All the Tories out this morning

Laughing said:
I am not downplaying it BoroMart. It has had a massive impact if you accept that winning an election on the back of social manipulation as massive, regardless of how deep the impact actually was. 1% could be considered massive if swinging an election. The actual individual impact is much lower than you are suggesting. I know this because of multiple studies commissioned by global retailers. It is no where near 10%.

As I have said, people who voted brexit and voted for trump were, largely, not doing so because of media campaigns and targeted ads, it was largely where their politics were to begin with.

There is a definite shift to the right in UK politics, is that social manipulation or is it people being more vocal of their views as it doesn't seem quite as abhorrent as political views shift right. Who knows. I have no numbers to back this up, but I have long held the belief that society is a thin veneer for many people and for a while racists were embarrassed into whispering their beliefs and brexit, perhaps, emboldened them to start talking louder.

I am not arguing with the knub of your point, just the impact it has.
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the reality is neither of us know. What we do know is that they get the data for a smallish set of people 50,000 say, use facebook to find people with matching behaviours and then target them with specific ads and memes and other paid content to manipulate them. Virtually no one will have survived the Brexit fiasco without being subject to a number of these ads, either directly marketed or shared by friends. The attrition of this constant political diatribe works. In the less wealthy, sowing seeds of hate by making a common enemy to project their failings on (be it immigrants, EU parliament, germany or UK Labour MPs who are alleged as submissive and traitorous, this all works in recruiting and manipulating. If you don't think people are being widespread manipulated then you haven't been paying attention. Just how many people think that Corbyn is a terrorist lover, or that the EU made us have straight bananas, huge swathes of the population. In the US its QAnon, 25% of Brits believe QAnon, and it's largely not even targeted at us. That tells you the reach and impact of this stuff.

Brits were not prepositioned to thinking Hillary Clinton and the Dems were part of a deep state, were pedos and ate babies. But studies show that now 25% of us do think that, despite there being ZERO evidence. That's manipulation.
 
BoroMart said:
the reality is neither of us know. What we do know is that they get the data for a smallish set of people 50,000 say, use facebook to find people with matching behaviours and then target them with specific ads and memes and other paid content to manipulate them. Virtually no one will have survived the Brexit fiasco without being subject to a number of these ads, either directly marketed or shared by friends. The attrition of this constant political diatribe works. In the less wealthy, sowing seeds of hate by making a common enemy to project their failings on (be it immigrants, EU parliament, germany or UK Labour MPs who are alleged as submissive and traitorous, this all works in recruiting and manipulating. If you don't think people are being widespread manipulated then you haven't been paying attention. Just how many people think that Corbyn is a terrorist lover, or that the EU made us have straight bananas, huge swathes of the population. In the US its QAnon, 25% of Brits believe QAnon, and it's largely not even targeted at us. That tells you the reach and impact of this stuff.

Brits were not prepositioned to thinking Hillary Clinton and the Dems were part of a deep state, were pedos and ate babies. But studies show that now 25% of us do think that, despite there being ZERO evidence. That's manipulation.
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Have you a link to anything that shows 25% of Brits believe in the QAnon rubbish about the Clinton pedo pizza ring?
 
Misleading to suggest 25%

While 6% of those polled claimed to support QAnon, larger percentages supported broader, linked conspiracies. A quarter (25%) agreed that “secret satanic cults exist and include influential elites”. This rose to 35% among people aged 18-24. A similar proportion (26%) agreed that “elites in Hollywood, politics, the media and other powerful positions” are secretly engaging in large-scale child trafficking and abuse.
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https://www.theguardian.com/us-news...itons-believe-in-qanon-linked-theories-survey
 
There is lots of available data on how audience segmentation and targeted ads effects consumers. I would assume the same would apply to voting intentions.

What consumer data shows is it is extremely difficult to influence someone with a concrete view, as you would expect. Someone who doesn't know, what brand they want, or, the goldmine, how much they want to spend can be influenced much more easily. It is a siding scale.

My point in this thread has always been that the issue is societal and most are very difficult to sway one way or the other. Brexit fed into some peoples pre-existing notions as did "drain the swamp" and "shoot the mexicans".

Yes some voters will be swayed. Interestingly enough one partner is much more likely to be swayed by the other with absolutely minimal effort.

Why did people believe that Corbyn was a jew hating terrorist? It allowed people to salve their conscience and vote in the tories. Very few centrists believed this.

Our society is riddled with self serving amoral racists, unfortunately.
 
