

I mean as soon as I label Mrs Patel as BAME, then white society deems that she is no longer allowed to make samosa or wear her sari? Instead she has to conform to some undefined specific homogenous BAME identity. What is this identity, is it a mix of all ethnic types? Labelled BAME so she must not eat pork, must have her boys circumcised, wear a rasta hat, be buddhist, go to the synagogue, smoke a hookah pipe in an Iranian cafe, and pigment their skin to be sub-saharan black. I mean that's what society deems right?! Once society 'labels them' BAME, then their individuality is lost.

It's utter utter nonsense, that society deeming victims of crime and prejudice as a group suddenly means they have no individual identity in all of their lives.
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Erm no mate that is not what society deems ok. You’ve recently been conditioned to see BAME as woke and cool. It’s complete bollox.
 
Londons_Moggie said:
Erm no mate that is not what society deems ok. You’ve recently been conditioned to see BAME as woke and cool. It’s complete bollox.
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So you are arguing that BAME is forcing all non-whites to be both the same and not the same at the same time 🤔

I've not been conditioned into anything. It's a movement, and a simplified way of identifying people that face similar oppression as a minority group. Nothing more, nothing less. The fight to belittle that term is nothing but an attempt to undermine moves for racial equality. Just as we saw with attempts to claim BLM is racist. It's the same despicable tactic.
 
BoroMart said:
So you are arguing that BAME is forcing all non-whites to be both the same and not the same at the same time 🤔

I've not been conditioned into anything. It's a movement, and a simplified way of identifying people that face similar oppression as a minority group. Nothing more, nothing less. The fight to belittle that term is nothing but an attempt to undermine moves for racial equality. Just as we saw with attempts to claim BLM is racist. It's the same despicable tactic.
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Don’t go down that path mate. I’m challenging on the term BAME don’t flip it into something else. I’m not belittling it I’m challenging it’s use. It’s degrading
 
Londons_Moggie said:
Don’t go down that path mate. I’m challenging on the term BAME don’t flip it into something else. I’m not belittling it I’m challenging it’s use. It’s degrading
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so don't go down the path of claiming I'm both woke and think BAME is cool. It's just a term to simplify people under the same oppression. Does calling someone a rape victim steal them of all their identity? No. Does calling someone part of the BAME community steal them of all their individual identity? No.
Londons_Moggie said:
Don’t go down that path mate. I’m challenging on the term BAME don’t flip it into something else. I’m not belittling it I’m challenging it’s use. It’s degrading
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BoroMart said:
so don't go down the path of claiming I'm both woke and think BAME is cool. It's just a term to simplify people under the same oppression. Does calling someone a rape victim steal them of all their identity? No. Does calling someone part of the BAME community steal them of all their individual identity? No.
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Yea I think we should leave it there. Don’t bring words like rape into it tho mate it has no context. My position ultimately is probably the same as yours I just don’t think we should group anyone who isn’t white into a singular group. It’s ok if u are
 
Londons_Moggie said:
Yea I think we should leave it there. Don’t bring words like rape into it tho mate it has no context.
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why? it's a word, that describes something. Being a victim of any crime be it rape, or theft, or discrimination doesn't change a thing about your individuality.
 
I have no idea what BAME or WOKE means, I know I am a Gammon, but again I don't know what it means.

Our neighbours are Muslim, they follow Ramadan to the letter of their law, when it ends the night in their garden is a joy. And yes they supply the beer.

I work in a very multicultural industry, never once have I thought he is Asian, of colour, gay, and never heard a single comment on the issue. Things are improving still a long way to go. But here's hoping
 
Londons_Moggie said:
You definitely do. You are facilitating it. Eventually you’ll realise it when society tells you to
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No I don't, you're opinion does not reflect the society I belong too.

When I went to Pride I did not see people who lost their identity, I saw people who gained it by embracing a larger group who suffered from the same stigma of being different. Referencing them as LGBT from someone who is not does not change their individuality.

It's exactly the same for BAME, BLM or any other group of individuals joining together to become a bigger voice or simply to share experiences.

Separating everyone into their component groups dilutes that voice and makes them easier for society to ignore.
 
Chris_Boro said:
No I don't, you're opinion does not reflect the society I belong too.

When I went to Pride I did not see people who lost their identity, I saw people who gained it by embracing a larger group who suffered from the same stigma of being different. Referencing them as LGBT from someone who is not does not change their individuality.

It's exactly the same for BAME, BLM or any other group of individuals joining together to become a bigger voice or simply to share experiences.

Separating everyone into their component groups dilutes that voice and makes them easier for society to ignore.
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LGBTYQ is a term created by that community. BAME is a crass lazy term that history won’t look fondly on
 
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