Four day working week

Edna and Ken come from a world where it was much more common for a single wage earner to be able to support the household where there was more time for one of them to manage everything "outside of work". Edna and Ken can FRO IMO. This is why we got brexit.
 
gramercy said:
What I can’t wrap my head around in this is, who is the “we/they” when we talk about moving on to a 4 day week.

Obviously people will still want to go to the shops, pub, restaurants etc on a weekend and no one is suggesting that those things shut down on a Thursday night. But is the four day week something that’s only going to benefit those of us who have a Mon to Fri 9-5?

I think it’s a good idea in principle, but can’t figure out how it’s done without kind of segregating the workforce.
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Clearly not suited for every sector but that doesn’t mean those who can adopt this shouldn’t because other sectors can’t
 
festa5 said:
This is a big part of the problem in this country. People voting based on things that don't effect them, that they don't understand and are actually none of their F***ing business.

Sadly the politics of envy and resentment are often more successful than those of hope or aspiration. Easier to sell and the right wing politicians and media know it.

Edna and Ken are easy targets. No doubt live in their own little world, watching ***** on the telly and with an unshakeable belief their very narrow and limited life experience must be replicated across the country and is the only "truth" that exists.
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Imagine being such a miserable old sod that you actively wanted to make the world a worse place for future generations?
 
There are a number of companies, many private, trialling this concept at the moment. The Government are only able to stick their nose in because it's public sector. But surely the concept of local Government is that you take the right decisions at a local level.

I imagine a public sector job in Cambridge doesn't offer a great standard of living given the cost of housing is astronomical there. The private sector and proximity to London would likely mean good staff leaving for better pay. So a four day week for a full weeks pay might very well be an incentive to those staff to stay when they would otherwise leave. It works in Germany, where the average worker does 27 hours and you don't hear too many complaints about lack of productivity there!

For what it's worth, my personal view is that any company would get a short term boost from a four day week as it's a massive incentive for employees to be productive during those days for the benefit of an extra day off. I'm more sceptical if it would work longer term in every industry as it becomes 'the norm'. But that is precisely why it should be allowed to be decided by the people in charge (and I don't mean central government, who don't seem to be in charge of anything!!)
 
JM14 said:
Clearly not suited for every sector but that doesn’t mean those who can adopt this shouldn’t because other sectors can’t
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I agree with that and while not offering a four day week to be fair my employer offers me a massive amount of flexibility with regard to when and where I work.
Like I said I’ve not quite figured it out, but it kind of feels like the people who might benefit from it the most such as people on lower pay in service jobs would miss out?

I don’t want to appear to be knocking it as an idea, I’m just trying to get a better understanding of it.

Is it being suggested from a government level?
 
I think it would be an incentive for existing businesses to try and streamline their processes - thinking of my workplace at the moment, we are very inefficient
 
gramercy said:
I agree with that and while not offering a four day week to be fair my employer offers me a massive amount of flexibility with regard to when and where I work.
Like I said I’ve not quite figured it out, but it kind of feels like the people who might benefit from it the most such as people on lower pay in service jobs would miss out?

I don’t want to appear to be knocking it as an idea, I’m just trying to get a better understanding of it.

Is it being suggested from a government level?
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Our government is too focussed on taking food away from hungry kids, this kind of policy is sci-fi nonsense to them
 
gramercy said:
What I can’t wrap my head around in this is, who is the “we/they” when we talk about moving on to a 4 day week.

Obviously people will still want to go to the shops, pub, restaurants etc on a weekend and no one is suggesting that those things shut down on a Thursday night. But is the four day week something that’s only going to benefit those of us who have a Mon to Fri 9-5?

I think it’s a good idea in principle, but can’t figure out how it’s done without kind of segregating the workforce.
Click to expand...
I work Sunday night through to Thursday morning and the back end people work Wednesday night through to Sunday morning. We obviously have an overlap on Wednesdays where everyone is in and it works fine, every night is covered and people have 3 days off to do stuff and not just be slaves to the clock.
It's the same arrangement for those working days and both shifts even have people only working 3 days 8f they choose.
Arranging doctors appointments, garage bookings et all is much easier when you know you are going to be off work on specific days, plus you can get away for a couple of nights if you choose to do so.
As I said earlier, covering shifts is possible if there is a will to do so and the idea of 9 to 5, Monday to Friday and feeling obligated to stay late to get things done is outdated.
 
