Ben White

[equaliser]

The guy probably doesn’t want to be away from home for weeks on end with a bunch of blokes he may not know very well knowing the main reason he would want to be there is probably not going to happen and he he’d rather spend his holidays doing something he would enjoy more.Fair play to him it also gives somebody else a chance.

This is what it boils down to, I reckon. Imagine three or four weeks in the soulless utopia of Qatar stuck in the company of twenty odd young men - none of whom has ever read a book - that you were obliged to be 'mates' with. "Oi Ben, c'mon, it's 'Arry's darts tournament - second round!". Plus, you're pretty sure you're not going to get a game while you're there - maybe get a 10-minute run-out in a dead fixture.
You can understand why a young multi-millionaire would decide not to bother.

 

[exeterboro]

If Southgate had no commented it to the press it would have kept rumbling on and on.

Has it disappeared, it seems more in the press than it was ever before. Which you didn't need a crystal ball to see, once GS spoke out, there was something tangible for the press to sink their fangs into.

Ben White does not have a right to privacy about why he has not been selected.

You will find he does, it's just not likely to be tested in a court of law to confirm it.

But ultimately it’s because Ben Whites been a prat and leaked out that it’s all Steve Holland fault. Southgate chose to protect the integrity of his coaching staff above a whiny player.

I get this bit, but you can't even say it's BW who is being whiny by talking talking to the press, whatever was said by the coaching staff was said in front of the other players, anyone could have leaked it, which looking at recent court cases may not even be just the players who are talking to the press.
It's been badly handled by GS, there seems a level of dislike and frustration now towards BW( just read the bulk of comments in this thread as an example and the terminology being used to describe him), GS would have been better off doing his job properly and not divulging the background, this now seems to fully close the door on BW under GS reign no matter what GS says about that door being still open, the public knowledge of the situation will make any appearance by BW in the English team setup a bit of a un welcomed sideshow.

 

[Colgates_shaving_foam]

Has it disappeared, it seems more in the press than it was ever before. Which you didn't need a crystal ball to see, once GS spoke out, there was something tangible for the press to sink their fangs into.
You will find he does, it's just not likely to be tested in a court of law to confirm it.
I get this bit, but you can't even say it's BW who is being whiny by talking talking to the press, whatever was said by the coaching staff was said in front of the other players, anyone could have leaked it, which looking at recent court cases may not even be just the players who are talking to the press.
It's been badly handled by GS, there seems a level of dislike and frustration now towards BW( just read the bulk of comments in this thread as an example and the terminology being used to describe him), GS would have been better off doing his job properly and not divulging the background, this now seems to fully close the door on BW under GS reign no matter what GS says about that door being still open, the public knowledge of the situation will make any appearance by BW in the English team setup a bit of a un welcomed sideshow.

The difference now is that the attention is on Ben White where as if Southgate had said bo comment the focus would be on Southgate. The focus should clearly be on BW so this has worked correctly.

On the privacy thing, BW has a right to privacy about medical or personal conditions but the manager is able to disclose their reasonings behind squad selection. Otherwise a media conference wouldn't be allowed would it?

So Gareth, why have you added Mainoo into the squad? Sorry it's a private matter.

Wouldn't work would it?

 

[BoroMart]

The guy probably doesn’t want to be away from home for weeks on end with a bunch of blokes he may not know very well knowing the main reason he would want to be there is probably not going to happen and he he’d rather spend his holidays doing something he would enjoy more.Fair play to him it also gives somebody else a chance.

that sounds highly entitled, like he must play because he's great....With that attitude you wonder why he ever decided to be a pro, because through your journey you are always striving to achieve a better position at the club you are at...or indeed move to another club. I'm sure Ben White won't have grown up dreaming of playing for Newport County on loan. But it was part of the journey to become a prem player. Same with england, part of the journey is appearing for friendlies, showing up for training with a positive and professional attitude, learning and waiting for your first team chance.......he doesn't seem mentally strong enough to do that, just presumes he should play. so it's probably right he isn't in the squad.

 

[LaPennaBianca]

This is what it boils down to, I reckon. Imagine three or four weeks in the soulless utopia of Qatar stuck in the company of twenty odd young men - none of whom has ever read a book - that you were obliged to be 'mates' with. "Oi Ben, c'mon, it's 'Arry's darts tournament - second round!". Plus, you're pretty sure you're not going to get a game while you're there - maybe get a 10-minute run-out in a dead fixture.
You can understand why a young multi-millionaire would decide not to bother.

You're vastly overestimating Ben 'Love Island' White as an intellect here.