Lefty said:
I'd like to see the quality of the survey and do a deeper dive. I'm skeptical, but nothing should surprise me these days.
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I'll try and find it again, I'm skeptical it's as high as that, but I have had discussions with people that claim it to be true. It might be half that, but considering we are not that primary target of that hoax, it's still got traction here.
 
Laughing said:
Why did people believe that Corbyn was a jew hating terrorist? It allowed people to salve their conscience and vote in the tories. Very few centrists believed this.

Our society is riddled with self serving amoral racists, unfortunately.
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I doubt there's anyone who thought that. What they did think is that he spent four years dithering, procrastinating and not dealing with an issue that was highlighted over and over again. Leaders have to be seen to be decisive. Too many times he just came over as a bewildered old bloke arguing about the most trivial things. There was a definition of antisemitism - he spent weeks arguing about not accepting it, and then in the end accepted it. the manifesto was like a Christmas wish list, with new bits added here and there. Considering he - and Labour - were being labelled as spendthrifts, it behoved him to come up with something clearly deliverable and affordable, but he didn't.

If you've got a probation hearing to discuss being late for work, make sure you get to the meeting on time.
 
Oh they really did think that. I know far too many people who believe the IRA spiel and consistently brought it out whenever I tried to discuss him and his merits.
 
Michael_Vronsky said:
Oh they really did think that. I know far too many people who believe the IRA spiel and consistently brought it out whenever I tried to discuss him and his merits.
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Same here. "Voted Labour all my life but I can't vote for that terrorist sympathiser" or " he wants to let any f*cker who wants to come into this country", or "we have enough blackies and pakis already without him letting more in"- so say all (except one) of my drinking buddies, and to my shame, my sister.
The exception is a Scot. He is 74 years old and still working. He tells me that since the Scottish Independence referendum and Brexit referendum he has been told to get back to his own country on a number of occasions by people he works with . He has lived in Teesside since he was 20 and no one has ever said that before to him.
 
Trug said:
Same here. "Voted Labour all my life but I can't vote for that terrorist sympathiser" or " he wants to let any f*cker who wants to come into this country", or "we have enough blackies and pakis already without him letting more in"- so say all (except one) of my drinking buddies, and to my shame, my sister.
The exception is a Scot. He is 74 years old and still working. He tells me that since the Scottish Independence referendum and Brexit referendum he has been told to get back to his own country on a number of occasions by people he works with . He has lived in Teesside since he was 20 and no one has ever said that before to him.
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Yep, happens constantly. And your post sickened me to the core and I know fine well it happens. My wife is from Sri Lanka so we've had it all over the years. If all this ***** is 'getting your country back' then they can stick it. Vile.
 
Michael_Vronsky said:
Yep, happens constantly. And your post sickened me to the core and I know fine well it happens. My wife is from Sri Lanka so we've had it all over the years. If all this ***** is 'getting your country back' then they can stick it. Vile.
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I can see why you are so vocal about this issue, it's very personal to you. Sorry, but not surprised to hear this.
 
Soutra said:
There was a definition of antisemitism - he spent weeks arguing about not accepting it, and then in the end accepted it.
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Another example of people believing any old s**t about Corbyn. He accepted the definition immediately, what he rightly objected to was some of the examples which left room for the conflation of criticism of Israel with that of Judaism.
 
BlindBoyGrunt said:
Another example of people believing any old s**t about Corbyn. He accepted the definition immediately, what he rightly objected to was some of the examples which left room for the conflation of criticism of Israel with that of Judaism.
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exactly, there are a subset of Israeli jews who are supporters of Israeli terror who are purposefully hijacking the fight against anti-semitism and should be ashamed of themselves. There are also some British Tory politicians, who have hijacked that very same and right cause, anti-semitism, and used it as a political tool to bash the opposition, it's pretty gross. It's immoral, but then it's expected from Tory MPs.
 
BoroMart said:
exactly, there are a subset of Israeli jews who are supporters of Israeli terror who are purposefully hijacking the fight against anti-semitism and should be ashamed of themselves. There are also some British Tory politicians, who have hijacked that very same and right cause, anti-semitism, and used it as a political tool to bash the opposition, it's pretty gross. It's immoral, but then it's expected from Tory MPs.
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There were also many TV "personalities" gleefully using the antisemitic argument to attack Corbyn.
People such as Phillip Schofield, Judge Rinder and of course the "I don't look like a typical Jew" Rachel Riley.
 
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