The_Lizards_Jumpers
Well-known member
My point was you seem unable to hear any criticism of them, without jumping to a robust defence.
Blur at the BBC
- Thread starter king_hellfire
- Start date
My point was you seem unable to hear any criticism of them, without jumping to a robust defence.
BoroMart
Well-known member
He's effectively a guitar for hire these days.
Of course. I'm not anti-oasis, but I see in retrospect how so much of the noise about them was PR and they were really really limited. They were elevated above their talent by being at the right place at the right time.
They were the blueprint for Coldplay, two good albums followed by decades of largely mediocre rubbish. The only discernable difference is that Chris Martin was trying really hard to evolve and improve his songwriting and failing, while Noel was trying really hard to stay the same, rinse and repeat and failing.
Neither are terrible, neither are ground breaking, both had their moments in the sun and have now over stayed their welcome to a degree.
Back to Blur, they've successfully managed to improve themselves over the decades and Albarn has had successes in other genres and projects too.
atypical_boro
Well-known member
Who is?
Smith and Pet Shop Boys have recently remixed his solo tracks for him.
Black Keys asked him to write songs with them. The albums isn’t released yet.
I fully accept your opinion in the final paragraph. I just don’t agree with it, or that they have outstayed their welcome anymore than Blur. I mean, they didn’t stay together and haven’t reformed (twice) either.
atypical_boro
Well-known member
There has been criticism of them in this thread, I’ve “heard” it all, and disagreed with some of it. I’ve criticised some aspects of Oasis myself too.
Others are allowed their opinions just as much as I am, as I’ve repeatedly said “in my opinion.” It’s a thread about musical opinion and blur/oasis isn’t it?
I will make a robust defence if there’s one to be made though. As I say, I’m probably what you’d call an “expert” on Oasis, so whilst I certainly won’t try and change other people’s opinions if they don’t like them, I will make it known if I can see any fallacy involved. For example, the point about Noel’s peers not respecting him. There’s very little evidence for that and I think that’s worth saying.
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BoroMart
Well-known member
There’s lots of evidence for it. Now there’s an argument that it’s the abrasive personalities of the Gallagher’s that mean lots of artists dislike oasis, but that just balances out the commercial success being partly derived from their abrasive personalities
Attachments
atypical_boro
Well-known member
Ok. Well Paul has invited Noel on stage a number of times since then, including this year, so he appears to have changed his mind in the last 26 years.
Not sure of the other quotes. One of them said they really like Take That, the other is from 1995 and claims Oasis are loved by the middle classes. It’s an outdated view if nothing else.
I could list all the people who’ve worked with and/or praised Noel over the last 30 years if that is of any interest? I mean I’m not saying that no musicians at all dislike Noel (Robbie Williams for example), but to say he doesn’t have the respect of his peers is an outlandish claim mate.
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The_Lizards_Jumpers
Well-known member
One of the most talented and innovative artists of the last 30 years, Jay Z, has little time for Gallagher especially after the Burnage gobshites comments about him headlining Glastonbury.
For someone with a limited amount of talent, which fair play to him he's made the most of, Gallagher does tend to have a lot to say about other musicians - almost like he stays relevant by badmouthing others. Although to be fair to him I agree with his comments on Sleaford Mods who make Oasis look like Beethoven.
Noel Gallagher: How 13 Musicians Responded To Searing Put-Downs From The Former Oasis Man
No one’s safe from Noel Gallagher’s caustic sense of humour. But how do you respond to a searing insult from the Oasis man? Here’s 13 artists’ shots back at Gallagher… Kaiser Chiefs Kaiser Chiefs: “They play dress-up and sit on top of an apex of meaninglessness,” said Noel in 2008. “They don’t...
www.nme.com
atypical_boro
Well-known member
Yeah there are definitely one or two famous critics of Noel. Jay-Z, along with Robbie Williams, and a couple of others.One of the most talented and innovative artists of the last 30 years, Jay Z, has little time for Gallagher especially after the Burnage gobshites comments about him headlining Glastonbury.