 

[BoroMart]

You will find he does, it's just not likely to be tested in a court of law to confirm it.

No chance, unless it's medical then there is nothing in law that states that southgate can't give out details. Free speech.

 

[BoroMart]

This is what it boils down to, I reckon. Imagine three or four weeks in the soulless utopia of Qatar stuck in the company of twenty odd young men - none of whom has ever read a book - that you were obliged to be 'mates' with. "Oi Ben, c'mon, it's 'Arry's darts tournament - second round!". Plus, you're pretty sure you're not going to get a game while you're there - maybe get a 10-minute run-out in a dead fixture.
You can understand why a young multi-millionaire would decide not to bother.

I'd cook and eat my dog, for a 1 minute run out at a world cup for my country. Footballers are assessed in 4 quadrants:

1. physical, 2. technical and tactical......Ben is strong in these two.
3. psychological and 4. social.....Ben is weak in these.

He isn't up for the challenge of proving himself better than other RBs or CBs, he isn't a strong social presence that bonds with other people.....which is kind of important and underestimated in a team game. Having had Ravanelli and Boksic we should be well aware of the importance of teh social behaviour of characters and the difficulties of bonding a team.

 

[LaPennaBianca]

You're vastly overestimating Ben 'Love Island' White as an intellect here.

And further to this:

Bukayo Saka has 4 A*s and 3 As in his GCSEs. He's perfectly happy playing darts and mucking about on inflatable unicorns.

 

[equaliser]

You're vastly overestimating Ben 'Love Island' White as an intellect here.

i'm not really talking about his intellect, but he's on record saying he doesn't really like or think about football when he's not at work. Therefore, unlike you, me and the vast majority of footballers, he hasn't grown up with that idea of International recognition as the pinnacle of achievement. It should be clear with his perspective he might find it hard to fit in to a month-long camp of football ultra-focus, where no deviation is expected or encouraged - and then he's going to be on the bench the whole time anyway. It's horses for courses at the end of the day, and he clearly doesn't fit the expected mould.

 

[exeterboro]

On the BBC football website

"Ben White's decision to make him self unavailable for selection for England is understandable, say former Premier League players Nedum Onuoha and Cesc Fabregas.

The Arsenal defender has been in good form this season for his club, helping them to the top of the table and the quarter-finals of the Champions League.

England boss Gareth Southgate said after revealing his squad for the upcoming friendlies with Brazil and Belgium that "White would be in this squad but he's not available to us", adding "it is a great shame".

Speaking on the Planet Premier League podcast, Onuoha said: "I think Ben White in some ways has been good for football because he's made people realise the way we perceive people's aspirations is not always the way that other people do.

"If he doesn't want to play international football, it's not that he doesn't feel he's English or whatever. When he plays for Arsenal, he's in his [own] bed, probably 90% of the of the season you work and then you go home and he can do his own thing. Being away for long periods of time isn't something that's great for everyone."

Ex-Gunners captain Fabregas added: "I think it's the society we live in at the moment. I go back again to what I always say - it's all about the money.

"Footballers get paid a lot of money and it feels like they should all be focusing on footballer no matter what. Be an example for everything and you cannot make mistakes. Every error is being punished double or triple than that of a normal human being. This is the life we are in, the one that we have to accept.

"I know plenty of guys - I will not mention names - that they finish training sessions and they just want to go home because they don't really love football. They love playing football, they really enjoy it, the competition, they're competitors, are winners. They like the moment for this hour and a half, two hours of being there, but after that, they don't watch football. They don't want anything to do with football.

"It is not something that happens very often. Maybe only 5% of the players are like that, but it is what it is and we need to respect it."

 

[1finny]

At least Ben is being honest - fair play. It's his choice.

Some others pretend to be injured during friendlies and just pitch up for the big games

 

[Colgates_shaving_foam]

On the BBC football website

"Ben White's decision to make him self unavailable for selection for England is understandable, say former Premier League players Nedum Onuoha and Cesc Fabregas.

The Arsenal defender has been in good form this season for his club, helping them to the top of the table and the quarter-finals of the Champions League.

England boss Gareth Southgate said after revealing his squad for the upcoming friendlies with Brazil and Belgium that "White would be in this squad but he's not available to us", adding "it is a great shame".

Speaking on the Planet Premier League podcast, Onuoha said: "I think Ben White in some ways has been good for football because he's made people realise the way we perceive people's aspirations is not always the way that other people do.

"If he doesn't want to play international football, it's not that he doesn't feel he's English or whatever. When he plays for Arsenal, he's in his [own] bed, probably 90% of the of the season you work and then you go home and he can do his own thing. Being away for long periods of time isn't something that's great for everyone."

