de Kock refuses to take the knee

Wiseman_Vaughn said:
Do you think he's "seen the light" and believes in the cause or has he realised that this may jepordise his career and income.

At least he's being seen to do th right thing - whatever he believes.
Click to expand...
Surely it explains that in the link. (A good read by the way). Also mentions that he's from a mixed race family.
 
Unravel_Morrison said:
We may find out what has happened behind the scenes or we might not, but it seems like a positive outcome has come from this in a similar fashion to what happened over the summer in this country with football fans.

His side won the match he missed out on so there's little or no harm there and he can drop back in now.
Click to expand...
Doesn't he kind of explain that in his statement? Thought it was a good read, and thought he made some good points.
 
Muttley said:
Good to hear, not everyone is capable of admitting when they are wrong. Well done QdK.
Click to expand...
I thought it was a very good statement. Seemed like he apologised for any hurt or misunderstanding that he caused, without necessarily apologising for not agreeing with being 'told' he had to [take the knee], which seemed fair enough. Seemed like a pretty genuine statement.

Funnily enough, by refusing to, and then agreeing to, it probably highlights the campaign/issues more, and might do more benefit than if he'd just done it quietly in the first place.
 
I'd probably have more 'respect' for him if he stuck to his principles. I very much doubt he's 'seen the light' and changed his mind as to why he didn't do it.

I imagine it's the threat of not playing for his country again and probably more so losing sponsorship deals and maybe not been selected for the IPL/Big bash and the 100 (if you consider how much sky put into the racism message).

He clearly has his reasons. I read an interesting artical about how he's done plenty of work in and around the South African projects (slums) and donated thousands.

I doubt it's as simplistic as that he's not taking the knee so he's racist. Absolutely no context and growing up in South Africa is clearly a whole different ball game (excuse the pun) as over here.

I'm not sure how it 'improves' things when he starts taking the knee. You just know he's doing it despite not wanting too.

Although as a purely sporting note its a bonus. One of the best T20 players in the world.
 
S7DiscoDown said:
I'd probably have more 'respect' for him if he stuck to his principles. I very much doubt he's 'seen the light' and changed his mind as to why he didn't do it.

I imagine it's the threat of not playing for his country again and probably more so losing sponsorship deals and maybe not been selected for the IPL/Big bash and the 100 (if you consider how much sky put into the racism message).

He clearly has his reasons. I read an interesting artical about how he's done plenty of work in and around the South African projects (slums) and donated thousands.

I doubt it's as simplistic as that he's not taking the knee so he's racist. Absolutely no context and growing up in South Africa is clearly a whole different ball game (excuse the pun) as over here.

I'm not sure how it 'improves' things when he starts taking the knee. You just know he's doing it despite not wanting too.

Although as a purely sporting note its a bonus. One of the best T20 players in the world.
Click to expand...
Looks to me like he didn't understand the message behind taking the knee fully.?
Maybe the captain has explained why its important to them? And in reflection he's had a change of mind.
There's a good few who don't understand or don't want to
 
jam69 said:
Looks to me like he didn't understand the message behind taking the knee fully.?
Maybe the captain has explained why its important to them? And in reflection he's had a change of mind.
There's a good few who don't understand or don't want to
Click to expand...
I find it stunning if a white captain who's lived in South Africa all his life didn't 'understand'.

It's pretty crazy if he didn't. I think it's more he didn't understand the full implications of his actions (financially).

Oh well he's said sorry and nothing else more he can do. I don't think it's a giver that he will come back straight in. Definitely a bonus for England if he doesn't.
 
Cuthbert said:
Surely it explains that in the link. (A good read by the way). Also mentions that he's from a mixed race family.
Click to expand...
Yes, I read the article. He as been asked to take the knee to follow the CSA directive - without that, he would not have taken the knee.

BTW: I was not insinuating that he was a racist - He clearly isn't.

He either takes the knee or he leaves - but that would have an impact on his career.
 
Its not just taking the knee he was opposed to. It was any gesture of anti-racism. The south african team were previously given a choice. Some took the knee, some stood to attention, some raised a fist. Only de kock did nothing.

So his excuse of "I didnt like being told what to do" doesnt wash with me. He was previously given a choice and his choice was not to make a gesture in support of anti-racism. So what was his reason that time then?

He has previously worn pink in support of breast cancer so hes not opposed to public gestures in support of causes. Just this one apparently.

