George Floyd

FatCat said:
I didn’t fully appreciate that and I can’t agree more. Given the US has the law of “joint enterprise”that can see you responsible for murder even if you never left the car and just dropped a friend off to commit a crime - then how can this be so for these police officers! It’s certainly going to be gripping for all the wrong reasons.
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police unions are very powerful in the states.
 
There's only one way this trial is going. They'll follow all the procedures and then the president's administration will get involved behind closed doors and the police officer (rightly may I add) goes to jail.

Anything other than that and the riots seen in America last year will be made to look like a kid's birthday party compared to the riots that country would see this year.
 
Randy said:
There's only one way this trial is going. They'll follow all the procedures and then the president's administration will get involved behind closed doors and the police officer (rightly may I add) goes to jail.

Anything other than that and the riots seen in America last year will be made to look like a kid's birthday party compared to the riots that country would see this year.
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I said this above, there is an enpanalled jury and the president can't get involved, its not even a federal crime.
 
FatCat said:
Yes but still not mean the guy should be banged to rights. Will be interesting to see his explanation.
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He won't get first degree, and I guess unless he decided to kill him before even arresting him due to some previous beef, then he probably shouldn't. I guess the argument is can they argue it down from second degree to third.

1st degree : Any intentional murder that is wilful and premeditated with malice aforethought

2nd degree : Any intentional murder with malice aforethought, but is not premeditated or planned in advance.

3rd degree : the statute requires that the person “without intent to effect the death of any person, causes the death of another by perpetrating an act eminently dangerous to others and evincing a depraved mind, without regard for human life”
 
BoroMart said:
He won't get first degree, and I guess unless he decided to kill him before even arresting him due to some previous beef, then he probably shouldn't. I guess the argument is can they argue it down from second degree to third.

1st degree : Any intentional murder that is wilful and premeditated with malice aforethought

2nd degree : Any intentional murder with malice aforethought, but is not premeditated or planned in advance.

3rd degree : the statute requires that the person “without intent to effect the death of any person, causes the death of another by perpetrating an act eminently dangerous to others and evincing a depraved mind, without regard for human life”
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3rd degree for me.
 
BoroMart said:
He won't get first degree, and I guess unless he decided to kill him before even arresting him due to some previous beef, then he probably shouldn't. I guess the argument is can they argue it down from second degree to third.

1st degree : Any intentional murder that is wilful and premeditated with malice aforethought

2nd degree : Any intentional murder with malice aforethought, but is not premeditated or planned in advance.

3rd degree : the statute requires that the person “without intent to effect the death of any person, causes the death of another by perpetrating an act eminently dangerous to others and evincing a depraved mind, without regard for human life”
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The only options before the jury are 2nd degree murder or 3rd degree manslaughter. He couldn't be charged with 3rd degree murder because that is accidental killing whilst engaged in a felony. This is applicable in only 3 states I believe,

In any event 2nd degree murder carries a maximum sentence of 25 years, and 3rd degree manslaughter 40 years. These numbers are for minessota, other states have life imprisonment for 2nd degree murder.

We don't actually know how George Floyd died yet. The prosecution say he was asphyxiated due to chest compression, the defence say he had a heart arythmia. They are both, according to their opening statements, going to produce medical examiners to support their claim. If the defense sell the dodgy heart story Chauvin probably walks away. If the jury believe the asphyxiation Chauvin goes down for 3rd degree manslaughter.

Right now everyone is basing their judgement on social media videos, it's not really how the legal system is supposed to work.
 
As regrettable as it sounds and I hope I’m wrong but I think whatever the outcome there’s still going to be a mega riot . Many groups/factions who are at tipping point due to Floyd , Covid and the dire unemployment situation will for me use it as an ‘excuse’ for holy hell .
A bit of late Spring sunshine and it’ll explode not just in the USA but all over incl here and if I was a businessman with a shop over there I’d be seriously thinking of boarding up about the time of the verdict
 
Some damning testimony from donald williams an MMA fighter who explained choke holds and witnessed the death of George Floyd. He described several times that Chauvin "shimmied" to get more pressure on Floyds neck and described watching the life go out of George Floyd.

It was damning because of the MMA foundation that was layed earlier and whilst the witness wasn't particularly eloquent, he described in quite an emotional way George Floyds last moments.

He hasn't been crossed yet, but has done a lot of damage to Chauvin's case.
 
