An apolgy for being hung by the state

Corco65

Corco65

Well-known member
A sad case were an innocent black man was murdered by the state and also the devastating consequences for his family. Sadly racial discrimination still goes on today, and it is as important as ever to keep on challenging it to make sure things like this never happen again.

If you've got a spare 3 minutes an interesting and sad read here.
www.bbc.co.uk

South Wales Police apology 70 years after hanging injustice

Family get apology after wrongful murder conviction and execution of father in British prison.
www.bbc.co.uk


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BLM
 
Tragic case above.
I think we absolutely should have a death penalty though. Some cases never in doubt - Huntley, shipman, creegan etc
 
hewielewie said:
And therein lies the problem.

All convictions are beyond reasonable doubt.
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I agree. That’s why not all cases should be the death penalty.
The burden of proof has changed massively in the last few years. To even have a case at court there has to be a massive amount of overwhelming evidence.
Agree that not all lifers should get death penalty
 
Facefuzz said:
I agree. That’s why not all cases should be the death penalty.
The burden of proof has changed massively in the last few years. To even have a case at court there has to be a massive amount of overwhelming evidence.
Agree that not all lifers should get death penalty
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But where do you draw the line? What is and isn't the death penalty
 
Facefuzz said:
Tragic case above.
I think we absolutely should have a death penalty though. Some cases never in doubt - Huntley, shipman, creegan etc
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Here's a little mental exercise for you. There are ten people in a chamber, you know one of them is innocent, the others are all murderers do you press the button to kill them all? Next room has one hundred people, ninety nine murderers, same question.

This is the nub of capital punishment how many innocent people would you be prepared to kill. Because there will always be some no matter how careful you are.
 
hewielewie said:
But where do you draw the line? What is and isn't the death penalty
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That’s to complicated for me?
Child killers, cop killer, serial killers??
Again, what if there is innocents amongst these.
Maybe there could be an extra burden placed on the evidence for conviction. Is it on cctv and therefore the highest level of least doubt?
I don’t wholly disagree with your reasons for not having it by the way.
I just think people like those listed shouldn’t be on the planet. Spend the money on feeding, educating and heating decent folk.
 
Muttley said:
Here's a little mental exercise for you. There are ten people in a chamber, you know one of them is innocent, the others are all murderers do you press the button to kill them all? Next room has one hundred people, ninety nine murderers, same question.

This is the nub of capital punishment how many innocent people would you be prepared to kill. Because there will always be some no matter how careful you are.
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I dont know, but out of interest how many killers have had their conviction overturned in the last 20 years?
 
Facefuzz said:
how many killers have had their conviction overturned in the last 20 years?
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According to Wiki 4

Barry George was cleared on August 1, 2008, of the 1999 murder of TV presenter Jill Dando
Sam Hallam was wrongly jailed for life in 2005 for the murder of Essayas Kassahun.
Shirley and Lynette Banfield - mother and daughter who were convicted of the murder of their husband/father

But given that over turning murder convictions can take a lot longer than twenty years you can probably expect a few more in due course, in the 90s there were something like 7/8 overturned murder convictions. You need to answer the question how many innocents would you be prepared to kill to remove some murderers "from the planet"?
 
Muttley said:
According to Wiki 4

Barry George was cleared on August 1, 2008, of the 1999 murder of TV presenter Jill Dando
Sam Hallam was wrongly jailed for life in 2005 for the murder of Essayas Kassahun.
Shirley and Lynette Banfield - mother and daughter who were convicted of the murder of their husband/father

But given that over turning murder convictions can take a lot longer than twenty years you can probably expect a few more in due course, in the 90s there were something like 7/8 overturned murder convictions. You need to answer the question how many innocents would you be prepared to kill to remove some murderers "from the planet"?
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If you go back to the 70s and 80s and look in the final column of the list I referred to above you'll also find people who weren't cleared until after 2002. Unless our criminal justice system has miraculously improved there are almost certainly innocents languishing in prison.
 
Muttley said:
According to Wiki 4

Barry George was cleared on August 1, 2008, of the 1999 murder of TV presenter Jill Dando
Sam Hallam was wrongly jailed for life in 2005 for the murder of Essayas Kassahun.
Shirley and Lynette Banfield - mother and daughter who were convicted of the murder of their husband/father

But given that over turning murder convictions can take a lot longer than twenty years you can probably expect a few more in due course, in the 90s there were something like 7/8 overturned murder convictions. You need to answer the question how many innocents would you be prepared to kill to remove some murderers "from the planet"?
Click to expand...
Cheers for results. I meant for the crime committed in the last 20 years. Threshold tests for court were miles lower before the turn of the century.
Also then convictions didn’t rely so much as concrete evidence available now. Digital data. Black and white figures.
Forensics has moved on so fast and the use of dna, and other expert evidence is huge, again, black and white.
When it all adds up with witness accounts etc you have a solid case.

I wouldn’t be prepared for 1 innocent to die for the death penalty to be brought back. Based on evidence I would be happy for Huntley, shipman, creegan, bellfield, Michael Adebolajo and Michael Adebowale to all die today for what they have done (along with others. They are the first to come to mind)
 
Facefuzz said:
Cheers for results. I meant for the crime committed in the last 20 years. Threshold tests for court were miles lower before the turn of the century.
Also then convictions didn’t rely so much as concrete evidence available now. Digital data. Black and white figures.
Forensics has moved on so fast and the use of dna, and other expert evidence is huge, again, black and white.
When it all adds up with witness accounts etc you have a solid case.

I wouldn’t be prepared for 1 innocent to die for the death penalty to be brought back. Based on evidence I would be happy for Huntley, shipman, creegan, bellfield, Michael Adebolajo and Michael Adebowale to all die today for what they have done (along with others. They are the first to come to mind)
Click to expand...
Death is far too good for them
 
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