I dont think he's a racist mind. I think he's probably just a bit of an idiot who has possibly been watching a reading some dubious stuff on social media.
 
It is clear he has been manipulated into a partial apology and to agreeing to take the knee.
It should be individual choice whether to, or not and there should no penalty for not doing so.
 
indeedido said:
It is clear he has been manipulated into a partial apology and to agreeing to take the knee.
Click to expand...
How is it clear he's been manipulated? Rubbish.
In the same way he had a choice to not take the knee he also has a choice to take the knee.
And also the freedom to change his mind.
Sorry that it doesn't fit your own agenda.
 
indeedido said:
It is clear he has been manipulated into a partial apology and to agreeing to take the knee.
It should be individual choice whether to, or not and there should no penalty for not doing so.
Click to expand...
I don't think it's that clear; we don't know what discussions have been undertaken.
 
zzzzz said:
How is it clear he's been manipulated? Rubbish.
In the same way he had a choice to not take the knee he also has a choice to take the knee.
And also the freedom to change his mind.
Sorry that it doesn't fit your own agenda.
Click to expand...
I don't have an "agenda" zzzz.
I have been absolutely consistent in what I have posted and de Kock's statement made clear why he resented being forced to make the gesture.
That is the issue here: being forced to make a gesture to prove sincerity...and being issued with an "or else".
 
indeedido said:
It is clear he has been manipulated into a partial apology and to agreeing to take the knee.
It should be individual choice whether to, or not and there should no penalty for not doing so.
Click to expand...
I agree. Cricket South Africa have been exceptionally high-handed in obliging their players to take the knee and informing them en route to a match. They have now devalued the gesture globally - there will always be a question mark; are players being forced to take the knee?
 
indeedido said:
I don't have an "agenda" zzzz.
I have been absolutely consistent in what I have posted and de Kock's statement made clear why he resented being forced to make the gesture.
That is the issue here: being forced to make a gesture to prove sincerity...and being issued with an "or else".
Click to expand...

so why did he previously not make an anti racism gesture when it wasn't being mandated?
 
Unravel_Morrison said:
I don't think it's that clear; we don't know what discussions have been undertaken.
Click to expand...

I think it is clear.

He's went from never taking the knee before matches, outright withdrawing from a match because he was being obligated to do so, to now saying he's happy to take the knee and is sorry for the offence.

He didn't take the knee before it was mandatory, so he can't say it was just because he resented it becoming mandatory and now he's done a complete 180.

I don't think it should be mandatory as it completely defeats the purpose of it, so I'd criticise the South African cricket board for that, especially with the sudden change, but de Kock has not come out of thus looking good.

I don't believe he was daft enough to not know what the gesture was about or realise how it looked with him refusing to do it, I just think he underestimated the huge backlash he'd receive for refusing and withdrawing.

His apparent reason for not wanting to do it was because he resented having to prove he wasn't racist, which is bizarre to me and doesn't explain why he'd take such a drastic stance as refusing to play rather than do a few seconds of a symbolic gesture.
 
Dear me, he refused he is a racist he apologises and complies and he is a greedy racist. Got it fellas. Thanks for the insight on a man who's step mother is black and his 2 half sisters are mixed race.

You really shouldn't be making assumptions like this about a man you know absolutely nothing about.
 
Laughing said:
Dear me, he refused he is a racist he apologises and complies and he is a greedy racist. Got it fellas. Thanks for the insight on a man who's step mother is black and his 2 half sisters are mixed race.

You really shouldn't be making assumptions like this about a man you know absolutely nothing about.
Click to expand...

I've never said he's racist, I just think he's daft.
I just don't believe for a second that he's had a sudden epiphany over why he should be taking the knee.
He's doing it because of the huge backlash.

His step-mother and siblings being black only makes his initial decision even stranger.
 
Laughing said:
Dear me, he refused he is a racist he apologises and complies and he is a greedy racist. Got it fellas. Thanks for the insight on a man who's step mother is black and his 2 half sisters are mixed race.

You really shouldn't be making assumptions like this about a man you know absolutely nothing about.
Click to expand...

Could be wrong but I've not seen anyone say he is definitely a racist? I've seen a couple question his reasoning and clarify they don't think he is a racist though.

I don't think he is, but the reason he's given doesn't quite add up. That's my opinion if that's ok with you?

Oh and it's quite possible to have black friends and family and be a racist you know.

(Although, just to be clear, I don't think he is).
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top