For someone with a limited amount of talent, which fair play to him he's made the most of, Gallagher does tend to have a lot to say about other musicians - almost like he stays relevant by badmouthing others. Although to be fair to him I agree with his comments on Sleaford Mods who make Oasis look like Beethoven.
Noel Gallagher: How 13 Musicians Responded To Searing Put-Downs From The Former Oasis Man
No one’s safe from Noel Gallagher’s caustic sense of humour. But how do you respond to a searing insult from the Oasis man? Here’s 13 artists’ shots back at Gallagher… Kaiser Chiefs Kaiser Chiefs: “They play dress-up and sit on top of an apex of meaninglessness,” said Noel in 2008. “They don’t...
The list of those “against” is dwarfed by the list of those “for” however. And it’s debatable whether you’d even call Jay-z a “peer”, given he’s basically a rapper, and not one whose universally respected by the pioneers of the genre (Ice Cube really isn’t a fan iirc). Going off on a tangent now like.
BoroMart
Well-known member
It's a view, and a valid one, from superb artists. McCartney may have been on stage with Gallagher, but he knows his limitations. The other quotes have a lot of Mercury Music nominations between them, they're all great artists.
He doesn't have the respect of many of his peers. Others think he's good at the basics. Very few people seem to think he's as godlike a genius as he thinks he is.
Agreed, it's a sign of someone desperate for relevance but really stuck with deep seated inadequacies.
atypical_boro
Well-known member
Fine, so is mine. I doubt we’ll ever agree, that’s also fine with me. Probably not worth spending all day looking for examples that prove the other “wrong” (it’s subjective anyway). But in my view, and from everything I’ve read and heard, he is hugely respected by some of the greatest artists of all time.
atypical_boro
Well-known member
I’d have to watch Live Forever back, Damon came across as totally bitter and snobby in it, and yes, pretentious. He has, admittedly, become more at one with the situation since.
BoroMart
Well-known member
To be fair he was probably off it on heroin or somthing at that time. But if we are talking about the music, in what way is Blur's music pretentious, which is I believe your opening gambit on this?
atypical_boro
Well-known member
Ha ok.
Noel was probably coked up when he did and said all those daft things about other artists though, so maybe they shouldn’t count either.
I think we should just agree to disagree at this point. Nobody is for turning, clearly.
BoroMart
Well-known member
It's not about 'for turning', it's purely about we all have views, and the best views are ones that can be explored and discussed, with evidence for that view. That's why I asked about the 'pretentious' jibe at Blur's music.
NoloBoro
Well-known member
I saw Oasis at the town hall, they were supported by Ocean Colour Scene, Oasis were really good that night, OCS were infinitely better.
I bought Definitely Maybe at the time, I think it’s still a good album, but a collection of cloned songs that’s where they should’ve left it. Everything since has been average at best.
Whereas, Blur are just better, full stop. They are musically light years ahead of Oasis, but they are a different type of band.
Parklife is a great album, timeless and incredibly clever, loved The great Escape is also fantastic.
But, Song 2 irritates the **** out of me, as does Country House. I love Badhead, this is a low, The universal and many others.
When I listen to Oasis now, the energy in the first album was incredible but I can’t help thinking now, as I’m older that I’d heard all the songs before, they were riff magpies. Also they are a pair of *****.
I bought Definitely Maybe at the time, I think it’s still a good album, but a collection of cloned songs that’s where they should’ve left it. Everything since has been average at best.
Whereas, Blur are just better, full stop. They are musically light years ahead of Oasis, but they are a different type of band.
Parklife is a great album, timeless and incredibly clever, loved The great Escape is also fantastic.
But, Song 2 irritates the **** out of me, as does Country House. I love Badhead, this is a low, The universal and many others.
When I listen to Oasis now, the energy in the first album was incredible but I can’t help thinking now, as I’m older that I’d heard all the songs before, they were riff magpies. Also they are a pair of *****.