Dentists

I have just very recently (yesterday in fact), completed a course of treatment. Namely 2 crowns to my front two teeth. These were replacement crows originally done on the NHS. One of the crowns broke due to an accident.
If I had gone to my regular NHS dentist I would be waiting for months for the treatment so I opted to go private. The cost difference was that going private was around 3 times as much.
However, the care received, materials used, attention to detail with colour matching and 3d scan of my mouth (no old fashioned impression gel stuff) was huge. The shape of my new teeth are radically different to the ones removed / broken. The old ones looked almost like 'off the shelf' items. The new ones are brilliant and look 10 times more natural. I went to Queensway in Billingham.

I know the materials used are better as I personally know a dentist who has told me such.

Total cost £2500 ish. No way I have this kind of money sitting around. So to answer the original question - I took out finance with the private dentist. Paying off interest free over 12 months. 2, 3 and 4 year options were available but with added interest.

NHS dentists will also offer payment plans. I did this for my son who wanted braces. NHS dentist deemed it non-essential so had to get them done privately - at the same dentist!

Not 100% sure but I think there is a threshold cost that you can pay for monthly. i.e. once the cost is above say £300 - you can pay on finance.

Our new dentist member on the forum may be able to offer further clarity.
 
Anton_Berg said:
If the current contract is wrong, what about the contract it superceded. You were guaranteed to need fillings after every check-up. When they changed the contract it was check-up after check-up with no treatment deemed necessary. Or maybe that was only my experience.
And why are they doing check-ups at all whilst there's a backlog of work?
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I qualified in 2009, so no direct experience of the old contract.

There are too many variables to comment accurately on it. E.g. better paste, brushes, understanding and education, diet (generally), attitude (acceptance of dental problems being inevitable), new materials (fissure sealants for early holes for example) etc etc

However, it’s hard to argue that the ‘fee per item’ system could encourage over treatment in the unscrupulous. However I would hope they were in the minority and that the reasons I’ve stated above account for most of it.

Also, we need to do a checkup to know what work needs carrying out.
 
parmoboy said:
I would like some advice regarding paying for dental treatment.

I've never needed dental treament aside from fillings in the past, however at my last appointment I was told that I would need a crown fitting onto one of my front teeth. My dentist also told me that on my next visit he will create a dental model of my teeth, so that he can get an accurate replication of my teeth, and gain a better understanding of what treatment will be required.

Several of my teeth are badly damaged due to acid erosion (I suffer from acid reflux but foolishly used to drink a lot of fizzy drinks) and may require crowns to be fitted, or possibly composite bonding, I'm not sure yet what my dentist will suggest.

Would I be able to get this treatment done by an NHS dentist, or is it likely I will have to accept paying over the odds to get it done privately?
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I’m obviously not keen on giving specific advice without seeing a patient myself. So I’ll just make a general point.

Again, to stress, I am 100% nhs, but also a realist.

‘Paying over the odds’ for private care is the wrong way to look at it. You are not paying more for the same thing at all. Not to do the NHS service down to much (that would take to long) but they are entirely different beasts.

You are getting better materials (the variety in price and quality is huge), a better lab using better materials, likely a more qualified clinical, and the most important variable: more time.

If it’s your front teeth, and you can afford it. Do it once and do it properly and go private.
 
BorrisiaTeeth said:
I’m obviously not keen on giving specific advice without seeing a patient myself. So I’ll just make a general point.

Again, to stress, I am 100% nhs, but also a realist.

‘Paying over the odds’ for private care is the wrong way to look at it. You are not paying more for the same thing at all. Not to do the NHS service down to much (that would take to long) but they are entirely different beasts.

You are getting better materials (the variety in price and quality is huge), a better lab using better materials, likely a more qualified clinical, and the most important variable: more time.

If it’s your front teeth, and you can afford it. Do it once and do it properly and go private.
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Exactly my sentiment. Its a shame that it is this way, but here we are.
 
BorrisiaTeeth said:
I’m obviously not keen on giving specific advice without seeing a patient myself. So I’ll just make a general point.

Again, to stress, I am 100% nhs, but also a realist.

‘Paying over the odds’ for private care is the wrong way to look at it. You are not paying more for the same thing at all. Not to do the NHS service down to much (that would take to long) but they are entirely different beasts.

You are getting better materials (the variety in price and quality is huge), a better lab using better materials, likely a more qualified clinical, and the most important variable: more time.

If it’s your front teeth, and you can afford it. Do it once and do it properly and go private.
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To further expand on my experience of the private practice..... The technician showed me around the lab where they make the crowns (and other implants etc) after I showed an interest in the 3D modelling aspect of the procedure (I create 3D engineering models in my day job).