Sheriff_John_Bunnell_ret said:
This isn't about that. Loads of people have work patterns like that anyway. The article talks about reducing hours by 20% on the same pay. Do you think the NHS would be able to cope if all the nurses reduced their hours by 20%?
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Shift work such as NHS frontline is easy enough to envisage improved working hours and patterns. Obviously we would need more nurses and doctors but perhaps not flogging the current ones to within a heartbeat of total exhaustion might at least improve retention? The way we treat workers who aspire to serve is shocking. And that's not just in health services.

If a job can be done in 30 hours and produce as much output as within 37.5, crack on. I hope I never end up as an Edna/Ken in my dotage (which starts next week I think)
 
Norman_Conquest said:
I wonder which paper these two read and who they voted for.

The Guardian - Outside a local pharmacy, Edna and Ken Cox stop to speak as they run their midweek errands. Edna Cox, who is retired, believes that the four-day week does not allow enough time for employees to complete their work.

“Having come from an older age group, I don’t think you can do what you need to do in reduced working hours,” she says. “Back in my day, I was in charge of an office and we could not have done the work we did in four days. Our workload involved phone calls, chasing people, etc. So no, I don’t believe in a four-day week.”

Ken says: “I worked bloody hard. There was no way I could have done the job in four days. There were some days where I used to leave at 6am and return at 10pm just to get the job done.

He adds: “It is all rubbish, if they honestly think they can do a five-day week in four days, they could always be sensible and still let the employees work for five days and then get rid of half of them. You can’t have it both ways – either have a five-day job, or you’ve got too many people.”
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The same paper quite a few on here read.
 
The amount of vacancies and sickness the nhs carries would make this an ideal option.

It would likely increase retention and reduce sickness longterm. This then leads to more staff and less absence.

I think you have to look at the bigger and longer term picture than just the day to day running.

I see the opposite initiatives currently pushed in the NHS with shorter appointments and more of them. I've watched it lead to increased sickness and employees leave due to burnout.

In the short term doing more is the easy answer but not necessarily the right one. If you asked me whether bin collection was more cost effective if ran as a 5 day service or 4 for the same staff I would presume 5 would see more bins emptied and be more cost effective. Turns out I would be wrong for Cambridgeshire County Council.
 
swordtrombonefish said:
Years ago (late 80's to early 90's) I was working for a no longer existing tech Company called Digital Equipment Corporation (DEC) at Reading. I would fly down on the 06:00'ish from Teesside to Heathrow and bus it to the location, arriving around 10:00 & work till 18:00 to get off early into the digs then work two 12 hours days till 21:00, on the last day till 08:00-14:00 and fly back. Was nice to get the three days off and my boss was just a 'get the job done and I'm happy' type so it was never an issue.
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As it should be for many jobs, being in the office or at your desk isn't in itself doing the job....he says taking a 10 minute break from more powerpoint slides and talking politics, economics and social sciences on a football website
 
Thinking nurses work 9-5 Monday to Friday is already completely incorrect. The hospital service is a 24hr, 7 days a week service as it is.

I work 4 days but it is very flexible. Most days from home, can do school drop/pick up, can do clubs etc. Most of the time my job doesn't need 5 days per week but other times it needs a lot more.

I'd love an extra day guaranteed per week to spend with the family/time for hobbies etc. It would probably benefit the people in less senior roles that don't get to pick and choose their own schedule than it would someone like me. I don't feel overworked these days. I used to dread getting up for the office when I was younger. It's not so bad when I'm working from the comfort of my home.
 
festa5 said:
This is a big part of the problem in this country. People voting based on things that don't effect them, that they don't understand and are actually none of their F***ing business.

Sadly the politics of envy and resentment are often more successful than those of hope or aspiration. Easier to sell and the right wing politicians and media know it.

Edna and Ken are easy targets. No doubt live in their own little world, watching ***** on the telly and with an unshakeable belief their very narrow and limited life experience must be replicated across the country and is the only "truth" that exists.
Click to expand...
Simon and Garfunkel sang a song about Edna and Ken called the borders of our lives.
 
I work at Teesside Airport and do the 4 on 4 off shift pattern and dont get me wrong the 4 off is nice but the 4 in are brutal. I think its mainly due to the start times and the hours which is.
4-4 then 5-5 then 10-10 and lastly a 8-8
By the time that 8-8 rolls around im like a zombie after sometimes finishing after 10 the night b4 then beimg straight back into work for another 12 hours
 
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