Finland school shooting - child aged 12 shoots three other children

sherlock1969 said:
Don’t be disingenuous, that’s not the same thing in the slightest.
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I'm not so sure I am. There will be consequences, starting with social care. The laws of their society are being adhered to.

You're not happy about it, you want something stronger, you want something to satisfy yourself. I'd say that was revenge.
 
Corcaigh_the_Cat said:
I'm not so sure I am. There will be consequences, starting with social care. The laws of their society are being adhered to.

You're not happy about it, you want something stronger, you want something to satisfy yourself. I'd say that was revenge.
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Show me where I’ve said I want something stronger to satisfy myself. I’ll wait.

I’m questioning whether the shooter being able to continue in life as if nothing has happened, when he has taken the life of another child, would be seen as justice by the family of the victim. I’d suggest it won’t.
 
Finland is often described as the safest most happy place to live. Not locking up a kid with clear mental defects shows probably why their society is strong.
 
sherlock1969 said:
I would bet good money the victim’s family would disagree.
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Agreed, as a father i wouldn’t be too comfortable with my kids living in the same area let alone sharing a school with a kid that murdered other kids just weeks earlier.

Most kids from about 5 would know that’s a horrific act. 12 is not an excuse.
 
Priv said:
Agreed, as a father i wouldn’t be too comfortable with my kids living in the same area let alone sharing a school with a kid that murdered other kids just weeks earlier.

Most kids from about 5 would know that’s a horrific act. 12 is not an excuse.
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I reckon most of the people lauding the approach on this thread would sing a different tune if it was their family affected 👍
 
sherlock1969 said:
I reckon most of the people lauding the approach on this thread would sing a different tune if it was their family affected 👍
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You’re missing the point entirely. Finnish people and society do not think like England. There is a big difference.
 
Nero said:
You’re missing the point entirely. Finnish people and society do not think like England. There is a big difference.
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How do you know? How can you possibly know what the family of the murdered child think and feel?
 
sherlock1969 said:
How do you know? How can you possibly know what the family of the murdered child think and feel?
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And how do you know that those families are not looking for immediate retribution? Do you know anyone from Finland?

I’ve worked with quite a few Finnish people and can tell you they will not react the way people in England would.
 
It’s also worth remembering that there would be no consequence for the shooter even if a couple of years older as current age of criminal responsibility is 15.

A 14 year old would know what they were doing.

Seems the Finns themselves acknowledge there is an issue as there has been a surge in crime committed by under 15s, and there are suggestions that the age should be lowered.

yle.fi

Interior Minister suggests lower age of criminal responsibility

Interior Minister Mari Rantanen (Finns) said she believes that Finnish society as a whole needs to take action to combat crimes committed by children and young people.
yle.fi yle.fi
 
Nero said:
And how do you know that those families are not looking for immediate retribution? Do you know anyone from Finland?

I’ve worked with quite a few Finnish people and can tell you they will not react the way people in England would.
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They’ve had a 50% rise in robberies and assaults committed by under 15s, their government are considering lowering the age. That wouldn’t suggest a society where this is working or where people are happy with it 🙄
 
sherlock1969 said:
They’ve had a 50% rise in robberies and assaults committed by under 15s, their government are considering lowering the age. That wouldn’t suggest a society where this is working or where people are happy with it 🙄
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You didn’t answer the question.
 
sherlock1969 said:
Because I can’t possibly know how those families feel right now. And neither can you.
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Having worked with Finnish people I have a better idea than you do. It’s not beyond reason that the families affected and not responding with a mob mentality.
 
Nero said:
Having worked with Finnish people I have a better idea than you do. It’s not beyond reason that the families affected and not responding with a mob mentality.
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Mob mentality? Where have I suggested that then?
 
sherlock1969 said:
Mob mentality? Where have I suggested that then?
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You were quickly asking about justice for the families. Mob mentality was the wrong description, but suggesting retribution against a 12 year old kid, is not how Finland has traditionally approached things.
 
sherlock1969 said:
I’m questioning whether the shooter being able to continue in life as if nothing has happened,
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That will never happen. He will be closely monitored for years and will no doubt have a plan drawn up for his mental health requirements. You could punish him with a custodial sentence but that is no guarantee that he will be a better person when he comes out. It may turn him into an institutionalised habitual and violent offender. It's impossible to taylor punishment to the requirements of individual victims as some would be prepared to forgive whilst others would demand the death penalty.

The emphasis should be on ensuring, as far as is possible, that the kid grows up into an adult who can contribute, and not be a threat to society.
 
Nero said:
You were quickly asking about justice for the families. Mob mentality was the wrong description, but suggesting retribution against a 12 year old kid, is not how Finland has traditionally approached things.
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Why are you and Corcaigh trying to attribute words to me that I never used?

"Revenge", "retribution", "mob mentality" - I haven't suggested any of those things.
 
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