Laughing said:
Some damning testimony from donald williams an MMA fighter who explained choke holds and witnessed the death of George Floyd. He described several times that Chauvin "shimmied" to get more pressure on Floyds neck and described watching the life go out of George Floyd.

It was damning because of the MMA foundation that was layed earlier and whilst the witness wasn't particularly eloquent, he described in quite an emotional way George Floyds last moments.

He hasn't been crossed yet, but has done a lot of damage to Chauvin's case.
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He has to report the true and was there, when it happened. Chauvins got no legs to stand on end off.
 
Laughing said:
The only options before the jury are 2nd degree murder or 3rd degree manslaughter. He couldn't be charged with 3rd degree murder because that is accidental killing whilst engaged in a felony. This is applicable in only 3 states I believe,

In any event 2nd degree murder carries a maximum sentence of 25 years, and 3rd degree manslaughter 40 years. These numbers are for minessota, other states have life imprisonment for 2nd degree murder.

We don't actually know how George Floyd died yet. The prosecution say he was asphyxiated due to chest compression, the defence say he had a heart arythmia. They are both, according to their opening statements, going to produce medical examiners to support their claim. If the defense sell the dodgy heart story Chauvin probably walks away. If the jury believe the asphyxiation Chauvin goes down for 3rd degree manslaughter.

Right now everyone is basing their judgement on social media videos, it's not really how the legal system is supposed to work.
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The prosecution has entered the video as evidence and it has been shown. He also suggested it was the prime evidence.
 
Boro_Legend said:
He has to report the true and was there, when it happened. Chauvins got no legs to stand on end off.
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That's not the case at the moment. No medical evidence had been given yet. If George Floyd died of a heart arrhythmia there is no case to answer. As of yet the prosecutor hasn't even established there was a murder yet.
 
Laughing said:
That's not the case at the moment. No medical evidence had been given yet. If George Floyd died of a heart arrhythmia there is no case to answer. As of yet the prosecutor hasn't even established there was a murder yet.
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I’m not sure about that laughing - if the heart arrhythmia was brought on by the position and stress he was under then the cop could still be found guilty. Proving that causal link would be hard I’m sure but I’m sure the prosecution will go down that route if they have to.

Common triggers for an arrhythmia are viral illnesses, alcohol, tobacco, changes in posture, exercise, drinks containing caffeine, certain over-the-counter and prescribed medicines, and illegal recreational drugs.
 
FatCat said:
I’m not sure about that laughing - if the heart arrhythmia was brought on by the position and stress he was under then the cop could still be found guilty. Proving that causal link would be hard I’m sure but I’m sure the prosecution will go down that route if they have to.

Common triggers for an arrhythmia are viral illnesses, alcohol, tobacco, changes in posture, exercise, drinks containing caffeine, certain over-the-counter and prescribed medicines, and illegal recreational drugs.
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A couple of things the defence say they will prove is George Floyd had methamphetamine in his system. At the time of his death chauvin could not have known this and both 2nd degree murder and third degree manslaughter require an element of disregard for human life. The defence could and will argue that kneeling on a handcuffed man's neck is justified.

Williams testimony was damming but without a cause of death won't be enough.
 
I have watched all of day 2. Genevieve Hansen, an emt trained firefighter was on the scene on her day off and tried to access George Floyd to give medical aide and was denied access. She was crying during her testimony and clearly very distraught. 4 children testified also a 9 year old and 3 17 year olds. They spoke very eloquently about the effect on them personally, of watching George Floyd die.

W still don't have a cause of death, but one thing is abundantly clear, Derek Chauvin, at best, didn't care whether Floyd died.

There is not an ounce of humanity in the defendant.

A bad day for the defence today.
 
Laughing said:
I have watched all of day 2. Genevieve Hansen, an emt trained firefighter was on the scene on her day off and tried to access George Floyd to give medical aide and was denied access. She was crying during her testimony and clearly very distraught. 4 children testified also a 9 year old and 3 17 year olds. They spoke very eloquently about the effect on them personally, of watching George Floyd die.

W still don't have a cause of death, but one thing is abundantly clear, Derek Chauvin, at best, didn't care whether Floyd died.

There is not an ounce of humanity in the defendant.

A bad day for the defence today.
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Clauvins defence ? Credit to you watching it all.
 
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