There was a small team of 'designers' working on computers designing the teeth and next door was the 3d printers, cad cam machines etc. Very impressive. It gave you an appreciation of where your money goes.
 
BorrisiaTeeth said:
I completely agree, hence being 100% NHS In a high needs area for 13 years. After all, they trained me!

The current contract and system is the problem. It’s entirely target driven, and I think target driven health care is an oxymoron. This leads to poor treatment, as we basically have to score enough points or get penalised. It makes you look at a patient and think ‘how do I get the most points out of them?’ Rather than what is best.

Also, if you go over your target, you receive no extra funding. Hence nobody taking on and offering private as an alternative. If I hit my target by Jan, I get paid zero for what I do feb and March until the new tax year. Hence we try to keep our books at a point where you hit the target bang on. There is no incentive whatsoever for taking on new nhs patients.
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So what is your profession doing about it, and what system do they think is best for both dentists and patients?Are they lobbying the govt or does the private model appeal to them most anyway?

BTW while you're here if you don't mind!.....I went for NHS check up yesterday and a new NHS dentist I'd never seen before said there's nothing for him to do but said I needed to to see the hygienist and reception would give me an appointment and it would cost £65.20. So back at reception they gave me an appointmentI (November!) and at the same time the receptionist asked me to pay £23.80 so I didn't protest to pay more. Does Band 1 cover whatever hygienist does as well and the dentist gave me duff info or will I have to pay the difference between the 2 ie £41.40 or pay £65.20 when I see hygienist?
 
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kuepper said:
So what is your profession doing about it, and what system do they think is best for both dentists and patients?Are they lobbying the govt or does the private model appeal to them most anyway?

BTW while you're here if you don't mind!.....I went for NHS check up yesterday and a new NHS dentist I'd never seen before said there's nothing for him to do but said I needed to to see the hygienist and reception would give me an appointment and it would cost £65.20. So back at reception they gave me an appointmentI (November!) and at the same time the receptionist asked me to pay £23.80 so I didn't protest to pay more. Does Band 1 cover whatever hygienist does as well and the dentist gave me duff info or will I have to pay the difference between the 2 ie £41.40 or pay £65.20 when I see hygienistits
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The first point is difficult to explain without rambling. We are not unionised. We also exist in a weird position where we work as self employed subcontractors to the nhs, without being actually part of it. We are currently understaffed, underfunded, and working on target driven health care which in itself is an oxymoron.

The second point kind of links to the conversation about the previous points regarding the past contract rewarding over treatment, and the current rewarding under treatment. I.e. the dentist stands to make a relative loss for you having a longer appointment for a ‘deep clean’ - so, again with the caveat that I have never seen your teeth. If that’s what they recomend, they are probably making a relative loss saying that, so it’s probably genuin. £65 total and do it.
 
Had a couple of teeth out this morning, well and truly feeling sorry for myself.

How long until it starts to ease off a bit, anyone with any experience?
 
TheYorkshireTerrier said:
Had a couple of teeth out this morning, well and truly feeling sorry for myself.

How long until it starts to ease off a bit, anyone with any experience?
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Very much depends on which teeth, how deep the roots were, how much "effort" he had to put in to get them out etc

A simple incisor should be quite quick to get over - a couple of deep molars and it could be a few days.
 
Anyone had any joy in registering with a dentist in Middlesbrough recently? My wife is in the same situation as the OP, and can't get in anywhere, not even as an emergency appointment.
 
Malaguena said:
Very much depends on which teeth, how deep the roots were, how much "effort" he had to put in to get them out etc

A simple incisor should be quite quick to get over - a couple of deep molars and it could be a few days.
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Couple of bottom back teeth, one of them took a bit more 'force'.

Had to get stitches as well.
 
In a nutshell nhs dentistry is so under resourced you need to go private and pay a monthly fee. Quite ridiculous but 100 percent what the tories want similarly to routine ops where your choice is wait years or pay for yours privately or have health insurance. Sad thing is i cant see labour reversing the push towards health and dental insurance through investing more in the nhs
 
uncle_rico said:
Anyone had any joy in registering with a dentist in Middlesbrough recently? My wife is in the same situation as the OP, and can't get in anywhere, not even as an emergency appointment.
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I got taken off my dentist without them telling me so I rang NHS 111 and they found a dentist taking on NHS patients in Redcar so I go there now. Not sure if they still taking on.

Try giving NHS 111 a ring and see if they can find out for you.
 