Ex-Gunners captain Fabregas added: "I think it's the society we live in at the moment. I go back again to what I always say - it's all about the money.

"Footballers get paid a lot of money and it feels like they should all be focusing on footballer no matter what. Be an example for everything and you cannot make mistakes. Every error is being punished double or triple than that of a normal human being. This is the life we are in, the one that we have to accept.

"I know plenty of guys - I will not mention names - that they finish training sessions and they just want to go home because they don't really love football. They love playing football, they really enjoy it, the competition, they're competitors, are winners. They like the moment for this hour and a half, two hours of being there, but after that, they don't watch football. They don't want anything to do with football.

"It is not something that happens very often. Maybe only 5% of the players are like that, but it is what it is and we need to respect it."

That's absolutely fine, no issues with him not wanting to play for England but he should come out and say it rather than trying to put Southgate in an awkward position and hide behind Edu at Arsenal.

Just front up, say you're not interested and it would blow over in the next news cycle.

 

[LaPennaBianca]

i'm not really talking about his intellect, but he's on record saying he doesn't really like or think about football when he's not at work. Therefore, unlike you, me and the vast majority of footballers, he hasn't grown up with that idea of International recognition as the pinnacle of achievement. It should be clear with his perspective he might find it hard to fit in to a month-long camp of football ultra-focus, where no deviation is expected or encouraged - and then he's going to be on the bench the whole time anyway. It's horses for courses at the end of the day, and he clearly doesn't fit the expected mould.

I don't disagree with any of this. But I do take issue with you painting the rest of the squad as nigh on illiterate halfwits. That clearly isn't true.

 

[exeterboro]

That's absolutely fine, no issues with him not wanting to play for England but he should come out and say it rather than trying to put Southgate in an awkward position and hide behind Edu at Arsenal.

Just front up, say you're not interested and it would blow over in the next news cycle.

Back at you, why should he or GS have to say anything , but GS has and it feels like he's done it to point all the focus to BW, maybe I'm being old fashioned but when someone became a manager it was always believed they would take responsibility for situations and not like has been said on here a few times - 'why should he have to field press questions?' Maybe because he took on that responsibility with the job application.

 

[Colgates_shaving_foam]

Back at you, why should he or GS have to say anything , but GS has and it feels like he's done it to point all the focus to BW, maybe I'm being old fashioned but when someone became a manager it was always believed they would take responsibility for situations and not like has been said on here a few times - 'why should he have to field press questions?' Maybe because he took on that responsibility with the job application.

GS has taken responsibility. He has said I would love to select BW but he has made himself unavailable. Honestly what else could GS say?

 

[KDG]

Lets not forget Ben White does not like football - he has spoken many times that he is not a fan of the game and does not watch any games. To him, its his job, he has a career in something he is good at and it ends there.

Perhaps if he was a starter for England he might look at it differently but i suspect he also does not have the interest to fight for a place

That along with this rumoured fall out with Steve Holland.

 

[B_G]

Lets not forget Ben White does not like football - he has spoken many times that he is not a fan of the game and does not watch any games. To him, its his job, he has a career in something he is good at and it ends there.

Perhaps if he was a starter for England he might look at it differently but i suspect he also does not have the interest to fight for a place

That along with this rumoured fall out with Steve Holland.

Maybe if it was a paid role he would be more inclined to make himself available.

Anyway, f*ck him. Select someone who wants to try their best for their country and see it is a privilege.

 

[equaliser]

I don't disagree with any of this. But I do take issue with you painting the rest of the squad as nigh on illiterate halfwits. That clearly isn't true.

Ha, ha. well maybe a bit of hyperbole, but you know what I'm saying. It would be just as bad getting stuck with a load of toffee-nosed tw*ts talking about opera the whole time.

 

[Kilburn]

I think White's position is fair enough. We've had a few similar over the years at Boro. Trevor Putney is one who comes to mind who apparently wasn't interested in the game other than just as a job like any other.

 

[JackG]

Lets not forget Ben White does not like football - he has spoken many times that he is not a fan of the game and does not watch any games. To him, its his job, he has a career in something he is good at and it ends there.

Perhaps if he was a starter for England he might look at it differently but i suspect he also does not have the interest to fight for a place

That along with this rumoured fall out with Steve Holland.

Ben White does like football - he's just not interested in watching it. He very much enjoys playing it at an intensely competitive level, he'll watch recordings to improve his own performance, but he's not bothered about watching for enjoyment.