TheYorkshireTerrier said:
Couple of bottom back teeth, one of them took a bit more 'force'.

Had to get stitches as well.
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The Tuesday before Easter, my wife started getting toothache in one her crowns. She called up her NHS dentist and was told he was on holiday but they managed to get her booked in with another one nearby. This dentist seemed more preoccupied in telling her how he didn't do many NHS patients and concentrated more on private. He looked in her mouth and said it was an infection and gave her antibiotics (she is allergic to Penicillin). Over the next few days the pain got so bad that at 3am in the morning she phoned 111 and got an emergency appointment on Easter Saturday.
The emergency dentist took one look at the tooth and said "lets take it out" to which my wife just said "please" and started crying. It took about 25 minutes for him to get the tooth out, using equipment which I would later see at Warwick Castle dungeon torture chamber. He eventually got all the pieces out and said that she would feel like she had been punched repeatedly in the mouth. She felt a bit better and we went off to Warwick on Easter Monday. On the Wednesday she was still in pain so we had to go to another emergency dentist in Leamington Spa who took x-rays, diagnosed a dry socket and prescribed some serious antibiotics (the ones where you cannot even have mouthwash or any amount of alcohol).
That was Wednesday 12th April and it was only yesterday that she said she was feeling some semblance of normality.

Personally I think the original dentist wasn't too fussed on seeing an NHS patient and fobbed her off with anti-biotics rather than extracting the tooth himself.
 
Fat_Dragon said:
I got taken off my dentist without them telling me so I rang NHS 111 and they found a dentist taking on NHS patients in Redcar so I go there now. Not sure if they still taking on.

Try giving NHS 111 a ring and see if they can find out for you.
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Thanks, she's tried that and the nearest one taking on NHS patients is Barnard Castle! Most round here are taking on private patients though 😐
 
My teeth are badly worn down due to my fondness for fizzy drinks back in the day, which I hugely regret now.

At my last appointment my dentist mentioned that my teeth were "overerupted" and I think he said he could open up my bite, add a composite stop to increase height and then possibly crown them but he said it's going to be difficult to treat and his main concern was how it would affect my bite. He said I may have to be refereed to a specialist.

I should have asked more questions in hindsight as thinking about it now I'm not sure whether he was suggesting crowning all of my teeth, but either way I can imagine the cost will be extortionate.
 
Even though it's not ideal, going private is the way forward. Do your research on good dentists and you get a much better service. The NHS just try and get as many patients through the door in a day but with private they see a smaller amount of patients and you have a much better experience when you're there. Obviously private has the downside of price but like me if you're not great at seeing the dentist it's worth the money.
 
My dentist took me off their list over a year ago. I don’t like the dentist and look after my teeth the best I can, but haven’t had a check up for a few years. I do have old fillings though. I lost a large filling about 10 months ago, which made up half of one of my back teeth. I can’t get taken on by anyone and although not in pain, I have a sharp half tooth which is really annoying .
 
hewielewie said:
The Tuesday before Easter, my wife started getting toothache in one her crowns. She called up her NHS dentist and was told he was on holiday but they managed to get her booked in with another one nearby. This dentist seemed more preoccupied in telling her how he didn't do many NHS patients and concentrated more on private. He looked in her mouth and said it was an infection and gave her antibiotics (she is allergic to Penicillin). Over the next few days the pain got so bad that at 3am in the morning she phoned 111 and got an emergency appointment on Easter Saturday.
The emergency dentist took one look at the tooth and said "lets take it out" to which my wife just said "please" and started crying. It took about 25 minutes for him to get the tooth out, using equipment which I would later see at Warwick Castle dungeon torture chamber. He eventually got all the pieces out and said that she would feel like she had been punched repeatedly in the mouth. She felt a bit better and we went off to Warwick on Easter Monday. On the Wednesday she was still in pain so we had to go to another emergency dentist in Leamington Spa who took x-rays, diagnosed a dry socket and prescribed some serious antibiotics (the ones where you cannot even have mouthwash or any amount of alcohol).
That was Wednesday 12th April and it was only yesterday that she said she was feeling some semblance of normality.

Personally I think the original dentist wasn't too fussed on seeing an NHS patient and fobbed her off with anti-biotics rather than extracting the tooth himself.
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My worry is getting a dry socket as well, the dentist didn’t mention this to me but I’ve been reading about it since you mentioned it. I had a lot of bleeding during the extraction, it seems to calmed down now but I’m worried about knocking it.

Just about muscled up the courage to have a small yoghurt and a slurp of water to wash some Ibuprofen down.
 
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